when you are ready to throw in the towel

[signed off]

printed 54 championship banners 18" x 31" ( for sleeve allowance) let them sit on roll loosely rolled for 5 days, trim them to size and they sat on top of each other flat for another 5 days as we waited to hear what size sleeve they want for sure. Made sleeve and packaged them up staggering them the width of the sleeve and put them into a corplast folded over package ( 18 in each package). Customer picked up on the 3rd of march and today went to get them to put their dowel rod in and they all stuck to each other every stinking one of them, so I am starting to reprint all 54 again. Some days even the towel is to wet from crying to throw it in. Just my rant

 

[BigfishDM]

Oh man that's a bummer, sorry to hear that.

 

[signmeup]

Wow! That sucks. Laminate the next batch...

Adrian

 

[signed off]

Ouch...sorry to hear. And I thought I had a long week.

What are you printing with that after 5 days banners are still that tacky? Sounds like way too much cure time to me.

If I knew why they are sticking I would do something different, the thing is, it wasn't sticking when it left here. I had no issues lifting each banner to create the sleeve
printing on 13 oz banner stock on a vp540 we have been doing this clients banners since 2012 and never had this issue

 

[Gino]

Too bad, on a Friday. I just hadda call my tech person for one of our printers and I hate ending the week on a note like that. Oh well, at least it's paid for.................. I mean the techs trip and supplies needed.

 

[2B]

If I knew why they are sticking I would do something different, the thing is, it wasn't sticking when it left here. I had no issues lifting each banner to create the sleeve
printing on 13 oz banner stock on a vp540 we have been doing this clients banners since 2012 and never had this issue

ouch, sorry to hear and best of luck.

you say it left fine, but they weren't able to install because the ink was tacky...... where were the banners stored? were they exposed to anything? something had to cause the banners to become tacky and it sounds like it was out of your control.

hopefully the reprint is making you money

 

[ams]

If any of them were ink side facing ink side, that will happen, but generally not ink side to back.
I am thinking maybe when stacked, they couldn't properly cure, trapped the ink and air. Perhaps next time give them 24 - 48 hours laying out on their own exposed.

 

[rjssigns]

I wonder if being rolled(even loosely) combined with high ink load could have caused the banner to have a chemical reaction? As VOC's out gassed they hit the other surfaces before exiting the roll.


Our method for drying: Set up "clothes lines" with paracord to hang banners/prints.

 

[player]

I would cut waste backer to use as a separator, with the paper side against the prints.

 

[bob]

Give them a coat of Clear Shield, wait an hour or three, depending, then do anything you want with them.

 

[P Wagner]

All good suggestions to avoid this ink transfer problem in the future.

Or use HP Latex instead of solvent ink.

 

[TimToad]

I feel your pain and hope you can plow through the reprints without any more trouble. We also run a VP540.

At this exact time last spring we did an order of about 110 3'x8' banners all with a built nearly black bleed background. We had two and a half weeks to complete the order and had plenty of other work to do while we set up our drying procedure. Even here in drought stricken and generally dry California, we can have humidity up in the 70% range in the "winter" January-April. I would imagine Toronto at this time of year is still pretty cold and possibly damp. My suspicion is they got throw in a shed somewhere or something without being separated.

This would be an awesome business to be in if we could just get rid of the customers or at least have them listen to our instructions for how to care for the products we sell them.

We set up a series of three clothes lines in the back shop, hung them in groups of twenty or so and let them sit for 36-48 hours before hemming and grommetting. For delivery, we slip sheeted each banner with the silicone side of media liner on the printed side and only rolled 6-8 banners together max. Our client hung them for the event outdoors within 24-48 hours of receiving them, so there wasn't much time for them to be lumped together.

This year's event looks like we'll only be doing 20-30 new sponsor's banners, so at least we have our process down from last year.

 

[ddarlak]

I don't understand why everyone isn't using Latex, I can't even count the problems that disappeared when I switched...

Life is so much easier with latex...

 

[player]

I don't understand why everyone isn't using Latex, I can't even count the problems that disappeared when I switched...

Life is so much easier with latex...

Some of the reasons I have read about here:

-inconsistent colours
-dull colours
-extreme heat, high heat affecting some media
-pain to load media
-hard to print small runs, less than 42" wide
-needs 220v
-fog
-questionable machine quality/durability

Note: I am only going from memory what I have read, I am not a hater...

 

[ams]

I don't understand why everyone isn't using Latex, I can't even count the problems that disappeared when I switched...

Life is so much easier with latex...

Latex has it's own problems

 

[nate]

Some of the reasons I have read about here:

-inconsistent colours
-dull colours
-extreme heat, high heat affecting some media
-pain to load media
-hard to print small runs, less than 42" wide
-needs 220v
-fog
-questionable machine quality/durability

Note: I am only going from memory what I have read, I am not a hater...

Best to try it for yourself.

 

[nate]

I feel your pain and hope you can plow through the reprints without any more trouble. We also run a VP540.

At this exact time last spring we did an order of about 110 3'x8' banners all with a built nearly black bleed background. We had two and a half weeks to complete the order and had plenty of other work to do while we set up our drying procedure. Even here in drought stricken and generally dry California, we can have humidity up in the 70% range in the "winter" January-April. I would imagine Toronto at this time of year is still pretty cold and possibly damp. My suspicion is they got throw in a shed somewhere or something without being separated.

This would be an awesome business to be in if we could just get rid of the customers or at least have them listen to our instructions for how to care for the products we sell them.

We set up a series of three clothes lines in the back shop, hung them in groups of twenty or so and let them sit for 36-48 hours before hemming and grommetting. For delivery, we slip sheeted each banner with the silicone side of media liner on the printed side and only rolled 6-8 banners together max. Our client hung them for the event outdoors within 24-48 hours of receiving them, so there wasn't much time for them to be lumped together.

This year's event looks like we'll only be doing 20-30 new sponsor's banners, so at least we have our process down from last year.

The next time you get an order like this, i'd be glad to quote on it. We can have this turned around in a day for you saving you the hassle of printing and curing.

 

[ddarlak]

-inconsistent colours
-dull colours
-extreme heat, high heat affecting some media
-pain to load media
-hard to print small runs, less than 42" wide
-needs 220v
-fog
-questionable machine quality/durability

Note: I am only going from memory what I have read, I am not a hater...

I have been printing with an HP 25500 for 4 years, colors have never been an issue, ever

heat affecting media? I guess if you use some cheap crap that might be an issue, never bothered me

pain to load? maybe for the first week, then you get it

don't even know how to answer 42", I've printed miles of 30" material

I installed 4 220v sockets in a room that was 50 feet and two rooms away from the breaker in about 1.5 hours, not hard at all...220v is just two lines instead of one, not rocket science...

questionable? 4 years and never had a break down I couldn't fix myself in less than an hour, knock on wood

I printed with solvent for a decade, i'll NEVER go back

 

[TimToad]

The next time you get an order like this, i'd be glad to quote on it. We can have this turned around in a day for you saving you the hassle of printing and curing.

Thanks for the offer, but we're in the business of making signs, not just being brokers to keep big wholesalers busy who have helped turn one of the world's oldest and respected crafts into a commodity based business where cheap and fast are the only considerations. We suffer enough from having a few shops in our area driving the true price of everything down by taking the wholesalers price and tacking on a little while driving the intrinsic value of signs into the gutter.

The only work we farm out is the stuff our equipment and personnel can't do.

 

[ddarlak]

Thanks for the offer, but we're in the business of making signs, not just being brokers to keep big wholesalers busy who have helped turn one of the world's oldest and respected crafts into a commodity based business where cheap and fast are the only considerations. We suffer enough from having a few shops in our area driving the true price of everything down by taking the wholesalers price and tacking on a little while driving the intrinsic value of signs into the gutter.

The only work we farm out is the stuff our equipment and personnel can't do.

taking what amounts to a cheap shot at a wholesaler shows your incredible lack personal and business skills....

if I ever met you outside the web, i'd probably have the same opinion I have of you right now...

 

[TimToad]

taking what amounts to a cheap shot at a wholesaler shows your incredible lack personal and business skills....

if I ever met you outside the web, I'd probably have the same opinion I have of you right now...

I'm heartbroken. We're all entitled to express ourselves how we see fit. The internet like emails doesn't express emotions or body language. I thanked him and then with tongue firmly in cheek explained why we do things the way we do. You are more than entitled to think of me however it is you like. I like me, most of my friends and family like me, and I'm quite content with my nice, little profitable sign business.

Nothing I stated was untrue, personal or cheap. We make signs here and do our utmost to use our equipment and personnel for the vast majority of work we can in order to keep things local, stay true to our vocation as sign "makers" and keep ours and our employee's days busy. A crime that is not and there was a time when to most tradespeople thought that was a virtuous and worthy business philosophy. Sorry, if I'm not adapting to the 21st century the way you'd prefer.

Sure, I could go rent an office a tenth of the size of my shop, dump my equipment and play signbroker, but I wouldn't be as happy as I am or have been most of my 35+ year career as a signmaker. My creative desire to sell, design, build and take pride in making my ideas come alive in the from of real tangible signs that help my customer's businesses wouldn't be fulfilled. And that my overly judgemental friend is why I do this to begin with.

There's plenty of folks here that rank on the after market ink, media, ordering software, vinyl suppliers, etc. with reckless abandon in much harsher tones than I expressed.