Auto Body Customer

[Sign Up Graphics]

What would you charge per Sq.Ft. for cutting vinyl and apply application tape only. I have a PITA customer and he provided the vinyl material.

Greatly appreciated your help!

 

[tomence]

I would not do it. This is crazy bringing their own vinyl.

 

[nashvillesigns]

+1

 

[TXFB.INS]

customer supplied vinyl is the same price as the vinyl off your wall.

same amount of time to cut, weed, transfer.

 

[Gino]

When's the last time you took your eggs and bacon to the diner and told him how to make it ?? Use your own toast and butter.

I'd look at him and ask him.... are you frickin' stoopid or just plain dumb ?? Cause ya can't be serious........

 

[rjssigns]

If under an hour charge 1 hour at your current shop rate. Anything over gets charged shop rate in 15 minute increments.

We print for others and some bring their own strange materials that we would never stock. If they are a regular client they get per square foot charges. Works for both of us.

Probably wasn't much help, but I tried.

 

[Pat Whatley]

If there is any difference in your prices between using your vinyl and using his it should be the cost of the vinyl ONLY. The vinyl is the cheapest part of the deal.

Kills me when people bring in their own vinyl and expect me to knock 75% off my price.

Price depends on letter size. Cutting and weeding 18" letters is a whole lot easier than cutting and weeding 1" letters.

 

[rjssigns]

I would not do it. This is crazy bringing their own vinyl.

Why?

You already "lost" the job.
This way you can at least get a piece of it and it could lead to more work if you don't jerk the guy around.

I noticed Gino's post too. To each his own, but the more I thought about it I wish everybody would bring me material to work with. No more inventory and the associated carrying costs.
I would be guaranteed of having the EXACT material the client wanted to use.
Like Pat said the vinyl is the smallest part of it.

This was post was presented as another point of view. Although I am sure there will be the requisite bashing.
As I stated in other threads: What works for me may be completely wrong for your business model.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

When's the last time you took your eggs and bacon to the diner and told him how to make it ?? Use your own toast and butter.

There are a couple of places that actively promote that they do that. One for meats and another place that does fish that way as well.

It really isn't that much different then someone supplying the shirts and I do the embroidery work (I do have caveats though, which is the same reason(s) why some embroidery shops don't do that type of work period).

 

[Gino]

No, not a bashing, but some common sense.

So the guy brings his own vinyl, next they'll bring their own paint and inks. Bring in the boards and bring the vinyl for digital printing cause like you said.... no more inventory.... just someone else's inventory..... lousy inventory. Wood from Lowes and the local hardware store. Inks for your desktop printer, not your inkjet. You're gonna be talkin' up a storm explaining how to do this stuff, just to save them the cheapest part of the deal. Time's money and evidently, talking, discussing and arguing with a customer doesn't count in your neck of the woods.

They bring the wrong kind of material for the job and you want to correct him on now going back and purchasing the correct media. Yeah, right, like that's gonna happen. You'll end up wasting more time talking and arguing with people when in fact.... you're the professional and know what to use.... they all think its all the same stuff, just use it. Are you gonna put a buyer beware waiver on each and every job and wait for them to come back and complain ?? Sure, waste more time explaining again, how they cheaped out on themselves.

Unless you're running a small beans operation, I don't see how anyone would bring their own stuff for you to use. I think back to when we hand-lettered everything. If someone had brought me latex paint to letter their truck or given me construction paper to screen print their job signs, I'd a laughed right in the faces. I had one guy bring me a 2 rolls of vinyl, cause he had gone to a competitor of ours and the guy had ordered two 50 yard rolls for his job. It came in, the game closed his doors and gave the customer his vinyl and told him to look for another shop. He came to us and I did the job and kept the remainder plus we got paid to do his truck. The one and only time I can remember doing it. I felt sorry for him.

What is the mindset that puts the burden of supplying the sign shop with the correct materials to create a sign that is fire retardant or weather durable and not have any responsibility to do a job ?? Where is a customer gonna get the correct ballasts and LED's for their signs ??

So, as in my earlier post, I take it you take all the brake calipers to repair your automobile or oxygen sensors for your catalytic convertor to your mechanic.... or you take the food you want to your favorite restaurant, except for Mc'Ds or Arby's ??

How lazy can we get as professionals.... or don't we all feel we are professionals ??

 

[Gino]

There are a couple of places that actively promote that they do that. One for meats and another place that does fish that way as well.

It really isn't that much different then someone supplying the shirts and I do the embroidery work (I do have caveats though, which is the same reason(s) why some embroidery shops don't do that type of work period).

As the norm, it doesn't happen. I'll bet you could visit 100 restaurants and you'll be hard pressed to say you found one that will cook your food.

As for customers supplying their own outerwear.... not often. When we screened shirts and other thing, we basically told them, we'd rather print on our own stuff. That way we didn't have to ask them for 10% overage for mistakes. When we sandblasted gifts like wedding toasting glasses or mirrors, we never accepted customers stuff for one main reason.... I could not control the quality of the glass they bought. Learned that lesson very early on. Most stuff you buy in the store has so many air bubbles, not seen to the naked eye, will pop right in the middle of blasting a glass.

Nope, I can't see the advantage to having people drop off anything other than a vehicle, door, awning or other items which you have no control over.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

As for customers supplying their own outerwear.... not often. When we screened shirts and other thing, we basically told them, we'd rather print on our own stuff.

How long ago was that? You might have been out of the "game" for quite awhile. I even get a fair amount of S101 people that want to do that. A lot more embroidery places offer that service then those that do not. There are still some that won't offer that, but they are more that do then do not.

There are a lot of differences in embroidery compared to other industries that at times can bite the big one even more so then you would think that happens with signs.

That way we didn't have to ask them for 10% overage for mistakes.

They have a choice. Either it's provide overage or if a mistake happens, a mistake happens and they have to provide another one or they accept the lower item count.

Nope, I can't see the advantage to having people drop off anything other than a vehicle, door, awning or other items which you have no control over.

For my retail customers, I charge extra if it's supplied by them. Most of the time my wholesale customers either don't do that or they confirm with me the ones that they are going to get.

 

[Mikeifg]

It's getting to the point where it's no fun an non profitable anymore with people like that. Plus all the do-it yourself designers.

 

[TheSnowman]

If anyone wants me to use their stuff, or wants me to use anything other than normal stuff, they normally pay twice what it'd be for normal materials. Normally they come around, but sometimes they don't and it's worth my while.

Same reason I sell a blank sign, a step stake, and a sharpie for $20 or a sign I do for $25.

 

[Gino]

How long ago was that? You might have been out of the "game" for quite awhile. I even get a fair amount of S101 people that want to do that. A lot more embroidery places offer that service then those that do not. There are still some that won't offer that, but they are more that do then do not.

A few years since we've done it. In fact, we hardly do any textiles at all. Doing s101'ers is a totally different story. I thought we were talking about end-users.

There are a lot of differences in embroidery compared to other industries that at times can bite the big one even more so then you would think that happens with signs.

If you're saying customers supply their own stuff, then it must be the thing to do, just doesn't make any sense to let them do it. I guess the difference is... if you let them, they will and then you have to continue doing so.



They have a choice. Either it's provide overage or if a mistake happens, a mistake happens and they have to provide another one or they accept the lower item count.

Again, that doesn't make any sense, unless your doing one or two at a time. If you're running 5,000 polo shirts and they supply you with only enough to squeak by and you mess some up.... how long do you have to wait for them to replace them and you have to start all over again to do 14 shirts ?? Seems a little backwards for profit making. They're gonna pay extra for more shirts you messed up and pay extra for the second run ?? Seems like they might not ever come back



For my retail customers, I charge extra if it's supplied by them. Most of the time my wholesale customers either don't do that or they confirm with me the ones that they are going to get.



So, you DO charge a penalty for doing this. Now we're talking. You actually do try to discourage it. I thought it sounded dumb for this to be a normal practice.

nuff said........

 

[Sign Up Graphics]

Sign Up Graphics

Thanks for your help all. :signs101:

 

[WildWestDesigns]

It's more of a survival thing to at least offer the service. If y'all think signs has been inundated with shops, imagine the embroidery trade, even more so.

Yes, I do charge a penalty for doing this to my retail customers and yes most of my retail customers are 1 or 2 items, I think the most was 6 for a retail customer, so they are "hot" runs.

But yes, I would say at least 51% of the time (definitely to qualify being able to say more often then not), it is normal practice to accept end-user supplied garments for embroidery. Rather or not there is a penalty assessed, I don't know the break down of that. I'm inclined to doubt that a lot of places do that, just because of the demographics of this trade as it is.

This is not applicable to your long production runs, only to the short "hot" runs.

I would say 98% of the time, this is a none issue, just a formality to mention and have them sign that they acknowledge what it means to supplier their own goods for embroidery.

 

[rjssigns]

Gino,

I don't place the burden of supplies on my clients. SPECIFIC individuals, bring me SPECIALIZED products that I print on or weld/assemble.

My post was a "blue sky" deal and you missed the point and not everything is as cut and dried as you would like to think. It is all about the money and the individuals ability or inability to exploit various revenue generating techniques.

Maybe I should not think out loud in the presence of your omnipotence regarding all things sign related. But I won't.

BTW My weld shop does just fine with clients bringing me everything I need to put their products together. It is the business model I developed to suit my skills and the needs of the clientele. Also there are times I go to their shop and use all their equipment, electricity, etc... I'm sure this is anathema to you.

I'd like to stick around and discuss this further, but I have to prepare for afternoon class.

 

[Kottwitz-Graphics]

I'd look at him and ask him.... are you frickin' stoopid or just plain dumb ?? Cause ya can't be serious........

Funny thing is I could somehow see Gino actually saying that to a customer...

Personally, I'd tell them that I either supply the material, or it would cost them double what I'd normally charge...

Because you know, if you do it with their material, and when it falls off the wall, then your to blame...and they will tell everybody how you screwed it up...

 

[Gino]

Okay, you guys win. You're right, this model of doing business is practically taboo for me, but if it works for you, then git 'r done.

The thing neither of you are acknowledging is a simple fact..... I was saying not to set a business practice up doing this and that many don't do this.

Both of you have changed, or at least changed your tune as to how and why it works in a rather limited occurrences.

WildWest.... my ability to embroider is about nil. My uncle.... and now his daughter and son run the show, would do literally thousands upon thousands of garments per order. Their warehouse was always full of orders going out. They had accounts around the world and large ones at that. So, no, I've never associated with an embroidery shop that does one and two. In fact, around the town I live in, all of the shops have minimums. I think the least you can get is like a dozen. If I had to get one or two shirts done, I'd have no idea of where to look. So, perhaps when doing one at a time, quality control is far easier not to have mistakes. I might have to look you up for only a few. Even my cousin won't do a small order for me.

For rjs.... yes, I was talking signs, not welding, but in all of the fab shops around here, again.... ya gotta go with what the guy will do and not many let you bring your own stuff, unless you are doing custom work.

So, yes, I had a guy bring in his satellite dish and we wrapped it. Some guy brought in a mirror and we sandblasted it. We had people bring in toy chests, bed-frames, ceiling tiles and many other things and we painted or printed on it, but we told them upfront it is not the normal way and if something goes wrong, we can't be held responsible.

I guess when you said you would rather have customers bring you everything, I took you at your word that you meant what you said. I didn't realize you had stipulations which in turn saying they got what they wanted by bringing in what they wanted had yet another set of meanings.

I believe it is safe to understand there are always going to be exceptions to all the rules and all the business models out there, but to make broad statements, like this is a better way than the norm, didn't seem like a 'blue sky' kinda deal at all. It sounded like you wanted this to be your 100% normal transaction. That's all I was commenting on.

Believe me, nothing is Black & White in my world. Nothing at all.

If there's one thing I've learned in business and in life, it's to roll with the punches, but don't get into a brawl where punches are everywhere. Control your environment and you'll have a much easier day of it.