Will a properly set up HP 115 latex printer print grainy images?

[Ronny Axelsson]

I checked my substrate list balstestrat and you are absolutely right, there is indeed a "Generic Self-Adhesive Vinyl optimized for small text" substrate.
Have never heard of it and apparently it wasn't known to the printer technician either, when we discussed ways to improve print quality maybe eight months ago.
I cloned it and it can be tweaked just like any other clone. Only limitation seems to be the number of passes, which is fixed to ten.

Thanks again for the tip, I'll give it a try as soon as I get the time to play.

Sorry for making the thread go in the wrong direction, Kevin Schultz.

Happy New Year to you all.

 

[CC-CMYK]

Oh yeah sorry 10-passUnidir on those machines. You can't modify it, it's only this one print mode. However I think you can duplicate the profile then delete the color reference and make new calibrations.


I actually can't seem to check this for 110. It's possible that it is outside of this update but you can still check if you can see it:
Same advice as before, update to newest firmware and you should also see "Generic Self-Adhesive Vinyl optimized for small text" that has 10-passUnidir printmode.
But because your 110 does not have OMAS you should always do advance calibration to your profiles. It makes a big difference if the substrate is not the "universal" thickness.
Printhead alingment or anything else wont correct the wrong advance that can introduce noticeable graininess and blurriness.

Does this apply for a L365 too?

 

[balstestrat]

Does this apply for a L365 too?

The unidir printmode part, yes.
Advance calibration requirement, no.

 

[Ronny Axelsson]

I made some tests with the uni-directional print mode on the HP 365 printer, and the edges are definitely crispier, small text look more sharp and there is a little less graininess.

The fact that it is doing 10 passes uni-directional doesn't slow down print speed much, nothing that matters for these kind of jobs anyway, and I wouldn't mind it being even slower if it could enhance quality even more.
And it actually seems to be possible to do that by increasing the number of passes, even though it first looked like it should be impossible.
I modified my cloned "substrate" and added a new print mode, and from there I could select any number of passes, from 1 to 20.
None of them seemed to be uni-directional though, so the I was unsure about its value, but I chose 18 passes and saved.
The new mode didn't have the "U" in its name so I thought it would be bi-directional, but it actually seems like it is printing uni-directional.
Haven't had the time to do more thorough tests yet but I would say there is definitely something to work with here, and I hope the OP manage to get it working on the HP 115 as well.

 

[dypinc]

I saw all the as well on the L360. Interesting about your 18pass setting. I will have to test that as I do some POP signage that would benefit from this. I would be interested in what your test results are.

 

[balstestrat]

I really doubt that 18-pass is actually unidir. Look at it printing very closely, if it's moving the material forward after every pass, it's bidir.

 

[Ronny Axelsson]

I really doubt that 18-pass is actually unidir. Look at it printing very closely, if it's moving the material forward after every pass, it's bidir.

Exactly my thoughts, som I watched it closely as it printed and no, it was only feeding while the print head carriage was on the left hand side.
I'll have to do some more tests though because the result in my initial, rather small and quick test was not as good as it should have been. I mean, the 18 passes mode should print 1200 dpi (?).

 

[balstestrat]

I could be wrong but I think 20p (whatever is max) is the only 1200dpi. And you also have to select it in the RIP.

 

[Ronny Axelsson]

I could be wrong but I think 20p (whatever is max) is the only 1200dpi. And you also have to select it in the RIP.

No, 18p is the only mode that can do 1200 dpi, not 20p for some reason, but I'm not sure it can for all kinds of substrates.
Must check more carefully what really happens when I try to print uni-directional.

 

[dypinc]

Exactly my thoughts, som I watched it closely as it printed and no, it was only feeding while the print head carriage was on the left hand side.
I'll have to do some more tests though because the result in my initial, rather small and quick test was not as good as it should have been. I mean, the 18 passes mode should print 1200 dpi (?).

Ok I did my first tests. The 18pass setting definatlly is printing Uni but I am not sure it is actually printed 18pass. Seemed the exact same speed as the 10pass mode. The preset with 18pass mode had the ink density set to 120 but I could see no difference. Going to have to time it.

I then changed the substrate setting and printed 18pass bidirectionally and it seemed to print slower. Took the loupe and looked at the prints. 10pass and 18pass Uni showed no difference. Now when comparing the 18pass Bi to the Uni the small text was much sharper with much less splatter.

Initial conclusion is that if you wanted to print at 10pass Uni small text would be sharper than 10pass Bi not not as sharp as 18pass Bi.

Now to grain. It looks smoother on the Uni prints. Under the loupe it appears like there is less ink coalescing going on. The optimizer was set the same in both presets so maybe the inks drying or setting longer between passes has something to do with this.

 

[Ronny Axelsson]

Some more tests.

It appears that both the 18 and 20 pass modes that I added to the uni-directional 10 pass profile are in fact printing uni-directional too.
They don't get a "U" in the print mode name but I double checked and the printer only feeds when the carriage is in the left hand position.
I also measured the step size and in 10 pass mode each step is around 4.2 mm, while 18 pass feeds 2.3 mm and 20 pass 2.1 mm for each pass.
So my conclusion is that they print uni-directional and according to the specified number of passes.

So far so good.

I have also made a proper color profile for the 18p mode, in addition to the one I created for 10p, but have not had the time to do any serious tests yet.

 

[dypinc]

Some more tests.

It appears that both the 18 and 20 pass modes that I added to the uni-directional 10 pass profile are in fact printing uni-directional too.
They don't get a "U" in the print mode name but I double checked and the printer only feeds when the carriage is in the left hand position.
I also measured the step size and in 10 pass mode each step is around 4.2 mm, while 18 pass feeds 2.3 mm and 20 pass 2.1 mm for each pass.
So my conclusion is that they print uni-directional and according to the specified number of passes.

So far so good.

I have also made a proper color profile for the 18p mode, in addition to the one I created for 10p, but have not had the time to do any serious tests yet.

Good to know that on the stepping. Saves me testing that.

I also made a profile for 18p Uni with very low GCR and K start at 35. I am impressed with slightly smoother grain. Must be placing the dots more precisely even though the dot size is what it is. I also saved a linearization ramp just to compare it with a bidirectional ramp to see if there are any changes as to light ink curves etc.

 

[balstestrat]

That is definitely interesting to know if they have modified the complete profile to allow that.

 

[dypinc]

That is definitely interesting to know if they have modified the complete profile to allow that.

Here we go again using the term profile when what do you really mean? Are you talking about the Media Presets or the Output Profile? I used to harp on this years ago but it did no good. People are still calling the Media Presets and Print Modes profiles which leads to a lot of confusion.

 

[dypinc]

Figured out how to add the U in print modes. You should be able to do it from your RIP, at least I can with Caldera.

 

[Ronny Axelsson]

Thanks dypinc.
Onyx here. I'll check if I can alter the print mode names.