Bending Over Backward for Customers

[mountainmang]

It is more when I hear things like: "Figure out how to make it work or I'll find someone who can." that make me wonder if I wouldn't be better off serving coffee at starbuck's for only half a dollar less an hour.

i'm pretty much guessing your boss berates you in other ways than the threatening statement above. it's doubtful this will change and here's what's gonna happen...you're going to take it and maybe even try to address it in a reasonable way but one day you'll have enough and BOOM!, explode, leave and be high and dry without a job. knowing how this person is, you owe it to yourself to explore other opportunities and keep an iron in the fire

 

[pchronotron]

Well thanks for all the input. Anything else anyone wants to add is welcome, though if you pose any questions directly to me please don't think I'm ignoring you. At this point I really need to make some head way on my backlog.

 

[Brandon708]

just a sidenote in this recent economy we are facing i know a sign company that put out an add for a position such as yours (designer, operator of 2 printers and a cutter at the same time, quoting duties, phone duties, and some assembly) pay offered was $9.85 per hour no benefits, college degree required minimum 5yrs experience. they received over 2500 applications in less than 2 weeks. the job market out there is not good even if you have the skills to pay the bills.

WOW. thats asking a TON for $9.85
That does show you how many people are willing to work. But like most a lot of them have no "sign shop" experiance. Mostly designers and people just willing to do anything.

 

[Carolina Girl]

There's always two sides....

Being a shop owner, I can see the employer's point of view. With the current economy, business possibly slowing, and taxes at the point of being raised, many employers had to make decisions on who to keep and who to let go; by you still being there should tell you something. OK, so you are being worked hard, who doesn't. Life is not a joy ride, we learn from our experiences and use them in future situations. So the grass looks greener elsewhere, why not give it a try but work is work no matter where you are.

I've gone through many employees who would rather text, use cell phones, take many smoke breaks, check personnal e-mails on work computers, surf the internet and quite literally get out of any job if they could. I haven't had one employee yet who has worked as hard as you say you have, and if I did I would let them know how appreciated they are.

All I can say is, we all get burned out at some point but integrity shows when we hunker down and keep moving. As an employer, I would really appreciate and seriously consider the situation if my employee came and had an ernest talk with me; maybe you should give it a try. If your boss snubs you, then you'll have your answer.

Carolina Girl

 

[ericmitchell29]

Design actually I think is where you make your money / sale. My customers come back because of the past designs... I can design any paper product... get it printed so cheap these days and not have to get a bit of ink on my hands. In fact it is a pretty big part of my sign shop business to offer paper products.

Design is very important and one of the few areas that no matter how cheap the competition gets on signs... banners whatever... a decent customer, one worth keeping, will return because of that very reason.

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

WOW. thats asking a TON for $9.85
That does show you how many people are willing to work. But like most a lot of them have no "sign shop" experiance. Mostly designers and people just willing to do anything.

just to clarify. i was asked by the company that was hiring to help write the ad, to come up with a list of questions that would help to prove the candidates knowledge of the industry, a small test, as well as i helped plan a few projects for a day of a working interview for final candidates.

the 2,500+ applicants WERE the 'experienced' candidates...some pushed the limits (ad agency sales people, window dressers for dept stores, students with design degrees, etc) but the vast majority had sign experience. there was at least double that amount of applications in total when you included the non experienced that could not follow the basic directions of the ad.

so just a word of warning if you are hiring in this economy. get a blind box through the newspaper. create a separate email address preferably with an address that does not identify your actual company or you will be bombarded and set up a separate phone number for this purpose (even if it is a prepaid cell phone) this company that was hiring did not anticipate this response even though i warned them against it and they are still being bombarded with applicants 2 months after the ad was run, not to mention teh constant interuptions they had when the ad was running by resourceful ppl that could figure out what company it was and simply walked in throug the front door.

this position was in a city of 76,719 but it is a neighboring city of a major metropolitan area.

 

[Bigdawg]

Wow Dan. We were looking for some part time help a little while back and of the very few that applied - most had skill sets that we didn't need (electrical installers, wrap installers). We had maybe 50 apps and/or phone calls... and of that we found 3 possibly qualified people...

 

[pchronotron]

Well on my lunch break so just taking a quick second to address all the employers who've responded. I can appreciate the position owners in that their hourly paid employees will never feel the sting of coming up short for the bills. But at the same time I'm just as invested in being employed as they are in turning a profit. I've got student loans and a home mortgage of my own. I need to be consistently employed and I'm willing to meet any challenge I need to to make ends meet. I appreciate that these are lean times and feel lucky to have what has been a reliable paycheck.

That said there comes a point as an employer you have to stop and look at what you're doing. Have you downsized too much? Have you piled on too many duties than can reasonably be handled at once? Are times really that tight when your employees have so much on their plate they don't have time to give individual tasks the due diligence you want? Especially in my case where overtime is not allowed. Eventually times get good again and you want to make sure that the only reason your employees work for you isn't because they don't have a choice at the moment.

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

not for a moment am i saying those 2500 were 'qualified'...of that number there was probably 15% that could truly say they met all of the requirments of the ad that was placed. there were a lot of people that had operated the equipment (plotters and printers in non sign environments grocery stores, car dealers, people who owned their own equipment and didnt make it, etc.)

of that percentage there was about 100 candidates that were very interesting, it came down to a hard decision between 10 candidates and the company ended up hiring 2 people..one has worked out one did not. the one that worked out is now making $14.00 per hour in a market that 5 yrs ago would have paid $20-25 per hour with a small benefits package....times are rough

 

[Marlene]

I keep re-reading your first post and I am having a hard time with what it is that you are having issues with. you design and run a machine. you got a file in done in Publisher that was compatible. that's your job to know that. do you have an acceptable file type list that customer's can reference? they can't guess at what you can or can not use, some one needs to make that info clear. suggest to the boss that you make a list of compatible files to show to customer's who want to provide a file. if the boss says no, you have an idiot for a boss as they hired you because you know what you are doing so let you do it. as far as buddy jobs for the boss, why do you have a problem with that? looks like the boss didn't ask you to do the job on your time so what's the problem? you should see some of the buddy jobs I've had to do over the years. it's part of the job.
if you think you are worth more money because of your skills, then tell the boss and who knows, the boss might agree.

 

[Artildawn]

on the lighter side... there's nothing wrong with bending over backward to help the customer. Now bending over forward is another matter entirely and that's where I'd draw the line.

 

[Techman]

The boss should buy a copy of publisher and get it over with.

 

[Gino]

pchron…..

The more you post, the less I feel anything for your side of the argument.

You are an employee and one, I might add, that is paid well according to your own words that other shops can’t afford what you are already getting.

Your private matters in essence…. don’t enter into an employer’s strategy. Your troubles, past bills or loans, mortgages, kids, or car loans have nothing to do with your employer’s bottom line. He has hired you, your hands and feet along with your brain to do your job while at work and he really is the guy that has the worries of keeping the doors open or not. If he doesn’t meet his quota…. he’ll either get someone else to do your job or do it himself. Will he like it ?? Probably not. Can he perform all the duties ?? Hopefully or it will take him down. The main thing is…. he didn’t base any of his business plan… around your personal needs. Sure, it’s nice when an employer thinks of his employee’s needs and/or wants, but that isn’t what is running the show. His only responsibility to you is to make sure your paycheck is there every pay day. You talk as though you’ll be there when things get better. If this guy is any good, he already knows you’re whining about too much on your plate and when things do open up… he might just replace an unhappy camper. I know I would.

You’ve been in the business only four years and two of them with this guy and you already know how to run his business.

Instead of wasting your time trying to fix his business and give him all of your good ideas…. why don’t you just strut out on your own and show him you are the better person and will run a business the right way and show him his wrongful ways ??

As far as meeting any challenge on your part to make ends meet as you put it….

• Do you have a second or third job to make up for your lack of pay ??
• Do you have a large stash laying around you can tap into ??
• Do you have any plans in the near future to go into business and set the world on fire ??
• Do you have what it takes to run a business and not complain ??

This might sound a little harsh, but it’s very tiring hearing how so many employees know more than the guy/gal that has been afloat for 20, 30, 40 years and still going strong. Give it a rest and thank your lucky stars… YOU have a job.

I don't see any of this as being overworked.... not yet.​

 

[MachServTech]

I work as the only designer at my company. In addition to that I also am the only experienced print tech for our wide format. My duties are split between running the printer and shuffling media rolls around and doing layout work. I do everything from setting type for DOT numbers to complete car wrap designs.

I have been in almost the same situation you are in.

At this point you have to ask yourself whether you are ready to make the commitment to look for something else.
I was the operator/designer/manager of a shop for a few years. I finally became fed up with the foolhardy and half baked decisions of the management.

So, I built my resume, gathered a list of industry folks I knew and started calling. I called people that I wanted to work for...not waiting for an ad in the newspaper to magically appear.

Finding a good job is as hard as the full time job you currently have. Be prepared for that, but if you have been pushed too far then you will have the motivation that will see you through.

My advice is to take an Adobe Illustrator class so you can and polish up your design skills and you will have a proven (by your classmates) portfolio.

Be confident in your skills, and always ask for help when you're stuck

Good Luck

 

[MachServTech]

The more you post, the less I feel anything for your side of the argument.

come on Gino no employee deserves this:

"Figure out how to make it work or I'll find someone who can."

If I dont like the way someone is working, I let them know why, but the a**** that said this^ is obviously on a power trip. I really hope that's not how you operate a business.

 

[pchronotron]

Well a lot of the problem is we have really no guidelines about acceptable formats and the like. I've brought up the issue before but the answer I've been given is that "the customer is always right" and that the management doesn't want to lose potential business by enforcing a policy like that. We also really don't have any set system for art or set up fees. It's largely all done by the owner's fiat.

The problem wasn't that it wasn't compatible. We could have easily printed the PDF she provided except she wanted us to make alterations to it which I can't do without breaking the missing fonts and spending a huge amount of time massaging everything back together. I'm already behind on my layouts because of giving special attention to my employers pet project at the same time I'm getting talked to because the quality of my designs are lacking because I don't have time to give them the consideration they deserve because I'm giving special attention to orders of customers who are unaware or unwilling to give us art in a convenient format.

 

[Gino]

come on Gino no employee deserves this:

"Figure out how to make it work or I'll find someone who can."

If I dont like the way someone is working, I let them know why, but the a**** that said this^ is obviously on a power trip. I really hope that's not how you operate a business.

Did I say any of those things ??
​

 

[Techman]

giving special attention to my employers pet project at the same time I'm getting talked to because the quality of my designs are lacking because I don't have time to give them the consideration they deserve because I'm giving special attention to orders of customers who are unaware or unwilling to give us art in a convenient format.

Want some blue cheese with that whine?

 

[pchronotron]

pchron…..
The more you post, the less I feel anything for your side of the argument.

The point of bring up my personal situation was not to win pity points with anyone but to show that I am as committed to remaining employed and by extension being a good employee as he is to keeping his doors open.

 

[Billct2]

I know I am head and shoulders above my predecessors at this company. Other shops in town would hire me if they could afford to match what I already make

So you're the most qualified and best paid sign designer in your area?
And the samples you posted are the examples of the quality of your designs?

 

[Bigdawg]

The point of bring up my personal situation was not to win pity points with anyone but to show that I am as committed to remaining employed and by extension being a good employee as he is to keeping his doors open.

pchronotron... let's talk... just you and me...

I understand your feelings.. TOTALLY understand your feelings. It's hard to do so many things at once and do them all well. My official title is Production and Design Manager... but in reality I do anything that needs to be done and that includes quotes, customer meetings, designs, weeding, printing, laminating, answer phones, etc... you name it. We're a small shop so the need is there to wear many hats. I am assuming you also work in a small shop.

The thing is though... what did they describe the job to you as when you walked in the door? Did it include all of the above? If it did... by taking the job, it is implied that you COULD do all of it. If not and you've "grown" into more responsibility... well your concerns may have some validity.

I am an employee. I used to be an employer. So I can see this from both sides. But I gotta tell you... running a printer and designing while you are doing it generally isn't that rough unless you've got printing problems. And my boss expects me to do it on a daily basis. Is everything I put out a work of art? Oh hell no, but you have to learn to allot time ON YOUR OWN to do everything that needs to be done in your busy work day.

Do you have any kind of schedule for the jobs? Even a list that you keep for your own sanity? If not... it's time to start. Every morning take 10 minutes to figure out where you stand in relation to the workload. See what you need to get out for that day... or to keep your crew working. If you can't do it.. the time is THEN to go to your boss - with facts and figures and say "It is physically impossible to do X, Y and Z because of _______. Could you help me out with priorities?"

Then stick to that list. When the boss brings in his pet project - and we all get the bosses' pet projects - it will always become a priority for them. But if you answer back with. "Sure, I can get these six designs done in about two hours, but I won't be able to finish up that sign for Joe Blow... which takes priority?" then your boss makes the decision as to what you should work on.

Be specific when you talk to them about jobs. Be able to tell them how long something will take. Or ask them how much time they want scheduled for that project. It's up to you then to design within those parameters. I can't do it is not the answer they want to hear. But if you can intelligently present them with the reasons you aren't getting things done, that's half the battle.

As far as the personal end of why you are working. It doesn't matter... just because you need a job doesn't mean you are a good employee. While I hate that he is telling you to figure it out or he will find someone who will, the truth is that he more than likely can. If the job is that important - and it sounds like it is to you.... well... find a way to make it work.

Just my thoughts.