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Need Help Applying Heat to Glass

DPD

New Member
I guess the easiest solution is to use this as a learning experience. Tell them an hour and time yourself. Take a pic of the job print it out and write the time it takes on the sheet. Then you know for next time. Eat the extra labor if it takes you longer. Then you have a good idea for the next job. Sometimes that's just what you have to do if it's something new you are doing. The first guy just gets a deal and the next guy pays the correct price. I've done that with several different jobs that are new to me.

I have a habit of over-estimating my time. In another life I was a computer programmer. When I moved into computer consulting the client would ask "how long?". The rule of thumb is typically to take my number and triple it. I guess I never got out of that habit because I find I'm either right on the money with my time estimates or I'm over. Rarely am I under.

I also have my own rule of thumb: be nice to myself. If I'm going to estimate it is going to be in my favor. Sure, you win some and lose some but then again if you're winning them all then your prices are too low.

This particular job has a five other signs that are not vinyl which I'm quoting on. When that happens, by default the risk is spread out mathematically so although its great to be precise sometimes, in this case it is unnecessary. The thread sort of took on a life of its own when I mentioned my first guess at time to remove a letter but what I really was trying to figure out if its advisable to heat glass to soften the adhesive on vinyl prior to removing it. In the past, I've always used heat and then I remembered reading somewhere that glass and heat don't get along. Another fella I know has told me that his $200 job turned into a $2000 job when the glass he was working on cracked.

After asking around I find that some do and some don't. Some will and some won't. What I've found really interesting is more than one person mentioned a torch. From what I've learned that would direct heat to a specific area of the glass and increase the odds of the glass cracking.

This industry of ours never ceases to amaze me because there's no set pricing, no set methodologies; just a catch as catch can. When it comes to pricing, I sometimes wonder how many of us work from gross profit margins and how many 'wing it'.

Stay well.
- denis
 

petepaz

New Member
i normally just go with razor scrapers and elbow grease as mentioned already. i've done 4ft x 10ft window and no real issue. now i have seen some people use steamers and that has worked pretty good (at least in the video) maybe that's an option. not as high temp as using a heat gun or torch.
 

DPD

New Member
i normally just go with razor scrapers and elbow grease as mentioned already. i've done 4ft x 10ft window and no real issue. now i have seen some people use steamers and that has worked pretty good (at least in the video) maybe that's an option. not as high temp as using a heat gun or torch.

My plan is to do this on a hot sunny day. I'll bring my plastic and metal razors and go to town on it. After that there's an aluminum sign where I'm doing the same thing but I don't mind heating that up. Worst thing is when the arthritis sets in while I'm chiseling away. Then.... it's time for a break.
 

Billct2

Active Member
One of the risks with heat is a pre-existing but invisible crack will expand and become your problem
 

petepaz

New Member
My plan is to do this on a hot sunny day. I'll bring my plastic and metal razors and go to town on it. After that there's an aluminum sign where I'm doing the same thing but I don't mind heating that up. Worst thing is when the arthritis sets in while I'm chiseling away. Then.... it's time for a break.

this ladies and gentlemen is why i have tendinitis that can kill a horse...haha
no really my elbows are on fire 90% of the time...:(
(actually i have addressed the problem and have it under control but this career we have chosen can do a job on the elbows, wrists and hands for sure)
 

Stacey K

I like making signs
this ladies and gentlemen is why i have tendinitis that can kill a horse...haha
no really my elbows are on fire 90% of the time...:(
(actually i have addressed the problem and have it under control but this career we have chosen can do a job on the elbows, wrists and hands for sure)
I totally agree! Removing the logo and a couple tag lines from a 24' trailer turns into an all day job for me because I have to take breaks.
 

gnubler

Active Member
I'm new, so still 'winging it'. I have a problem of underestimating my time on removals & installs...it's getting better.
 

rjssigns

Active Member
I'm new, so still 'winging it'. I have a problem of underestimating my time on removals & installs...it's getting better.

For removals I tell client it's per hour plus materials. If they aren't comfortable with that I walk. Far too easy to underestimate the time some removals will take, even on glass. Did a job a while back to remove game store graphics from glass. Not sure what material they used but it was brutal, even with steam on a stupid hot day. That was about as much fun as removing chrome vinyl from a dumptruck. Fortunately the client agreed to the per hour rate. He also saw how much I had to work. Said he was glad he didn't try it.
 

DPD

New Member
For removals I tell client it's per hour plus materials. If they aren't comfortable with that I walk. Far too easy to underestimate the time some removals will take, even on glass. Did a job a while back to remove game store graphics from glass. Not sure what material they used but it was brutal, even with steam on a stupid hot day. That was about as much fun as removing chrome vinyl from a dumptruck. Fortunately the client agreed to the per hour rate. He also saw how much I had to work. Said he was glad he didn't try it.

I find its difficult to get the hourly gig from larger companies - at least the ones I've worked with. They all seem to want to know in advance so I do my best but always lean to favoring myself rather than doing the job on the cheap and losing money. I find that hourly is the fairest for everyone. I'm half hoping I don't get this job because like I said, the arthritis kicks in after a while of chiseling and the fingers lock up for a while. I'm semi-retired anyway and promised myself not to do any more installations but I"m seeing some good money on this one gig that I thought I'd go out on a high note.
 

rjssigns

Active Member
I find its difficult to get the hourly gig from larger companies - at least the ones I've worked with. They all seem to want to know in advance so I do my best but always lean to favoring myself rather than doing the job on the cheap and losing money. I find that hourly is the fairest for everyone. I'm half hoping I don't get this job because like I said, the arthritis kicks in after a while of chiseling and the fingers lock up for a while. I'm semi-retired anyway and promised myself not to do any more installations but I"m seeing some good money on this one gig that I thought I'd go out on a high note.

I hear that. Tired old bones/knees/back don't like digging holes, climbing ladders or crawling around. Spent 26 years on a concrete floor. I'm paying for it now.
 

DeadDoc

New Member
I guess the easiest solution is to use this as a learning experience. Tell them an hour and time yourself. Take a pic of the job print it out and write the time it takes on the sheet. Then you know for next time. Eat the extra labor if it takes you longer. Then you have a good idea for the next job. Sometimes that's just what you have to do if it's something new you are doing. The first guy just gets a deal and the next guy pays the correct price. I've done that with several different jobs that are new to me.
The next elevator job I do is getting one insane quote if they need removal. Took 4 days for swapping out vinyl wrap with two people! The vinyl would not remove itself and it left way to much adhesive behind.
 

DPD

New Member
The next elevator job I do is getting one insane quote if they need removal. Took 4 days for swapping out vinyl wrap with two people! The vinyl would not remove itself and it left way to much adhesive behind.

Yup, y'gotta be good to yourself when doing quotes and as fair as you can be given the circumstances. On this particular job (I'm the OP by the way), I sent in the quote with a price for removing the vinyl based upon what I believe it takes to do the job and then a note saying that the estimate will be revised if it takes longer. At least its fair for the customer and most importantly, me.
 

PrintQueen

New Member
When they saw what rapid remover did as opposed to soap and water they were using for glue residual they declared me their king.
rapid remover is a gift from the print gods - i've got a project coming up this week for 9 sets of windows at our local airport, and I'm a little nervous about removal - going to equip myself with razors - will probably use your idea of a sheet rock knife, and the handy rapid remover and hope for the best!
 
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