What Would You Do?

[wetgravy]

If I was in your position I would have bought a used printer before investing in the master collection which is overkill for what you need. You could still sell it and go with design premium or corel and have almost enough to consider a used printer.

Unless it's pirated.

 

[Malkin]

I had a curtomer stop in with a trailer that I lettered and printed graphics for in August of 06. I hadn't seen the rig since I lettered it. I printed his photos on my old HP5000 and laminated them. He was a good customer and we did this as a test job so if it went to crap early I'd replace them from my Edge printer.
Anyhow, I was surprised how well they held up. Color wise, there was not much fading. The prints had some border issues with water separating what I assume was the ink receptive coating on the vinyl.
I'm thinking if I have overlapped the edges of the print 1/2" with the laminate and also didn't install and slick over the trailer seams, it would still look pretty good.

This was similar to our experience as well with our aqueous machine. We found that the prints delaminated easily, but if you overlap the laminate onto the background it was fine. Colors held up for many years without much issue, we even wrapped our truck with some specialty coated cast wrapping film.
This was with a GRAPHTEC SIGNJET PRO JX2150, which served us well for about 7 years.

So glad to switch to the Roland vp540 though...!

 

[tbaker]

Foridesign, I want you to think about something.
and trust me I'm not doing this to bash you in anyway. I started in this industry about 20 years ago, and only got into it, because I had a friend that needed someone reliable to work with, I didn't know a buttload about printing, but I'm pretty reliable.

ok now to the point, Would you let someone operate on your brain, if they only did it as a hobby?

Would you get into a Airliner if you knew the pilot only did it as a hobby?

Both professions require years of training, for doctors, you're looking at a minimum of 7 years schooling, for pilots, at least 4, then hundreds of hours in additional training.

Becoming a true graphic professional requires no less dedication, some of the larger shops have combined hundreds of years of experience, dozens of years of schooling, and thousands and thousands of hours of practical application. While many in the sign industry don't enjoy the same salary of both above professions, it does NOT mean they are less professional in any way. I wouldn't let a brain surgeon fly my plane either...

A true sign professional not only knows his equipment; printer plotter laminator, cnc, dye sub, etc. They also know marketing trends, have their fingers on the pulse of current marketing trends, have at least a passing knowledge in chemistry, work with dozens of types of software, take care of networking issues, and in many cases are experts in customer relations.

When you think about it from that perspective, perhaps you can see why "Hobby" and "Enthusiast" are words best left for discussions about model plans and trains.

Just my .02

 

[iSign]

...But after I completed a for day project job that costed a $1,500 turned $27,000 I was solded on one day I needed to do my own thing. I have wanted two years to make sure I wouldn't get sued when I get the client, I have learned how to cut their cost.

...well. I hope you do get sued.

...oughtta go earn your own clients! ...thief.






...BTW, might wanna learn to F'n spell too..

 

[Fatboy]

I have mixed feelings here! For one I think we are a bit hard on the OP. But then......Lesson no one in Business ......Ethics. Don't make it your mission to go out and steal your former employers business. Whats wrong with you? Aren't you good enough to find your own?

Lots of successful businesses started as a hobby so don't let that put you of.You came to the right place for advice but let me warn you, the guys on this site don't respond well to shady business ethics.They are professionals.

I run my printing shop from South Africa and refer back to the advice given here on a daily business. I will be near impossible to run my business without this bunch.

 

[andy]

But after I completed a for day project job that costed a $1,500 turned $27,000 I was solded on one day I needed to do my own thing. I have wanted two years to make sure I wouldn't get sued when I get the client, I have learned how to cut their cost.

What? What? What?

Doug, you are a linguistic Black Belt, I've been reading this fricking paragraph for 15 minutes and still have absolutely NO idea what it means?????

 

[Malkin]

What? What? What?

Doug, you are a linguistic Black Belt, I've been reading this fricking paragraph for 15 minutes and still have absolutely NO idea what it means?????

After I completed a 4 day project that cost about $1,500 (in materials I think) and billed for $27,000, I was sold on the idea that one day I needed to do my own thing. I have waited for two years to make sure I wouldn't be sued when I got their client. I have learned how to cut their cost.

How's that?

 

[thinksigns]

I have mixed feelings here! For one I think we are a bit hard on the OP. But then......Lesson no one in Business ......Ethics. Don't make it your mission to go out and steal your former employers business. Whats wrong with you? Aren't you good enough to find your own?

Just some thoughts from the other side.

I worked for someone else for a few years. Even though the store opened at 8:00am, I was there at 7:00am. The "owner" worked from his home. I would call him at 9:00 and say we needed something and he would say, "okay, let me hop in the shower." The biggest clients were telling me that they were coming there because of me, not because of the name on the sign. The owner then tells me that not only am I not getting a raise, that I'm making too much money. The last straw was him asking me to lie for him when he was negotiating about moving his store. The way I look at it, if the clients came with me, then they were my customers and not the others guys'.

 

[iSign]

Just some thoughts from the other side.

I worked for someone else for a few years. Even though the store opened at 8:00am, I was there at 7:00am. The "owner" worked from his home. I would call him at 9:00 and say we needed something and he would say, "okay, let me hop in the shower." The biggest clients were telling me that they were coming there because of me, not because of the name on the sign. The owner then tells me that not only am I not getting a raise, that I'm making too much money. The last straw was him asking me to lie for him when he was negotiating about moving his store. The way I look at it, if the clients came with me, then they were my customers and not the others guys'.

let me guess.. you are still someone's employee?

an owner doesn't have to show up at 7, seize EVERY great opportunity that you see, or avoid EVERY selfish distraction that you see, to be the reason YOU have a job, and the reason HIS clients come to you, to keep you employed... sure, I get the point, there are some douch bags who fall into a biz op that they will probably lose anyway... but there are also busy employers who built something on their own hard sweat & tears before you waltzed in, and now they might choose to let you do the work, because you don't have a competing business

 

[iSign]

How's that?

but I think $27,000.00 was a typo for $2700.00

 

[thinksigns]

let me guess.. you are still someone's employee?

an owner doesn't have to show up at 7, seize EVERY great opportunity that you see, or avoid EVERY selfish distraction that you see, to be the reason YOU have a job, and the reason HIS clients come to you, to keep you employed... sure, I get the point, there are some douch bags who fall into a biz op that they will probably lose anyway... but there are also busy employers who built something on their own hard sweat & tears before you waltzed in, and now they might choose to let you do the work, because you don't have a competing business

Why would you think I'm still someone's employee? I started my business 8 years ago.

He didn't build the business. It had been open about 3 or 4 years before he hired me, but he purchased the business 3 months before I got there.

You can't tell me that if you were in my position, clients saying they come there because of you, your boss saying he is going to have to cut your pay and to lie for him, that you wouldn't make the same decision I did.

 

[iSign]

You can't tell me that if you were in my position, clients saying they come there because of you, your boss saying he is going to have to cut your pay and to lie for him, that you wouldn't make the same decision I did.

ok, then let me guess again... maybe you don't have employees? ...I don't know, I'm not intending to say I know your story, but what I am observing (or thinking that I am) is a classic employee point of view, that is difficult for employees to break free from and see the employers view, until walking in his shoes... and while i don't know your story, even the boss who purchased a business 3 months before hiring you, he purchased something, and you claim the perception that what is HIS should be YOURS... it doesn't matter how great you were, and how much the clients you served loved YOU... and how much the owner sat on his ass.. it's still HIS business, and clients coming through the door are HIS clients..

yeah, I might have done the same thing as you, but the original poster displayed a sense of entitlement to stealing clients, and you defend that by displaying the same thing. If you are great, leave, and advertise that you exist, and that you are great... and anyone who went elsewhere because you were great over there... well, they can choose to follow you... but if an ex employee seeks to steal an employers clients... I'm sure people have been found in shallow graves for less... don't f**k with a mans livelihood.. make your own...

 

[thinksigns]

the original poster displayed a sense of entitlement to stealing clients, and you defend that by displaying the same thing.

I see your point. I was just trying to say that not all situations are black and white. If his posts are any indication of his signs, the original poster's old boss has nothing to worry about.

I do have one employee, but I'm the one working on Saturdays and he is off doing whatever 27 year olds do on Saturday afternoons. The main thing my old boss taught me was to not let your employees work harder than you.

 

[Firefox]

The main thing my old boss taught me was to not let your employees work harder than you.

No matter how hard I try that hardly ever seems to happen! The few times I have had truly great employees sooner or later they always find a way to move on to bigger and better things. It is sad to see them go but I admire the ambition. That's just the way it is with motivated people. I enjoy them while they are hear but wouldn't dream of trying to hold them back.

On the other side I have had employees that have the "attitude" that they are making me rich with their hard work and try to start their own thing, try to steal customers, try to put me out of business, etc. I wish them well... but in the past 25 plus I'm still here and they are not to be found! There is a big difference between those that think it's a cake walk and all profit those that want more of a challenge and a path to growth.

I wish the OP well should he decide that he can make a go of it but the grass truly is greener on the other side unless you have the right fertilizer.

By the way Doug, dig deeper they're harder to find that way!

 

[Malkin]

but I think $27,000.00 was a typo for $2700.00

Probably so, though it takes much of the wind of out his sails so-to-speak.

 

[mark galoob]

oh yea, i just love how the employee knows everything yada yada and that customers are there because of that employee...

that whole story made me sick...as an employee, you have NO stake in that business...NONE whatsoever. no risk, no balls on the chopping block. but you must know much more than the owner, who has ALL the risk and literelly balls on the chopping block. pal, there is a special place in the underworld for people who pull that shit...

mark galoob

 

[tbaker]

planes*

I love when I rush through things.

 

[iSign]

...I'm sure people have been found in shallow graves for less... don't f**k with a mans livelihood.. make your own...

By the way Doug, dig deeper they're harder to find that way!

:ROFLMAO: ...hahahaha it took me a full 24 hours to get that

 

[heyskull]

I've been int his business for 26 years now!
I started with one of the biggest sign shops in our area as an engraver and profiller.
I got p****d when this company got greedy after I had managed to be running 3 machines non stop all day long and were still wanting to know what I was doing every waking second! They ended putting in a job timing system that couldn't cope with a person running more than 2 machines. I was with them for 10 years, yes we had all the latest gear and looking back Gerber used this company as a testing area for products in the UK.

I then moved on to another local sign shop which the owner had just purchased of a guy emigrating to Australia. Now to say this guy knew nothing was an understatement but I stopped there for another 7 years. The big problem with this guy was if he had invested more in the business and less about filling his pockets and looking after his staff his pockets would have been even more filled. In the end when I decided to start up on my own loads of the customers wanted to follow. This was crazy as the new business was over 40 miles away (that's a long way in the UK).

I've been going now on my own for over 9 years and guess what......???
I'm still learning, I still class myself as a newstart and I still don't know how to make signs.....LOL
But I have learned one thing, starting up on your own is the hardest thing you will ever do. Just don't take this business as a hobby or a thing to do on the side because it doesn't work that way.
In the 9 years I have been over here 5-7 more hobbiest/enthusiasts have come and gone. All of them were out to undercut me and bring my business to its knees.
They missed the point, all of them,
I don't want to be the cheapest.
I want to be the most expensive, but expensive because what we are selling a top quality product that we trust.

Good Luck in this business as you are going to need it.

SC