Window Graphics Failing

[Signature Sign Guys]

Hey Guys,

I am wondering if anyone else had graphics start to peel and curl after the heatwave? We are located in the interior of BC and we recently went thru a crazy heat wave where temps got up to 50 degrees. We had installed some laminated window perf graphics about a year ago and edge sealed with an edge tape (so its not that we did not edge seal) and the client has messaged us about the graphics starting to lift. He did mention he only noticed it when the window cleaners where there, so I am wondering if the cause was the extreme heat or if the window washers had a play in this? We have done multiple window graphics with the same perf/lam combo in the past with no issue but this is the only one that has seemed to be effected. Has anyone run into issues like this before?

 

[rjssigns]

Interesting. I used to send finished perf projects to Arizona and California and didn't have any peeling issues. Pretty good consider it was client installed.
In your case it might have been the window washers, but it may have been the window seal. Sometimes the seals can "leak" whatever they were processed with and that can affect adhesion.

 

[WB]

Window washers would be a red flag for me. Who knows what they are using for detergent/cleaner (but it's most likely reasonable) but I would also suggest to any store owner that the windows would be washed by hand with an appropriate cloth and not a large squeegee that might grab the sealed edges.
That being said the dirt and crap that seems to works it's way into windows downtown always amazes me.
Perforated is a crap shoot.

 

[neoguri]

Window washers... pretty big red flag.

I install my perf straight without edge seal tape and have yet seen one fail due to heat. I'm in Houston.. it gets quite hot and humid over here.

I do spend most of my time aggressively cleaning the window before installation, then I just lay and trim. Have not seen one fail yet. Faded- sure... I am unaware of a lamination that works right with perf, no failures except the sample in my shop... because the glass door was not cleaned right. I tell all my clients to wipe down the window ocassionally with soft towels and the most mild glass cleaner, or diluted glass cleaner. It works well enough.

 

[De.signs Nanaimo]

Sounds like the window washers started the edges lifting, kept doing the windows the same way, then the edges lifted enough for the heat to complete the job. I do let clients know to never use squeegees to clean graphics, covers my ass if the cleaners get too aggressive!

 

[ikarasu]

Hey Guys,

I am wondering if anyone else had graphics start to peel and curl after the heatwave? We are located in the interior of BC and we recently went thru a crazy heat wave where temps got up to 50 degrees. We had installed some laminated window perf graphics about a year ago and edge sealed with an edge tape (so its not that we did not edge seal) and the client has messaged us about the graphics starting to lift. He did mention he only noticed it when the window cleaners where there, so I am wondering if the cause was the extreme heat or if the window washers had a play in this? We have done multiple window graphics with the same perf/lam combo in the past with no issue but this is the only one that has seemed to be effected. Has anyone run into issues like this before?

Hows the smoke up there in kamloops?!

No issues here. We have window perf installed for years and its not curling.... We also dont edge seal it and never have any lifting issues. A quick spec check says window perf is good for up to 82C... And while it sure feels that hot, it's nowhere near it, so heat shouldnt be the issue.

what material are you using? Thats probably the culprit. Window perf isn't a long term solution... averys window perf is rated for 1 year on a vertical surface... Even 3M's super expensive perf is rated for 1 year.


https://continentalgrafix.com/produkte/panorama-innova-30-uv-40-uv-50-uv/?lang=en This is what we use for store fronts. And while it's rated for 2 years... I doubt it any better than 3M/Averys version. We do hospital graphics every 6 months, Last set was up for almost 2 years due to Covid and when we went to replace it, it was up with no peeling at all.


I'm sure most window perfs, unless it's the cheap generic stuff will last a year + ... but its rated at a year for a reason, so I wouldnt be too surprised if it does fail at a year in some cases. If they have window cleaners pressure washing it or constantly scrubbing against it, it probably sped up the edge lifting a bit.

 

[Inks]

Was the laminate cast?

 

[ewded]

If curling up is more prominent on darker areas that means outgassing time was not sufficient. The heatwave shouldn't really matter as you apply vinyl on top of bonnets as well and the're perfectly fine.

 

[Signature Sign Guys]

Hows the smoke up there in kamloops?!

No issues here. We have window perf installed for years and its not curling.... We also dont edge seal it and never have any lifting issues. A quick spec check says window perf is good for up to 82C... And while it sure feels that hot, it's nowhere near it, so heat shouldnt be the issue.

what material are you using? Thats probably the culprit. Window perf isn't a long term solution... averys window perf is rated for 1 year on a vertical surface... Even 3M's super expensive perf is rated for 1 year.


https://continentalgrafix.com/produkte/panorama-innova-30-uv-40-uv-50-uv/?lang=en This is what we use for store fronts. And while it's rated for 2 years... I doubt it any better than 3M/Averys version. We do hospital graphics every 6 months, Last set was up for almost 2 years due to Covid and when we went to replace it, it was up with no peeling at all.


I'm sure most window perfs, unless it's the cheap generic stuff will last a year + ... but its rated at a year for a reason, so I wouldnt be too surprised if it does fail at a year in some cases. If they have window cleaners pressure washing it or constantly scrubbing against it, it probably sped up the edge lifting a bit.

the smoke was baaaad for a couple weeks and we were living in a sepia tone world for a day. The rain finally came and has help out a ton so we are almost back to "normal".

For perf material we use is a contravision product which is a 2 year product but we have done jobs with the same material and they have lasted 3 years plus with no issues. I will deff look into the material you posted as I am always looking to learn more.

 

[Signature Sign Guys]

If curling up is more prominent on darker areas that means outgassing time was not sufficient. The heatwave shouldn't really matter as you apply vinyl on top of bonnets as well and the're perfectly fine.

I agree but its been over a year and I would suspect that if it was an out gassing issue that it would have happened within the first couple of months

 

[Signature Sign Guys]

Was the laminate cast?

it was a 2 year calendar lam. We have printed an in house sample print and used the exact same lam to see if anything happens to our window as a test

 

[MelloImagingTechnologies]

In Ny we have thousands of windows with perf and my customers have never had peeling.
It could be the fact that you are laminating.
The laminate is making thousands of air pockets and the air will expand when heated.
The only time my customers laminate perf is for passenger bus windows so they can still see out when it’s raining.
Bruce
Bruce@melloimaging.com

 

[Signature Sign Guys]

In Ny we have thousands of windows with perf and my customers have never had peeling.
It could be the fact that you are laminating.
The laminate is making thousands of air pockets and the air will expand when heated.
The only time my customers laminate perf is for passenger bus windows so they can still see out when it’s raining.
Bruce
Bruce@melloimaging.com

what about uv protection? I have done perf windows without lam before and I find they seem to fade fairly quick, and a lot of our clients don't necessarily want to switch them out every 6 months

 

[MelloImagingTechnologies]

That is determined by the ink you print with. If you go with an ink that meets the 3m standards, it will last years.