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Versa art RS-640 - First real printing problem

Discussion in 'Roland' started by messmedia, Jun 10, 2010.

  1. messmedia

    messmedia Member

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    Apart my problem with printing on paper few months back - which I decided was a problem with compatibility with media, today I had first real problem with printing on my RS640.

    I printed some signs on MacTac vinyl 829p, and I had something that looked like BANDING, but I am almost sure it WAS NOT BANDING!

    So far, MacTac seemed ok vinyl for print, good colors, good durability and fast drying time (as soon printed part pass the dryer - it is dry on a finger touch). but today it just is not drying that fast.

    Prints had problems in darker parts only, reds - from dark red to light red gradient were ok in lightred part (0 100 100 0) but with these banding lines in dark red part (0 100 100 35). Also, it had some uneven color in darker parts, like when the color is not dry fast enough.

    I tried to rais dry temp to 50, and lover print temp to 35, didnt help much.

    Yesterday everything seemed ok, though, I wasnt printing these gradients ... Solid colors are ok.

    I must mention that it is very hot day here today, 34 degrees celsius. Could that be a problem that made these prints look this way? If that's so, what to do in higher air temperature? Raising, or lowering print and dry temp?

    Or, U might have some other idea why this problem occured?

    Please, help, any advice is welcome. ...

    P.S. I'll attach a photo of mentioned problem, where You can see that problem is occuring at dark parts only, not the lighter, blue parts ...

    [​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

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  2. insignia

    insignia Very Active Member

    Not 100% sure if it's your problem or not, and I'm coming from the Mimaki world, but that MacTac 829P HAS to be the absolute worst vinyl I've ever printed on bar none. We brought in 10 rolls to try and returned 7, three rolls and we were unable to get satisfactory results. Had it custom profiled twice, no luck. We saw horrible excessive banding almost identical to what you're seeing. Terrible ink puddling. Poor ink adhesion to it. Hand prints half way through rolls. The stuff is junk.
     
  3. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    prob +1 above, but it seems like it might be a problem with K head (darker prints have problem only) - nozzles all firing?
     
  4. messmedia

    messmedia Member

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    Nozzles test print IS PERFECT (says me proudly) :{) - Thats why I am almost sure it is not banding ...
    I also triple checked calibration for media feed ... no issues there.

    I have an Orafol vinyl roll here, gonna try it later.
    But, since I've printed for the past 2 months on Mac Tac and did not have these problems (although was not completely satisfied with it - it seems it has some "texture", or "wavity" to it, gloss version), something must be - not ok (I am hoping this speeding summer is coming so I need to adjust the temperatures?? - but I didnt have any success so far)??
     
  5. P Wagner

    P Wagner Very Active Member

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    34 degrees Celsius (93 degrees F) is too hot of an environment for a Roland solvent printer to operate in. Anything above 85 deg. f (30C) needs to be avoided at all costs. You will quickly damage the print heads and print quality goes down as well as you've seen. You would do well to get the printer into an environment where you can control the temperature and humidity.
     
  6. insignia

    insignia Very Active Member

    Yeah, wait, is it that hot IN your shop? If so, geez! That has alot to do with your problem. Get an air conditioner quick.
     
  7. messmedia

    messmedia Member

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    I have air conditioner, its just we jumped from 25 degrees celsius to 34 in 2 days, its like that here in mediteranean area :{)

    And, morning sun goes directly in the room where our printer is, through the wall that is - a window, 6by2 meters. So it is boiling in the morning there. I will mask the windows tomorow, and turn on the conditioner overnight and we'll se what happens ...

    The job was due today, and I just couldn't believe it can do this much bad at this little time - to print quality?!?!
     
  8. artbot

    artbot Very Active Member

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    there is one odd form of banding that is caused by the directional laying down of dots. thus the magenta one are laying on top of the black going left, then vice versa going right. it causes metamerism at certain angles. have you tried running unidirectional to see if you can eliminate this possibility?
     
  9. messmedia

    messmedia Member

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    @ artbot: I did not try unidirectional mode, but I recalibrated bidirectional mode, ... it was off by 1/2 points at some segments of the test (more precise, 4 components one) - didnt help at all ...

    Anyway, guys, it seems it's GODDAMN VINYL - IT WAS THE MAIN PROBLEM.
    Or, to be more precise, it seems it doesn't handle the heat well. I've just tried ORAFOL 3640 that I had, and it printed with NO PROBLEMS, infact, during these 7 months I've been using my roland, print quality did not degrade a bit! (I printed the same test as when the machine was installed)

    So that explains "blochiness" in colors. How it produced this partial banding-like issues - I just can't logically find the reasons. but, solution is: AVOID MACTAC, at least lower end vinyls ...

    Or I am terribly mistaken and worse is yet to come? :{)

    So, Air Conditioner is on, orafol is in the machine, and now I must find the way to use whats left of this damn MacTac. Maybe I'll wrap some city garbage containers (4noreason@all - in an urban guerrila manner)??
    Who needs spray cans these days anyway ...

    ... and thanx 2 all for You 4 help and ideas. Insignia was deadOn @ first try! So he gets the fame and a master title ... :{)
     
  10. SE SignSupply

    SE SignSupply Member

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    Roland had a press release not long ago about the importance of custom profiling with this machine.

    Basically, because the drops of this new printhead are so small compared with the previous DX4 heads, profiles are not as generic. Give it time, more 3rd party profiles will be available.
     
  11. messmedia

    messmedia Member

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    You must B thinkin' on VS 640? Unfortunatly, not there yet! :{) I have RS 640 ;{) but I'm coming there :{D
     
  12. SE SignSupply

    SE SignSupply Member

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    Oops, you are correct....maybe this will help in the future!
     
  13. guillermo

    guillermo Member

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    Jun 10, 2009
    Northridge, California
    I had this problem printing on my RE640 to Roland paper SGP3 and was having the same issue with black, tech told me to use a vinyl profile (I am using GCVP gloss vinyl) and that problem is gone, of course I am printing to the same Roland paper SGP3.
     
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