Texas_Signmaker
Very Active Signmaker
They said Windows 10 would be the last one....they lied. Now Windows 11 will be coming out. I just got used to 10 (after 5 years). Yall keep this in mind if you are about to make new computer purchases.
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Windows 11
- Thread starter Texas_Signmaker
- Start date
balstestrat
Problem Solver
I see them moving more towards Apple like upgrade path. Won't be a massive change and update hassle like before but smaller. Sort of the way they are already doing the bigger yearly updates.
My guess anyway.
My guess anyway.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
I can't wait! Hopefully it's as awesome as 10 was! With any luck, it will automatically shut down for updates every single night rather than randomly so I can lose whatever I was working on more often and spend every morning getting stuff rolled back.
Vinyl slayer
New Member
They are going back to Vista. Give it another go.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
which was still better than win10
decalman
New Member
Windows
Windows 11 is exclusively for people that didn't get the jab.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
balstestrat
Problem Solver
But you need the microchips for the new government login system.
jochwat
Graphics Department
Vista? XP? Windows 3? Why stop the regression there? Go back s'more! Back in MY day, we didn't need no megabytes or gigabytes! Didn't even have to start up or shut down! Just hit the power switch and you're ready to go! And when you're done, hit it again and it's off and you can go about your day, folding up your tractor-fed, perforated PrintShop banners to deliver to your... wall. Yeah... screw these OS updates! What do we want? AN END TO INNOVATION! When do we want it? FOREVER!
JWitkowski
New Member
Wasn't the Blue Screen of Death one of Microsoft's earliest innovations?
jochwat
Graphics Department
I was going to mention how it has been many years since seeing the Blue Screen of Death, but I wouldn't want to jinx myself...
Aunt LuLu
Aunt LuLu
Since this topic started I have been thinking alot about it. With my business that has grown from 1 home embroidery machine in NYS and now in PA- 1 embroidery machine, 1 vinyl cutter & 1 30" print & cut machines. I actually moved my business with me and was required to have a handicap accessible space for the business, not cheap in anyway. I have never been a very busy business as coming from a very rural area and having a job (duty) develop over the years for older members of the family. My husband and I took that job on willing, a dedication to my older family members even after their death.
Windows 10 created many struggles for me, this meant some of my computer programs needed to be upgraded with a significant cost. Then the continual upgrades for Corel Draw as some artwork is in the WMF & EMF formats. One artwork company said either purchase our NEW artwork or good-bye - it is the same artwork, so I said NO. Besides extra cost, the new versions of Corel Draw, translates into a learning curve for me. This is difficult, I really want to learn the software I have. I have gone backwards to Corel 2017 as that is the last complete version I have. Also, found a "windows 7" laptop I had with Corel Draw X6 installed.
The laptop I am using is an OMEN (not cheap) it updated Windows 10 on Monday, today is Thursday and it wants to update again.
I have had it with "new versions" of anything! Where is the efficiency in these new versions?
Laura - Aunt LuLu (Aunt LuLu's Embroidery)
Windows 10 created many struggles for me, this meant some of my computer programs needed to be upgraded with a significant cost. Then the continual upgrades for Corel Draw as some artwork is in the WMF & EMF formats. One artwork company said either purchase our NEW artwork or good-bye - it is the same artwork, so I said NO. Besides extra cost, the new versions of Corel Draw, translates into a learning curve for me. This is difficult, I really want to learn the software I have. I have gone backwards to Corel 2017 as that is the last complete version I have. Also, found a "windows 7" laptop I had with Corel Draw X6 installed.
The laptop I am using is an OMEN (not cheap) it updated Windows 10 on Monday, today is Thursday and it wants to update again.
I have had it with "new versions" of anything! Where is the efficiency in these new versions?
Laura - Aunt LuLu (Aunt LuLu's Embroidery)
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
Yet another reason why I am glad that I no longer have to deal with Windows or Mac anymore as far as production goes (I still run Windows in VMs, even 10 (I run 98, Vista, 7, 8.1 and 10 on one computer, but the internet is denied to them (I just mentioned that since there was talk about the older systems), either for retro use or if I need to use mingw for some reason). As an embroiderer that has been doing this since the mid 90s, I can understand Laura's plight (perhaps more then others, I have gone through many iterations of Wilcom, Wings, PE-Designs, DRAWings etc over the years went from Windows 3 to 7 (as far as for my work) with a Mac thrown in there as well from time to time, not so much with production machines(as in embroidery machines) though).
Not everything that is new, is better then the previous generation, especially when it comes to production (ironically, this is coming from someone that uses a semi rolling release OS). I see a lot of people upgrade just have the latest and supposedly greatest. Only to have bugs that may or may not get fixed by someone else, because the bug that you are dealing with doesn't affect enough people to make it worth fixing, but it can be a pretty significant bug for "you".
I think the yearly major versioning changes that most commercial software vendors (and even with OS, but in MS case its 2 big updates) is where the mistake comes in and also have it mandated (remember, each major "version" of Windows 10 is only good for 18 months and that's from original release, not when "you" may have gotten it, weeks later sometimes). If vendors were really concerned with making sure people had security and bug fixes, just mandate those, WITHOUT the major changes that new features, deprecations bring with the major updates.
As far as software goes, this is going to be the case from here on out. As long as people still buy into it, it'll be the major thing. Ironically, as much as I despise subscription based software (although my likely hood of participating is still not going to be high), I would much rather at this point have it all browser based that way the major updates of the OS are less likely to affect it and and the updates are kept on the server for the programs. Thankfully, with WASM able to get a lot better RAM usage done in the browser as well (Maya is able to run totally in the browser after all).
Ironically, good ideas can be made bad by poor implementations. While I have no love for automatic updates, I'm still one of those that believes updates are necessary, be it for individual programs or the OS (especially with Windows due to the sheer amount of legacy code that is still in there). I just firmly believe that the time and place for updates should be left up to the person having to deal with them as they are going to have to be the ones that have to do troubleshooting if something goes wrong and that can make for an inefficient work day if something went wrong. Downside is that people may not upgrade at all, but that's their choice to make as well.
Not everything that is new, is better then the previous generation, especially when it comes to production (ironically, this is coming from someone that uses a semi rolling release OS). I see a lot of people upgrade just have the latest and supposedly greatest. Only to have bugs that may or may not get fixed by someone else, because the bug that you are dealing with doesn't affect enough people to make it worth fixing, but it can be a pretty significant bug for "you".
I think the yearly major versioning changes that most commercial software vendors (and even with OS, but in MS case its 2 big updates) is where the mistake comes in and also have it mandated (remember, each major "version" of Windows 10 is only good for 18 months and that's from original release, not when "you" may have gotten it, weeks later sometimes). If vendors were really concerned with making sure people had security and bug fixes, just mandate those, WITHOUT the major changes that new features, deprecations bring with the major updates.
As far as software goes, this is going to be the case from here on out. As long as people still buy into it, it'll be the major thing. Ironically, as much as I despise subscription based software (although my likely hood of participating is still not going to be high), I would much rather at this point have it all browser based that way the major updates of the OS are less likely to affect it and and the updates are kept on the server for the programs. Thankfully, with WASM able to get a lot better RAM usage done in the browser as well (Maya is able to run totally in the browser after all).
Ironically, good ideas can be made bad by poor implementations. While I have no love for automatic updates, I'm still one of those that believes updates are necessary, be it for individual programs or the OS (especially with Windows due to the sheer amount of legacy code that is still in there). I just firmly believe that the time and place for updates should be left up to the person having to deal with them as they are going to have to be the ones that have to do troubleshooting if something goes wrong and that can make for an inefficient work day if something went wrong. Downside is that people may not upgrade at all, but that's their choice to make as well.
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
I was doing a little bit of reading on everything.
Wasn't Win 10X supposed to be shipping this year on hardware?
I have to wonder if this is a continuation of that. If it is, the tinfoil hat person in me is not going to like how things go. It had some positives, but it also had some concerns. Of course, Win 10 had an EOL since it came out in 2015. I'm surprised people weren't prepared for a new version, after all, why did MS always have an EOL for it, if it was their last planned version?
I would imagine that 11 is going to be more locked down and certainly more online then offline, maybe even so much as with the installation as well, have to sign in to an MS account during the install phase. I would imagine that they are going to take a chapter from the App Store and Google Play book and have the apps that "you" would be able to install go thru there. Which makes me wonder if one is going to be able to install all that legacy software from discs/ISOs/direct downloads anymore. Maybe there will be a virtualization layer (which would help with locking things down in a sandbox). May still be able to get away with portable/binary archive programs though, since there won't be a system wide installation.
If I'm not mistaken (if this is going to be a replacement for 10X), that the windows partition was read only (and your library was on a different partition, one of the pros for this system in my book), which means no mucking around with atleast the host file (which Windows was starting to ignore anyway (this was one of the methods that early win10 update blocking programs uses). How much editing are we going to be able to do with regedit (not for the layman, but certainly a needed option for specific needs)? While it still may be possible, I would at least for see those options being buried even further.
The one thing that makes me really concerned is Windows/File Explorer. Is it going to be built around One Drive? I know the wife's work computer, it's heavily integrated now (not just specific drives/folders, but the entire system), it would be very easy to make that system wide from the get go. Especially since it appears that they are getting rid of the old 9x style shell (which on one hand is a good thing as that brings a whole lotta legacy bloat/vulnerabilities) and doing something new from the ground up.
A lot of this is dependent on how much Win 11 is going to be like 10X. The timing of 10X being scrapped and this, makes me question it, but it could just be a coincidence, but a lot of things are going more browser based, shoot even the programs that I write, I write them for Webview (Linux, but can target for Mac as well) and Webview2 (MS only) for the UI.
"Hello, dummy terminal my old friend. Been a long time."
Wasn't Win 10X supposed to be shipping this year on hardware?
I have to wonder if this is a continuation of that. If it is, the tinfoil hat person in me is not going to like how things go. It had some positives, but it also had some concerns. Of course, Win 10 had an EOL since it came out in 2015. I'm surprised people weren't prepared for a new version, after all, why did MS always have an EOL for it, if it was their last planned version?
I would imagine that 11 is going to be more locked down and certainly more online then offline, maybe even so much as with the installation as well, have to sign in to an MS account during the install phase. I would imagine that they are going to take a chapter from the App Store and Google Play book and have the apps that "you" would be able to install go thru there. Which makes me wonder if one is going to be able to install all that legacy software from discs/ISOs/direct downloads anymore. Maybe there will be a virtualization layer (which would help with locking things down in a sandbox). May still be able to get away with portable/binary archive programs though, since there won't be a system wide installation.
If I'm not mistaken (if this is going to be a replacement for 10X), that the windows partition was read only (and your library was on a different partition, one of the pros for this system in my book), which means no mucking around with atleast the host file (which Windows was starting to ignore anyway (this was one of the methods that early win10 update blocking programs uses). How much editing are we going to be able to do with regedit (not for the layman, but certainly a needed option for specific needs)? While it still may be possible, I would at least for see those options being buried even further.
The one thing that makes me really concerned is Windows/File Explorer. Is it going to be built around One Drive? I know the wife's work computer, it's heavily integrated now (not just specific drives/folders, but the entire system), it would be very easy to make that system wide from the get go. Especially since it appears that they are getting rid of the old 9x style shell (which on one hand is a good thing as that brings a whole lotta legacy bloat/vulnerabilities) and doing something new from the ground up.
A lot of this is dependent on how much Win 11 is going to be like 10X. The timing of 10X being scrapped and this, makes me question it, but it could just be a coincidence, but a lot of things are going more browser based, shoot even the programs that I write, I write them for Webview (Linux, but can target for Mac as well) and Webview2 (MS only) for the UI.
"Hello, dummy terminal my old friend. Been a long time."
Texas_Signmaker
Very Active Signmaker
Pauly
Printrade.com.au
Absolutely nothing wrong with updates. If you want to sit there in the past and not update your software, firmware or operating system, then you'll not receive any improvement, bug fixes, and security updates.
For all the software i use, if i was still using the same version from 2015, i would not be capable to do what we do today.
If your laptop needs an update. So be it. what's the big deal? you don't want security updates?
SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
Updates can often break old software which may no longer have support for newer versions of Windows. Or another example... Windows 10 21H1 broke my Epson accounting software for no reason whatsoever. The program runs fine, but will no longer gather any information from the printer after a job is complete. Lucky for me I had a bad feeling that the update would break something so imaged the entire machine and found the issue after a couple of days so was able to easily restore it and get it working again. I feel sorry for those with low IT knowledge as this is not something they should need to be worrying about.
Also, updates for the sake of keeping themselves in a job irritate me to no end.
I have no problems installing security updates, but wondering where the Start menu will be located in the next version of Windows gets frustrating every few years.
Also, updates for the sake of keeping themselves in a job irritate me to no end.
I have no problems installing security updates, but wondering where the Start menu will be located in the next version of Windows gets frustrating every few years.
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
The problem, in my mind, is the forced major updates, where they bring in major "improvements", that's where people may have issues from one version to the next and this happens twice yearly.
Also keep in mind, in MSs great wisdom, they got rid of their internal QA team. And some things that are flagged as issues, still make it through to what the masses get outside of the insider program. While not everyone has had this issues, that doesn't mean that a good portion of the population hasn't. My dad has had issues with every major version update that has come out and he doesn't run niche software like we do, nor does he really make changes to the system that some of us would do as well and he even had issues with MSs own branded software and updates of the OS. Now that says something.
As to Win 11, visually, as a heavy KDE user, I can see the influence (or knockoff), especially of the Chinese with the heavily deepin inspired UI. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad that they went the KDE direction versus the Gnome direction. The integration of PowerRun (from their Power Toys addon program) is nice, I make use of Krunner (quite a bit older then the one that even Mac users have had) to the point that I no longer have an application launcher at all on my desktop (not even hidden). I do think that there has been some improvements in efficiently like that that even though MS is late the party for, if users would give them a shot, it really would make some things more efficient for them (I personally never understood the bellyaching over the start menu, but then again I fought with Gnome, so going without a traditional start menu isn't all that big of a deal, mainly mental).
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
Hmmm, anyone see the requirements for Win 11. Kinda got a little restrictive, make sure if "you" are going to go this route that your computer is actually able to do so. Now there is chance that a requirement is meet, but has to turned on in the bios to take advantage of it.
Fun fact, due to the requirements, one module picked up quite a bit of demand. Went from $24.99 per to $99.99 per as people are scalping in prep for the increased demand due to those that think that they have to always be on the latest and greatest.
Fun fact, due to the requirements, one module picked up quite a bit of demand. Went from $24.99 per to $99.99 per as people are scalping in prep for the increased demand due to those that think that they have to always be on the latest and greatest.