Calling out size- height 1st, length 2nd?

[Ray Miller]

I see a lot of discussion here but I agree with making it easier. When learning myself and hearing all the different approaches to this very question i believe most people will say at the end portrait or landscape. There's no harm in making sure the other party is on the same page as you.

 

[Zendavor Signs]

There are no standards anymore, because no one knows them anymore. Whether or not we as sign people know it, our customers don't know it and the people in the warehouses don't know it (or give a rat's butt), so in order to be careful, I don't even say height or width, cause someone will say.... Isn't that the length ?? So, are we talking 3D or 2D ?? Who cares. I just say..... left & right and up & down ??

Haha - yes, I use left/right and up/down a lot too, any more. Width and length are pretty much useless nomenclatures.

 

[James Burke]

Real quick...look at your screen....the x axis is horizontal, the y axis is vertical. Alphabetically speaking, X always precedes Y.

Mathematically, the Cartesian coordinate system follows the same rule....x coordinate first, y coordinate second.

WIDTH FIRST, HEIGHT SECOND.

It's that way in the tool and die world, the monument world and the construction world.

A window's size notation is basically width and height combined. The first two #'s are for width and the second two #'s are for height. A 2426 Replacement Window would have a width of 2'4″ and height of 2'6″.


JB

 

[Gino]

So, for all you die-hards who don't wanna budge from your ancient theorems and dusty form of communications...... you cannot see the faults of your ways ??

C'mon man, it's the 21st century and if ya can't get your point across one way, ya need to find another way to do it..... or somebody's gonna be out on their keister. If y'all put this much effort into transgender change, maybe we'd be a little more understanding.​

 

[GSM]

So, for all you die-hards who don't wanna budge from your ancient theorems and dusty form of communications...... you cannot see the faults of your ways ??

C'mon man, it's the 21st century and if ya can't get your point across one way, ya need to find another way to do it..... or somebody's gonna be out on their keister. If y'all put this much effort into transgender change, maybe we'd be a little more understanding.​

Our general rule of thumb is the way the sign reads. If you are looking at a sign panel and it reads horizontal ie 96" x 48" it is 96"w x 48"h. if it is presented vertically and reads 48" x 96" , it is 48"w x 96"h.

 

[brdesign]

You call out all measurements only in inches? So, if you have a sign that is 15'-3" high, you call it out as 183" high - and your customers understand that their sign is 15'-3" high? If you had a 62'-11" long banner, would you still use only inches to notes it as 635"? And then to use decimals? I don't think many people in this country know what the decimal system equivalents are in the imperial system. Not to be insulting, but that's totally foreign to me and I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from. I know the greater majority of the clients I've had in 25 years would be totally confuzzled if I gave them measurements in inches w/ decimals - especially GC's. Plus, I bet more than half of the fabricators & installers I've worked with in my career couldn't tell you what 183" is in feet/inches w/o pulling out a calculator and they definitely wouldn't know that 0.313" equals 5/16" and, since their tape measures are imperial, it would be asking for trouble to use decimal.

That's how I've been doing for the last 21 years, most everything measured in inches rounded off to the nearest 1/8 or .125 inch. Only occasionally has it been an issue when a vendor or installer insisted on Feet - inch - fraction measurements.
Usually the biggest problem is with people who don't even know how to read a tape measure to begin with.

 

[bob]

Check any sign supply catalog, every one is the same Width x Height...that is the standard

Why? Have you seen every one? Even if you had, is it the standard because they say it's the standard or do they say it's the standard because it is the standard? If the former, what is their authority to proclaim this standard. If the latter, just who is the authority that proclaims the standard?

 

[bob]

Actually, when Adam met Eve his first words were "Stand back, I don't know how big it's gonna get!"

 

[GB2]

Why? Have you seen every one? Even if you had, is it the standard because they say it's the standard or do they say it's the standard because it is the standard? If the former, what is their authority to proclaim this standard. If the latter, just who is the authority that proclaims the standard?

Bob...I was actually thinking about you yesterday, thinking that I haven't seen any responses lately and hoping all was well with you, so good to see you here.
To answer your questions...
No, I haven't seen every catalog but all those that I have seen use the same measurement convention.
I stated it to be the standard because I declared it the standard! Do I have that authority? Depends who you talk to I guess!
Seriously though, I don't believe that any real standard exists, however from my experience, I do believe that the WxH convention is the typical in the sign industry, though I understand that it is not always comfortable for everyone and it is highly debatable. I also agree that to hold to either belief and assume that anyone will understand you will not work, it almost always requires clarification. Furthermore....as Gino declares, does it really matter? I doubt it but it makes for great conversation here!

 

[OADesign]

+1 for adding a simple label.
Xft w x Xft h
Two extra key strokes eliminates guessing (or remembering a rule)

 

[Souldar]

When I started many years ago it was always height then width. Now it doesn't matter but I still do it that way but I do use H and W in my templates.
My theory is that as the old school generations retired the new incoming youngsters didn't care much for tradition. Plus most of them were graphic designers who learned print shop language or on the fly and couldn't bother to learn the ways of the old masters.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

That's how I've been doing for the last 21 years, most everything measured in inches rounded off to the nearest 1/8 or .125 inch. Only occasionally has it been an issue when a vendor or installer insisted on Feet - inch - fraction measurements.
Usually the biggest problem is with people who don't even know how to read a tape measure to begin with.

I call out everything in inches as well...makes it easier to understand. 3' 4"x7'10" has to be converted and I'd rather read 40"x94"

 

[Andy D]

I call out everything in inches as well...makes it easier to understand. 3' 4"x7'10" has to be converted and I'd rather read 40"x94"

True, I have seen many mistakes made when converting feet & inches to inches also fractions of inches to decimals of inches.
As a designer 118.375" is a whole lot easier than 9' 10 3/8"

 

[eahicks]

H x W is what I have done for yeeeeeeears. I just recently started at another company, and guess what? They go by W x H on everything. So it's a slight adjustment but not a huge deal. I do also add H & W to measurements in drawings just to be more clear.

 

[Pewter0000]

+1 for adding a simple label.
Xft w x Xft h
Two extra key strokes eliminates guessing (or remembering a rule)

+1 for labels and +1 for making sure inches and feet are clearly labeled too. Clients almost never get the measurements right, so if we clearly state everything down to a tee in the proof sheet, it covers our butts. It also makes sure that nobody gets confused from design to production to install. It takes 0 time to just add w and h, but saves a lot of time and $ if something was messed up.

 

[gabagoo]

I just ask customers landscape or portrait as I think they can figure that one out

 

[Gino]

I get a kick outta people who write on their spec sheet........ 7.5' and they mean 7' 5" and not 7' 6". People are mighty stupid these days and I kinda predict, in a few years we're gonna have a whole new buncha dumb stupid@ss people running around after not being in school for almost 2 years and not learning a danged thing. The smart ones won't be working with people who need measurements. Oh, we're doomed.

 

[Johnny Best]

300 cubits, length, 50 cubits, breadth, and 30 cubits, height for the Ark. Noah just carried on since there were no catalogs to compare to.

 

[Stacey K]

Since we are talking about measuring, does anyone else still use a Pica pole? I use it ALL THE TIME when I apply vinyl and for apparel.
I started out in graphic design in 1993 and have been using the same Pica pole I bought for school. I just recently purchased an additional 12" and a 24". Tape measures hook on edges but the Pica pole is perfect every time, never loose from the thingy on the end, always perfect!

 

[Andy D]

300 cubits, length, 50 cubits, breadth, and 30 cubits, height for the Ark. Noah just carried on since there were no catalogs to compare to.

I like to think God is a old school sign guy, so he would have said;
30 cubits x 300 cubits x 50 cubits