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Discussion Clear Shield Classic Liquid Laminate problem and question

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crny1

New Member
I have used Clear shield a few times on some banner and when I used it I thinned it a little with water. Seemed to work well and never had a problme with it. This was on 12oz material.
I recently did a really long banner on ultra flex pro 18oz banner material and this time since the banner was going to be handled alot moving it around I didnt dilute the clear shield thinking it would leave a thicker protection on it. It seemed (atleast to the touch) to dry fine. I let it sit 24hrs in controlled climate of 70 deg. Took it to the customer and they ended up folding it up face to face and it stuck together and pulled the laminate off when seperating it.
Should I have diluted it and just put more coats on it? The customer will always be moving it and more than likely someone will fold it face to face again and I dont want this to happen again. Yes I did let the ink dry 24 hrs prior to the clear shield. Solvent print.
Am I doing something wrong? Thanks in advance.
 
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crny1

New Member
Well without lamination they scratch pretty easy........Pretty simple reason in my opinion. Especially on a banner that is 48' long and 36" tall. It will be moved quite a few times, folded, rolled up etc. 48 foot long banner isnt easy to just take down alone and roll up. Its gonna get drug across the ground, concrete etc etc. It needs laminated....................................
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
If all those conditions are in the equation, then they need to know several things upfront. Ya never fold a banner, regardless of how many people, how difficult or whatever. It's just the nature of the beast...... ya don't do it. Clear to clear in these cheap liquid laminates are not meant to touch itself for weeks, or until it has been seasoned. If they're gonna abuse the banner by dragging it and folding it and doing all the things you are not supposed to do, then ya say..... buyer beware.

Several light costs are better than one heavy coat, but it's still gonna do the same thing when it comes in contact with itself. If this is double sided, then you're f*cked all around.

When we used to hand paint banners and canvas, it would last for years regardless of how they were abused. Can ya talk 'em into hand-painted canvas banners ??
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
Well, so are the things you say are important to this customer. Ya either explain to him it ain't gonna last with how he's gonna handle it, or he hasta pay dearly to make it halfway last.
 
B

bannertime

Active Member
crny1 said:
Well without lamination they scratch pretty easy
Click to expand...

I think it's time to upgrade print equipment. Banners have been pretty scratch resistant since like 2010. UV and Latex are pretty durable. We used to regularly do 12x50 and 12x25 backdrops that'd get walked on, folded, and dragged all over during installation to the trusses.
 

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D

Dlandor

New Member
crny1 said:
I have used Clear shield a few times on some banner and when I used it I thinned it a little with water. Seemed to work well and never had a problme with it. This was on 12oz material.
I recently did a really long banner on ultra flex pro 18oz banner material and this time since the banner was going to be handled alot moving it around I didnt dilute the clear shield thinking it would leave a thicker protection on it. It seemed (atleast to the touch) to dry fine. I let it sit 24hrs in controlled climate of 70 deg. Took it to the customer and they ended up folding it up face to face and it stuck together and pulled the laminate off when seperating it.
Should I have diluted it and just put more coats on it? The customer will always be moving it and more than likely someone will fold it face to face again and I dont want this to happen again. Yes I did let the ink dry 24 hrs prior to the clear shield. Solvent print.
Am I doing something wrong? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
crny1 said:
I have used Clear shield a few times on some banner and when I used it I thinned it a little with water. Seemed to work well and never had a problme with it. This was on 12oz material.
I recently did a really long banner on ultra flex pro 18oz banner material and this time since the banner was going to be handled alot moving it around I didnt dilute the clear shield thinking it would leave a thicker protection on it. It seemed (atleast to the touch) to dry fine. I let it sit 24hrs in controlled climate of 70 deg. Took it to the customer and they ended up folding it up face to face and it stuck together and pulled the laminate off when seperating it.
Should I have diluted it and just put more coats on it? The customer will always be moving it and more than likely someone will fold it face to face again and I dont want this to happen again. Yes I did let the ink dry 24 hrs prior to the clear shield. Solvent print.
Am I doing something wrong? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
 
D

Dlandor

New Member
I have worked with Clearshield for over 19 years now and I can confirm that the coating pure should work perfectly for a very long time and you should be able to get double the life than un laminated. we have applications such as truck curtains, and inflatable bouncy castles where it works perfectly over the years. In many cases it is down to the ink, the substrate (plasticisers in pvc banner) that can disrupt the adhesion and folding issues you have mentioned. Once it has cured and you have tested it for adhesion is should never fail you. However if you are using uv inks it is possible the gloss does not adhere that well so you may want to pre coat with a matt coating then over coat again with the clearshield gloss. You were right to not water it down. Watering down reduces the gloss level and also reduces the quality of the bond, protection overall.
 
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crny1

New Member
Dlandor said:
I have worked with Clearshield for over 19 years now and I can confirm that the coating pure should work perfectly for a very long time and you should be able to get double the life than un laminated. we have applications such as truck curtains, and inflatable bouncy castles where it works perfectly over the years. In many cases it is down to the ink, the substrate (plasticisers in pvc banner) that can disrupt the adhesion and folding issues you have mentioned. Once it has cured and you have tested it for adhesion is should never fail you. However if you are using uv inks it is possible the gloss does not adhere that well so you may want to pre coat with a matt coating then over coat again with the clearshield gloss. You were right to not water it down. Watering down reduces the gloss level and also reduces the quality of the bond, protection overall.
Click to expand...

Not UV inks being used. Maybe I should let the ink cure longer than 24hrs? As well as the clear shield before giving it to them.
 
T

TimToad

Active Member
If you refuse or neglect to instruct and educate your client on the proper care, storage and handling of a banner, NO product will protect themselves from damaging their purchase. For a banner that size, we would deliver it rolled outward around a media core and stuffed in an empty media shipping tube. We would give a copy of our written care instructions stating that banners are NEVER TO BE FOLDED and for maximum durability should always be rolled around the provided core face out.

If we as professionals don't want pushback, complaints or returns, we have to hand off our products in a way that increases the odds that they will be handled properly.
 
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