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Color calibration tools.. what do you use?

OADesign

New Member
Yes for inkjet proofing of offset or digital jobs it make sense. For signage not so much.

Well, I can't speak on your knowledge, but I know a tech turned operator that uses it in his shop workflow. Regularly. So there is that.My knowledge only coming from what I've learned from him. So maybe your right. Or maybe not. Also the larger point I was trying to make to the OP, and seems I was not explicit enough, is that a G7 Certified tech could help. Using that knowledge. Ultimately it is all about profiling.

And I quote:
"All in all, it can alleviate a lot of headaches, because you know that the majority of stuff you print will match (reasonably) to other collateral being printed elsewhere and clients won’t ask you for as many revisions."
 

dypinc

New Member
I would second talking to Mike Adams. I spent some time talking with him when I was at another company, he's incredibly knowledgeable and a very, very nice guy. I'm not sure if the company ever went through with the process, as I left shortly after talking to Mike. He knows his stuff.

I would agree Mike knows his stuff and can be very helpful especially to CM newbies. One thing I did disagree with Mike in the past (it may have been a lack of understanding each other) was the training he would provide you on the calibration/linearization that you need to be able to do to maintain consistent color through hardware, environmental and media changes. That is the one thing I would insist on that you get training for no matter who you get to setup your color management.
 

ColorCrest

All around shop helper.
G7 is very beneficial to learn ABOUT even if you don’t actually use it. G7 is just a modern, commercialized method of what a basic practice was, and still is, to calibrate a printing system. The concept is “calibrate to a neutral gray scale from black through white.” G7 then relies upon ICC output profiles to handle colors. I consider G7 to be for advanced users when the time comes, if it ever does, and that can be just for “perceived” competitive reasons.

Some (most?) RIPs afford the opportunity to image a test file at the calibration step which is before the ICC output profile step. In other words, you may print the control file with no ICC profile affecting it and therefore enabling you to see what the calibration actually is. Too light, too dark, grays not neutral, dark green grays with light magenta grays (color crossover)?

Print your control file without color management. The results will show your calibration. If your print is anything but neutral, your process is not calibrated to any standard. If a client asks what values they should use to create a medium gray background for their sign, what do you tell them?

Mike’s method makes it easier for the typical sign shop to get a very good start on controlling their process. Even if a calibration is not spot on, the subsequent step of ICC profiling can result in proper color balance, and that’s usually the case.

Again, a shop doesn’t have to subscribe to G7 but the basic concept of gray, it would behove them to do so.
 

mackenzieGRAPHICS

New Member
Because my internet search hasn't come up with much for an answer, maybe you Onyx professionals can tell me.. how many licenses does each software include? Can I buy one to use on two computers?
 

Lane J

New Member
Because my internet search hasn't come up with much for an answer, maybe you Onyx professionals can tell me.. how many licenses does each software include? Can I buy one to use on two computers?

There is a few different ways to get licenses for Onyx, the split up the license/number of printers kind of weird. We have THRIVE 642: 6 RIPs, 4 printers, 2 Job Editors, 1 layout tool. You can install as many copies of Production Manager as you want. I run 3 computers in various locations. I only need one dongle in one of my PCs as long as it's connected to my LAN, the other PCs don't need the dongle.

You would probably want the 421 configuration. I don't utilize the layout tool or the Job Editor very much, we have someone in prepress doing all the imposition.
 

cstone94

Pro-Graphx
If you are in need of Color Management knowledge, it may be a good idea to take advantage of the SGIA webinars or their in-house training events they offer regularly. It is definitely necessary to have a good spectro on-hand and profile the printers the same way. I am a dealer for Barbieri and if interested I can help you get your printers dialed in, no charge.
 

mackenzieGRAPHICS

New Member
If you are in need of Color Management knowledge, it may be a good idea to take advantage of the SGIA webinars or their in-house training events they offer regularly. It is definitely necessary to have a good spectro on-hand and profile the printers the same way. I am a dealer for Barbieri and if interested I can help you get your printers dialed in, no charge.

I would appreciate that immensely! I'll message you. Thank you!!
 

mackenzieGRAPHICS

New Member
There is a few different ways to get licenses for Onyx, the split up the license/number of printers kind of weird. We have THRIVE 642: 6 RIPs, 4 printers, 2 Job Editors, 1 layout tool. You can install as many copies of Production Manager as you want. I run 3 computers in various locations. I only need one dongle in one of my PCs as long as it's connected to my LAN, the other PCs don't need the dongle.

You would probably want the 421 configuration. I don't utilize the layout tool or the Job Editor very much, we have someone in prepress doing all the imposition.

Okay, that's good to know. We have someone doing our prepress, as well, but I still have to catch and correct some things before printing, so the layout/job editor would probably be beneficial for me to still have. We have two computers connected to our two printers, but it's 98% me that manages all that. It'd just be nice to have the second computer set up with the new software in the event I'd like to take a vacation or something. ;)
 

C5 Service&Repair

New Member
Ok, so you lave good info here on the tools to use, and the iPublish set up is the way to go for your application.
Your bigger issue, is that you have a solvent based machine, the XR, and a UV based machine in the LEC. The ONLY way you can calibrate these machines to one another is to cut the XRs color output back to match the LECs. So you have one of the best color gamut machines on the market, and you're attempting to color calibrate it to a UV machine, whos gamut is much smaller. I would never try this, and stick to your 'this machine for this, and that machine for that' train of thought in your workflow.

If your machines are unable to reproduce jobs that they previously printed, then you need a better maintenance system or nozzle checks before printing. If the material, inks and profiles are all exactly the same, there is no reason the prints would be different.
 

mackenzieGRAPHICS

New Member
Ok, so you lave good info here on the tools to use, and the iPublish set up is the way to go for your application.
Your bigger issue, is that you have a solvent based machine, the XR, and a UV based machine in the LEC. The ONLY way you can calibrate these machines to one another is to cut the XRs color output back to match the LECs. So you have one of the best color gamut machines on the market, and you're attempting to color calibrate it to a UV machine, whos gamut is much smaller. I would never try this, and stick to your 'this machine for this, and that machine for that' train of thought in your workflow.

If your machines are unable to reproduce jobs that they previously printed, then you need a better maintenance system or nozzle checks before printing. If the material, inks and profiles are all exactly the same, there is no reason the prints would be different.

That makes a TON of sense and I never even thought about that. In all honesty, I'm mostly trying to dig for some professional input on whether or not the calibrating tools would be a beneficial expenditure for my boss to make, or if it would be more smart for him to pay someone else to come set up our machines and send me to some sort of color management course. I'm leaning more toward the latter, based on some of the responses, but it's difficult to explain why the colors don't match to someone that doesn't understand all the things that could affect the finished product. You've all given me some excellent points and I very much appreciate all your help and advice!
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
As C5 said, you have to dumb down the color of the XR printer to match the gamut of the UV printer. One solution around that would be to make two different profiles. One for the most vibrant colors on the WR for jobs that you don't need to match on the UV printer and then another profile that matches the UV printer for jobs that do need to match. That way you can choose which one you need for the time.
 

mackenzieGRAPHICS

New Member
As C5 said, you have to dumb down the color of the XR printer to match the gamut of the UV printer. One solution around that would be to make two different profiles. One for the most vibrant colors on the WR for jobs that you don't need to match on the UV printer and then another profile that matches the UV printer for jobs that do need to match. That way you can choose which one you need for the time.

That's actually pretty close to what I'm doing, currently. Because we get better blacks and vibrant colors from the solvent, I'll delegate those jobs there and the jobs that have more Pantone specific needs or are just regular ol' graphics will go to the UV. I do have more specific profiles set up for the solvent printer running Flexi, but the UV only has the generic profiles provided by Roland and their site in Versaworks. I'm going to be messing around with the suggestions I've received today to figure out what the best route would be, but am always eager to hear more tips and tricks!
 
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