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Consultant made partner nixed after 2 years

OC Signs

New Member
Hello all...
Can't say I've posted here before, but I have been reading and taking advice for a few years. Maybe only a year as OC SIGNS. I have been in the front lines of the sign industry for 22 years now. I will try to keep this brief, but will answer any question or comments as posted. I came into a consult position with a copy/ print shop. A contract was drawn for a year as to the nature of the consulting, to create a sign department, which would eventually become a separate sign shop.Things went well for the first year, vendors approached, marketing commenced, training on pricing, material choices for area and production techniques. First year went well, equipment paid off, new equipment purchased and paid off, logo created, generally, things were good. Second year, waited for contract renewal, and waited and waited. While I was not a "true" partner, but by word only, the word from a retired Master Chief from the Air Force, and his wife, I had little standing. That I believe was my biggest folly. Come the end of September of this year I was booted and expelled from shop in less than 20 min. I showed and produced everyday, without fault. At this point, their cookie cutter shop has taken production techniques and produced custom work, with my designs. I can go on with more, but this is not a total bash on them. My biggest question, is, that I have all original file for logo creation on my computers, and on the internet to authenticate time/date stamp. I have done research to copyright logo, but would like to know if it would be forth it, to have them stop using logo. Beyond that, I have started another company, solely on my own. J & S Signworks, which will be registered soon, as soon as next week business license goes through. I am frustrated and not sure what I can do, since I did not have a contract with them at time of release, other than verbal word. I did leave with accounts I brought to table, and have purchased some equipment, found vendors for outsource what I cant handle at the moment. I guess, I'm venting and need advice. Thank you for any insight.
 

TyrantDesigner

Art! Hot and fresh.
Biggest folly and one that will make sure you don't get anything from them is the verbal contract. Always have business deals in writing. As for the designs ... it's theirs ... you made them while working for them and if you were paid for your time ... it's theirs. Chalk this one up to an "OOPS, lets not do that again." and move on ... besides ... you can always send them the gift of poop. http://www.poopsenders.com/
 

Rick

Certified Enneadecagon Designer
What did the original contract say?

As a consultant, you have to spell out what they get, and what you get. But if you were a true 1099 independent contractor, and the contract did not specifically address who owns copyright, they can take it to court, but there is no sure fire way of telling what a judge will say. Contact a copyright lawyer.

Personally, if you did not spell it out, let them have the shop logo. I'm sure after 22 years of sign and design, you don't really need it. You should have covered your butt better.

On the design work you did for them... if you were a true independent contractor, you get to use your work in your portfolio. UNLESS it was spelled out on the contract that your design work belonged to them. I would not go after their old clients. That reeks of bottom feeder and in my opinion, unethical. I think you would lose more than you gain.

If they ended up taking taking taxes out (treating you like an employee) then you are in the territory of "work for hire" and they probably own all your work (unless specified in the contract)
 

RobbyMac

New Member
Unfortunately, even consultants are considered 'employees' if it can be proven that you were 'hired' continually. The more hours you got paid in a year, the less chance you are considered a 'consultant'.

Without an agreement in writing, as mentioned earlier, there's a good chance your work will fall under 'work for hire' because of this. Which means your employer owns everything you designed. Not only could you not be able to prevent them from using your designs, but they can prevent you from using them.

Be careful what you choose to 're-use'...
 

Locals Find!

New Member
These issues you have brought up are very tricky from a legal standpoint. You can get tons of great advice on here. However, its all opinions, and you know what they say about opinions and rear-ends.

Don't just roll over and die on this. If you believe you have gotten screwed fight back legally. Seek the advice of a lawyer. If they think you have a case let the courts decide. Hire a professional and be done with it. I wouldn't say another word to anyone or post anything more about it anywhere till you have consulted with an Attorney.
 

Mainframe

New Member
Walk straight into all the old customers businesses, and without getting into too much drama, tell them you are now on your own and have been basically servicing them before, tell them you have great skills & good quality and would be glad to continue service, give them your card and let them choose. You could easily put them out of business by taking all the customers with you.
 

Techman

New Member
There isn't a soul on this board who is qualified to make a single qualified accurate opinion about this matter in any shape or form.
 

Pat Whatley

New Member
There isn't a soul on this board who is qualified to make a single qualified accurate opinion about this matter in any shape or form.

Hell, that's never stopped anybody before. Why start now?


You have to admit that "doing a search for "shrimp" was some pretty good advice, though.
 

ddarlak

Go Bills!
being in the sign industry for 20+ years you should have know this was coming.

drop it, move on and beat them where it counts - in the pocket book
 
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