What to Buy? What to Buy? Need advice and wisdom!

[billram570]

I haven't been on the forum in awhile but am starting my research again for the first time in 3 years. We've had an Oce 660GT Flatbed for almost 3 years now. Its been a great machine but now that we dont have a service contract, when we do need service we get pushed back to the end of the line. This is a whole other topic, but I think a 20k a year service contract for maintenance that doesnt even cover a printhead is absurd. So in saying that, I'm looking for a 2nd machine. Id rather spend 20k a year on having a backup machine as well as something that we can take some of the bottleneck pressure off of our Oce printer.

So heres what I'm looking for and would love to hear some of your advice on flatbed printers.

1) High Quality and detail / Small picoliter drop: We print packaging prototypes so id like a machine that prints high quality and detail. Preferably a smaller picoliter dot than our Oce. (6 picoliter or smaller) We need to be able to look at prints right in front of our eyes and that have at least the quality print of our Oce. Would love better..

2) White and Clear Ink: We also do a lot of dimensional printing,emboss affects and underlay prints with white and clear ink. So white and clear ink is a must.

3) Price: Would love a sub/$100K printer. Again just trying to replace that 20k a year service contract with a decent quality machine.

4) Speed: Would be nice to print as fast as our Oce 660gt. Not a requirement. I realize for $100K or below it most probably can't be found. But hey why not reach for the stars. If you guys know of something that can give me the quality and speed, Im all ears. ( We print in the highest quality mode usually, So we're use to seeing the printhead move slower than some of your sign guys do. But the faster the printer or more head we can print that "High Quality" Mode faster. )

5) And last but not least. Would love great Service. Oce was good in the beginning. And our local guy is a great Service technician. But They've sold a lot ofprinters in our area in the last 3 years since we first purchased, so he is overwhelmed. Next day service is a must.

So I would love to hear your thoughts and advice on all the flatbed stationary flatbeds: Oce, CET, Flora, Fuji, Vanguard. If you know of any of these or something i haven't listed that would fit my requirements above please do tell.

 

[ams]

Roland LEJ-640FT

 

[rmcginn]

Summa

 

[bjt140]

Mimaki or Chinese

I saw the mimaki jfx at a trade show and was impressed. Pretty sure it has a varnish as well and I think it was quoted mid to high 70's

 

[KaranGrewal]

why not get another oce flatbed

why not get another oce flatbed. same inks , so you dont have to keep two different inks in stock. same parts for both like uv lamps etc. one service guy to deal with.
no need to buy another rip software just upgrade existing one to run both printers. No need to create new profiles and no time waste for learning abt new printer. All this possible only if you are happy with OCE and its meeting your needs. saves a lot of money in long run.

 

[billram570]

LOL ... Ive got a Roland LEJ-640 that has hardly any miles on it that i would love to sale if anyone is interested. Its a toy compared to my oce.

 

[billram570]

Sleepy Head....Its a great idea. But i paid well over my budget for the oce. I just can't afford another payment like that. Would love to be under 100k. And the oce 318gl doesnt do varnish. So i dont think its an option. I think they're 1200 series is quite a bit more expensive.

 

[Solventinkjet]

It sounds like the Mimaki JFX200 is right up your alley.

1. Quality - The JFX200 print quality is on par or better than most flatbed printers I have seen in the field. It creates nice sharp prints and very smooth solid colors. My customers are loving it.

2. White and Clear ink - They are available on this model. Most of my customers don't use the varnish but they do use the white and it is a nice solid smooth white. Not like other flatbeds I have seen where the white ink creates patterns in the print.

3. Price - The JFX goes for around $80k depending on the ink set and options you choose. You will not go over $100k even with all of the options, installation and shipping.

4. Speed - As this is an entry level flatbed, it's not the fastest in the industry but it is the fastest at it's price point. If you go with the CMYK x2 option you can print 8 full 4'x8' sheets per hour. With white and varnish you are looking at more like 4 per hour.

5. Service - Mimaki employed technicians handle the service for the first year. This is great because these guys are working on these machines all the time and are trained directly by Mimaki Japan. After the first year your dealer should be bale to support you because they do not allow dealers to sell these machines without a trained tech on staff. I am one of those technicians.

I do have a bias because we sell them but I am just a tech. I do not get kick backs etc. I truly believe these machines are some of the best in the industry. I would definitely look into them and if you are interested buying out of state, feel free to give us a call.

 

[billram570]

Thankyou so much for the insight... The mimaki JFx200 is actually on top of my list of printers that I'm considering. The price point is good. My only hangup on that machine is the speed and not being able to upgrade it in the field like a CET printer.

I do have a question for you as a tech. Have you ever seen any of your customers do dimensional printing on the Mimaki. We do emboss effects with layers of varnish or layers of white underneath CMYK to create raised areas in the printing. I was just curious how well the Mimaki handles those types of applications. Our Oce does a great job of it. Hopefully the Mimaki does as well.

 

[winterk80]

Not sure where in Texas you are but Mimaki has a factory showroom and demo room in Dallas. Set an appointment and take your samples there and they will run whatever you want to try.

 

[Steve Weist]

Mimaki jfx 200 Specialist

Feel free to contact me regarding a Mimaki jfx 200 for Texas. I can get your demo scheduled and answer any questions you may have. We have installed well over a hundred Mimaki flatbeds. With over a hundred very happy customers.

PDS Equipment
Steve Weist
615-812-3001

 

[Solventinkjet]

Thankyou so much for the insight... The mimaki JFx200 is actually on top of my list of printers that I'm considering. The price point is good. My only hangup on that machine is the speed and not being able to upgrade it in the field like a CET printer.

I do have a question for you as a tech. Have you ever seen any of your customers do dimensional printing on the Mimaki. We do emboss effects with layers of varnish or layers of white underneath CMYK to create raised areas in the printing. I was just curious how well the Mimaki handles those types of applications. Our Oce does a great job of it. Hopefully the Mimaki does as well.

My customers aren't using that feature but I have seen some done in demo shows. Unfortunately I don't use these machines like you guys do so i'm not sure exactly what a good raised print looks and feels like but the ones i have seen off the JFX200 are pretty cool. Since I haven't seen enough of it, I can't tell you how well it holds up though.

 

[FangMan]

Bill, I sell Vanguard, I'm local and can provide a Printer almost twice as fast as Mamiki for under $100K with better print quality (VR5D). And, like the CET, it's field up-gradable (designed by same people who ran CET). Let's do a Demo?

Best Regards

 

[D3D]

Fangman, what is the smallest picoliter drop size on the VR5D? At MAX quality, with white, how much time does it take to print a 4x8 board?

 

[Pauly]

Stick with the Oce. If you keep them maintained, they are not problematic. I'm pretty sure there's a few different contract plans, you should most defiantly speak to them for options.
I have a 480xt. out of contract. brilliant machine.
SwissQ would be another option but one of my service guys use to work for them and he says these are way more reliable.

 

[cthammond]

We are looking at the Mimaki JFX200, Oce 318GL, and HP FB500. We are looking for the variable dot for the quality so that will most likely rule out the HP. We tested the Mimaki and like the gradients and photo quality but hear they are slow and the inks do not adhere well to Dibond and acrylic which we use all the time. We used to have a Lightjet so we like the Oce line but are waiting for test prints. If anyone knows anything about the ink adhesion for Oce printers with acrylic and dibond please let me know.

 

[bigben]

We are looking at the Mimaki JFX200, Oce 318GL, and HP FB500. We are looking for the variable dot for the quality so that will most likely rule out the HP. We tested the Mimaki and like the gradients and photo quality but hear they are slow and the inks do not adhere well to Dibond and acrylic which we use all the time. We used to have a Lightjet so we like the Oce line but are waiting for test prints. If anyone knows anything about the ink adhesion for Oce printers with acrylic and dibond please let me know.

I'm in the same boat as you. If you get an answer for the ink adhesion with the mimaki on acrylic and dibond, let me know.

 

[Steve Weist]

Mimaki UV SPECIALIST

I'm in the same boat as you. If you get an answer for the ink adhesion with the mimaki on acrylic and dibond, let me know.

Guys if you have Mimaki JFX questions please contact me I have installed 150+ Mimaki UV flatbeds in the last few years with 150+ happy references that will be glad to talk with you. The machines can be configured CMYK PRIMER+CLEAR+2WHITES. We have 4pico liter drop size.there will be no adhesions issues. I'm available any time even on weekends. You will also have service and support on weekends if you purchase from PDS Equipment.
615-812-3001
STEVE Weist
Sweistsr@gmail.com

 

[Steve Weist]

Here's a video of textured print of the JFX 200.
https://youtu.be/_3OqYfk28lA.

 

[Robert Gruner]

LFC would like for you to believe the Roland LEJ640FT is the best solution...I don't think so here.

Steve says Mimaki JFX200 is the best solution...He may be right...it is a nice high performance printer; and, there are enough successful installs across the US to back that up.

I have seen the Mimaki JFX print nice graphics on acrylic and dibond.

BigBen is in Quebec and CT is in Maryland...

I have only know Roland printers to be sold by Authorized Resellers with assigned geographic territories. You can call Roland to find an authorized reseller in your area.

Mimaki too has Authorized Resellers; however, Mimaki does not restrict their resellers to a geographical territory? Mimaki printer warranties and service are generally managed by their resellers. I

would encourage all end users to find an authorized reseller that is close to you as most high performance UV flatbed printers require a fair amount of same or one day onsite service.