VG-640 vs. S80600 + FC8600

[SignMeUpGraphics]

We're in the market to get a bit more speed out of our production and our current VS-540 (w. LmLc) isn't doing us many favours any more. Added gamut increases and longevity of newer ink sets would also be a bonus.

We're looking at replacing it with either the Roland VG-640 or Epson S80600 (plus Graphtec FC8600 to cut).
We looked at both at a show yesterday, and print speed & quality on both makes the VS look terrible in comparison.
LcLmLk are a requirement as we produce work for a lot of artists so the benefits will outweigh the speed reduction.

Primarily this machine would end up printing several thousand decals per month, all contour cut with full bleed, a few hundred posters on various solvent papers, numerous canvases and banners, the odd vehicle wrap and perf.

If anyone has any input as to to which option they'd go with (apart from the obvious ability to print & cut on separate machines) I'm all ears at the moment. There is currently a deal on the Epson which can bring the package of printer + cutter to the same price as the Roland, so pricing is irrelevant for comparison at this stage.

 

[ProPDF]

We're in the market to get a bit more speed out of our production and our current VS-540 (w. LmLc) isn't doing us many favours any more. Added gamut increases and longevity of newer ink sets would also be a bonus.

We're looking at replacing it with either the Roland VG-640 or Epson S80600 (plus Graphtec FC8600 to cut).
We looked at both at a show yesterday, and print speed & quality on both makes the VS look terrible in comparison.
LcLmLk are a requirement as we produce work for a lot of artists so the benefits will outweigh the speed reduction.

Primarily this machine would end up printing several thousand decals per month, all contour cut with full bleed, a few hundred posters on various solvent papers, numerous canvases and banners, the odd vehicle wrap and perf.

If anyone has any input as to to which option they'd go with (apart from the obvious ability to print & cut on separate machines) I'm all ears at the moment. There is currently a deal on the Epson which can bring the package of printer + cutter to the same price as the Roland, so pricing is irrelevant for comparison at this stage.

First and foremost if your not a multiple printer outfit you want to see how fast you can get service.

Find out the distance what dealer is closest to you!!

1: Call them and ask what is the estimate time to get my printer repaired if I buy a new one from you. If your punching out that many prints then being down 3-4 days just isn't an option. Sometimes even if the dealer address is far from you they may have a tech that services machines in your area. So don't count out a brand if their dealer locator isn't looking good.

2: Ask them if you can get the current techs number. Call the tech see if the story's match on service time. The sales and service guys fall from a different tree at times.

3: Ask both sales and tech people how strict are they on replacing print heads if a nozzle or two are missing.

4: See if you can get the Roland Dealer to come down on price for adding in a separate cutter for you. It's their fault they didn't build a lower priced VG printer only model to compete with shops who require separate cutters.

5: With the VG being the new kid on the block.....I would go with the Epson even though I am a Roland fan. The VG lower ink cost are a lie because that printer uses more ink than the Epson will per print. So don't let "cheaper ink carts" sell you.

6: Make sure that the printer works right before the tech leaves. Make sure the Take-up actually takes-up before they leave from whoever you choose.

7: Choose a dealer who knows how to handle profiling issues. Who knows how to use an x-rite device if you have to profile something.

Do all that by phone then follow up by written email to confirm everything they said.

 

[SignMeUpGraphics]

1: We've had our Roland for quite some time now. Service is next day if emergency. We actually have two service centres to choose from, so that is fortunate. Epson are a blank page at this stage.

2: As above, no issues with Roland thus far.

3: Will make the appropriate enquiries.

4: Sounds like a fair option. Not sure what they'd offer though. The GR range is completely unproven compared to a Graphtec also.

5: That's a fair point. I've not seen any ink usage comparisons between the two. I have no issues with Roland, having had several of their machines over the last 13 years.

6: For sure.

7: We have our own i1Pro2 Publish. The Roland won't be a problem to profile with. Epson have mentioned that their machine is bundled with Ergosoft Essentials. I have never used this before. They have said that you cannot profile with it if you don't upgrade to the "full" version for an additional AUD$1200. This didn't make me too happy to hear.

 

[BigfishDM]

We're in the market to get a bit more speed out of our production and our current VS-540 (w. LmLc) isn't doing us many favours any more. Added gamut increases and longevity of newer ink sets would also be a bonus.

We're looking at replacing it with either the Roland VG-640 or Epson S80600 (plus Graphtec FC8600 to cut).
We looked at both at a show yesterday, and print speed & quality on both makes the VS look terrible in comparison.
LcLmLk are a requirement as we produce work for a lot of artists so the benefits will outweigh the speed reduction.

Primarily this machine would end up printing several thousand decals per month, all contour cut with full bleed, a few hundred posters on various solvent papers, numerous canvases and banners, the odd vehicle wrap and perf.

If anyone has any input as to to which option they'd go with (apart from the obvious ability to print & cut on separate machines) I'm all ears at the moment. There is currently a deal on the Epson which can bring the package of printer + cutter to the same price as the Roland, so pricing is irrelevant for comparison at this stage.

If you are looking for speed then you should also consider Latex as its about 24 hours faster than the other machines you're looking at. I know some will say there are color issues with some latex machines BUT the biggest canvas producer in our industry runs Latex because of the quality. The amount of money that latex would save you on your decal and paper applications would be very substantial, about the same cost range on the other applications you are looking to do.

Ok now that I at least let you know my opinion on what I think, and realizing you probably are not going to look at a latex machine, I would look at the Epson model over the Roland. I see many of those in the market place and they are good machines and have faster dry times then Roland for sure. The color is better off the Epson and Epson makes all their own stuff including their heads.

 

[SignMeUpGraphics]

If you are looking for speed then you should also consider Latex ...snip...

I would look at the Epson model over the Roland. I see many of those in the market place and they are good machines and have faster dry times then Roland for sure. The color is better off the Epson and Epson makes all their own stuff including their heads.

Thanks Bigfish. Unfortunately latex support is nearly non-existent in our area, so we cannot entertain the idea at this stage. I appreciate the comments on the Epson. Personally I'd like to give the Epson a try after years of Roland equipment. I was still very surprised at the quality of the VG though. Solid blocks of colour looked comparable to a good screen print. Even though the resolution is technically lower then the VS(i) range, in reality it's far superior.

 

[Dr. Decal]

We have the Roland VG-540. So, that is the only one I can really give any advice on.

The printer is much faster than our previous Roland SP-540v, and a noticeably faster than a VS-540i that I have ran in the past.

Print quality is amazing when it is firing on all cylinders, but in that lies the problem. I have lost TWO print heads in under a year (NOT FROM HEAD STRIKES). Both of them were replaced under warranty, and the tech tells me we are the only shop that has had any head trouble. So it is possible that my particular machine was fitted with a bad batch of heads from the factory, and is truly an outlier to an otherwise nice machine.

The new ink system does dry much faster than previous eco-sol inks. I usually print in the morning, laminate in the late afternoon, with no degassing issues.

Keeping the printer clean is more of a task than with older models. I'm not sure why, but the new Tru-Vis ink will form a thick resin like substance on the heads. I have to manual clean about twice a week, and automatic clean several times a day.

After my second head replacement, I haven't had any issues.

 

[SignMeUpGraphics]

We have the Roland VG-540. So, that is the only one I can really give any advice on.

The printer is much faster than our previous Roland SP-540v, and a noticeably faster than a VS-540i that I have ran in the past.

Print quality is amazing when it is firing on all cylinders, but in that lies the problem. I have lost TWO print heads in under a year (NOT FROM HEAD STRIKES). Both of them were replaced under warranty, and the tech tells me we are the only shop that has had any head trouble. So it is possible that my particular machine was fitted with a bad batch of heads from the factory, and is truly an outlier to an otherwise nice machine.

The new ink system does dry much faster than previous eco-sol inks. I usually print in the morning, laminate in the late afternoon, with no degassing issues.

Keeping the printer clean is more of a task than with older models. I'm not sure why, but the new Tru-Vis ink will form a thick resin like substance on the heads. I have to manual clean about twice a week, and automatic clean several times a day.

After my second head replacement, I haven't had any issues.

VG-540 is basically identical apart from width, so I regard it as the same machine for comparison.
Yeah, during testing I felt that the VG was nearly twice the speed of our VS, which is definitely an improvement. We won't be testing the Epson until next week though, but from what I've heard it should be faster again.
Not good to hear about the head replacments. I did speak of a few flaws with the VG with Roland dealer and they claimed that the first batch of machines weren't the best, and subsequent batches haven't had any issues... not sure how realistic this claim is though.
Agreed with the ink dry times. I could run my finger across a 200% coverage print while still on the print heater and not get and smudging or ink on my finger. It dries a lot quicker than MAX inks.
Roland themselves conceeded that maintenance is more annoying than previous models, with the inability to clear the cleaning prompts unless you actually do the cleaning. This could end up being a long terms pain in the ass, as who ever has the time to do maintenance exactly at the right time. Sometimes a day or two here or there are expected. The Epson on the other hand self-maintains, with only a small monthly tweak required.
Thanks for your input, greatly appreciated.

 

[euronymous]

Spending 5 minutes to clean the machine once a week is absolutely worth the effort for the quality you get out of the VG. I think folks are making too much of a stink about nothing