Disclosure for picky/cheap customers

[OhioSigns]

I have a pretty detailed disclaimer on my proof template but it's about worthless because the customer will sign off on a design proof without reading it. A while back a customer came in wanting a small ACM sign made for her business. She supplied the vector logo in CMYK colors that her friend had created for her. The logo was awful and hard to read but that's another subject. I added a few things like phone number and border and emailed a design proof with the CMYK colors spec'd out that were going to be used, which were the CMYK colors contained in the artwork that she supplied. She emailed back the signed design proof, I printed the sign and when she came to pick it up she wasn't happy with the colors. I pulled out some of my printed color charts and some Pantone CMYK guides to check that my printer was on target and the colors were spot on to the specified CMYK colors. I took for granted that she knew what her colors would look like since she supplied the artwork. Her excuse was well it doesn't look the same as what it looks like on my cell phone screen.......... Just to keep the customer happy I offered for her to pick out colors from the charts that she liked so she would know exactly what she was getting and I would reprint for half cost using those colors but she didn't want to do it. I wasn't eating the cost of reprinting for her mistake of not knowing what the colors would look like that she supplied. For some people there's just no pleasing them. Here is my design proof with disclaimer regarding materials and colors but it doesn't do any good in making sure the customer is happy if they fail to read it and ask for actual samples beforehand or know that actual printed products will vary from viewing device to viewing device and printed output.

 

[Jeremiah]

Personally, if I try to get Every job ( cheap no profit ones ) I would not have time to do quality work for good customers. The no profit jobs dont put food on my table and I would have had to apply for a goverment bailout after 4 weeks of slow/no work.

 

[Reveal1]

Seems like you're ready to make a decision on what kind of customers you go after. I have a minimum of $125, that gets ride of the VERY low end. Sounds like it might be something you want to think about.

A little off topic here. Tex - I almost always agree with your perspective on things, but not getting the $125 minimum which I think you mentioned in another thread. Several of my largest customers order all kinds of small orders under $125. In fact they order just about everything from me in large part because I can handle the small orders too. I've acquired and built up customers away from competitors because they built up the impression that they were 'too small to deal with' - actually had a customer that does $20-30K of profitable business tell me that. Maybe the difference is we live in a small town and costs are lower, but I can do a lot of biz under $125 and happy to take it at our average gross margin. Maybe the key is for OP to be more choosy on who he works hard to get. There are ways other than $ minimums to tactfully send that business elsewhere.

 

[Notarealsignguy]

A little off topic here. Tex - I almost always agree with your perspective on things, but not getting the $125 minimum which I think you mentioned in another thread. Several of my largest customers order all kinds of small orders under $125. In fact they order just about everything from me in large part because I can handle the small orders too. I've acquired and built up customers away from competitors because they built up the impression that they were 'too small to deal with' - actually had a customer that does $20-30K of profitable business tell me that. Maybe the difference is we live in a small town and costs are lower, but I can do a lot of biz under $125 and happy to take it at our average gross margin. Maybe the key is for OP to be more choosy on who he works hard to get. There are ways other than $ minimums to tactfully send that business elsewhere.

I used to turn my nose up at little jobs until a customer of ours started referring people to us all of the time. I didnt want to offend them so we did some of these jobs, then got more and more. Its an extra 500-1000 a week cash from these people now and theyre easy to work in with other jobs. Im not arguing with people either. If they dont like the work and want to be a pita, they can take their job, keep their money and never come back. 50 bucks aint worth fighting over, Im already half bald which means my heart is the next thing to go. If they come off as annoying on the phone, I tell them we dont do that work and give them my buddy’s number - Im dead serious too, he hates it.

 

[Chris Keena]

I didn't take the OP comment to mean poor quality, just didn't match the color the customer expected...
I can tell you from years of photo processing, customers do not care if the image is color correct, they want over the top vivid colors and to look tan (or light skin tone for some customers)
I would do what many print companies do, offer a hard copy for $10 and if they are too cheap to pay that, have them sign next to " I understand that by not getting a hard copy, the colors are not guaranteed"

This is precisely what I would recommend. Below is what one of my vendors has as the color disclaimer.

YOUR NAME HERE guarantees color matching on all hard copy proofs, specified Pantone colors and client-supplied proofs. Orders without indication of Pantone colors, supplied hard copy proofs or requested hard copy proofs are not guaranteed for color.***

***E-proofs are for layout purposes only & are not an accurate representation of color or resolution. All approvals received on e-proofs confirms that you understand the color policy listed above.***

 

[Joseph44708]

Hi !

I need your help to guide me to put a good disclosure on my work orders or invoices.

I have had a couple issues with picky cheap customers....
They order 250 postcards....they want the cheapest job....and when the job is finalized they start complaining about the color not being "black enough"...
Or "My face looks too red"...
And either they want their money back or a re-print.

This are normally offset orders I send to the wholeseller....

Could you help me out with a good Idea to make a disclosure about this??

Anybody would be nice enough to show your own work order in this post??

I have been in this business for around 4 years, so i am still a beginner....but So tired of this kind of customers.


Thank You


Argento

I had this same exact problem 20 years ago. It turned out it was me. As I am not a graphic artist I am a printer. To correct the problem I hired a graphic artist that knows all the designing programs like photoshop, illustrator, quark expres coral draw and indesign. They created the the project and I printed it or framed it out to a large printing company that prints for the trade. No more issues with dark colors or bad photos.

 

[Geneva Olson]

Hi !

I need your help to guide me to put a good disclosure on my work orders or invoices.

I have had a couple issues with picky cheap customers....
They order 250 postcards....they want the cheapest job....and when the job is finalized they start complaining about the color not being "black enough"...
Or "My face looks too red"...
And either they want their money back or a re-print.

This are normally offset orders I send to the wholeseller....

Could you help me out with a good Idea to make a disclosure about this??

Anybody would be nice enough to show your own work order in this post??

I have been in this business for around 4 years, so i am still a beginner....but So tired of this kind of customers.


Thank You


Argento

Their face was red in the photo when they sent it to you. I send a proof and fall back on "you approved the proof". I just ranted about this is my own post. The guy tells me the blue I printed (that he picked out on a color chart), isn't the same blue.
I MAKE THEM SELECT EVERYTHING. I make them approve everything prior to printing. and I'm holding them to that approval.

 

[FireSprint.com]

No matter how low the price, everyone expects quality.

It's a challenging business decision to lower price by lowering quality. You never want your name on junk out there... Oh man this looks like crap... Yeah, but I got a good deal...

Also, there's likely we'll over a billion dollars spent in Miami annually on print. Not everyone is cheap. Someone's spending money...

 

[Andy D]

I used to turn my nose up at little jobs until a customer of ours started referring people to us all of the time. I didnt want to offend them so we did some of these jobs, then got more and more. Its an extra 500-1000 a week cash from these people now and theyre easy to work in with other jobs. Im not arguing with people either. If they dont like the work and want to be a pita, they can take their job, keep their money and never come back. 50 bucks aint worth fighting over, Im already half bald which means my heart is the next thing to go. If they come off as annoying on the phone, I tell them we dont do that work and give them my buddy’s number - Im dead serious too, he hates it.

I'm not disagree with you, but one thing to keep in mind is; just like that saying "a negative can't be proved", a negative also can't be accounted.
Meaning; that it's easy to see the money the little jobs bring in, but it might get to the point where being so busy with them will have negative ripple effects on larger projects, if
for example you put off a large quote by a couple hours to take care of the squeaky wheels of small jobs, you could lose out on it because of that, and you would never know it.

 

[Notarealsignguy]

I'm not disagree with you, but one thing to keep in mind is; just like that saying "a negative can't be proved", a negative also can't be accounted.
Meaning; that it's easy to see the money the little jobs bring in, but it might get to the point where being so busy with them will have negative ripple effects on larger projects, if
for example you put off a large quote by a couple hours to take care of the squeaky wheels of small jobs, you could lose out on it because of that, and you would never know it.

Agreed but in this particular case it's all hourly and I can throw it in with a larger job without any significant added labor. We made a drop off point, they text us their info and a pic of whatever they left. When it's done they get a text and total that they give to anyone in the shop cash or check. No small talk, no questions, no dreamers. Before we did this, these $100 customers would want to chit chat for 2 hours
Edit to add that we don't hard quote small stuff. I'll tell them a price range I think it'll be like $1-200 or whatever but the final bill is time and material.

 

[Eforcer]

I've been in the print industry since 76' 15 years in the sign business. After doing retail since 85' I've learned how to weed out these types 90% of the times. They all seem to have similar verbiage, to the point that I already target my pricing. And since my pricing is visually positioned on the wall. The only thing that can not be rightfully priced out is the graphics. We have a $24 min even if you just need one letter changed. I target their character and inflate the pricing. Once I hear those words "Oh That Is Too Much". I direct them to my competitors or Staples.

On another note. If your files you provide your vendor are crisp and color correct. You should find another one.

 

[Pauly]

I will go and say the issue is on your end also.
You're a print shop, you can offer good quality high DPI prints and cheap fast low DPI prints. But regardless of the quality, the print should be colour managed to some degree. It shouldn't be an excuse that pay less, get less.
1 icc profile for that particular media for a fast low DPI print speed doesn't hurt to have.

Then you can sell your quality cheap stuff, doesn't cost you to throw on your icc profile for fast speeds and low dpi. client is happy with his crappy work because faces aren't red and black looks black.

I have my "express" print modes printing quick jobs that look excellent colour wise.

But on my proofing, i have "this is a preview only, colour representation may differ from final product" as i don't know what they're viewing a PDF on.
If someone requests a colour managed proof, then i'll throw on the print profile i'll be using so the image will be "soft proofed" by the client.

 

[Geneva Olson]

Personally, if I try to get Every job ( cheap no profit ones ) I would not have time to do quality work for good customers. The no profit jobs dont put food on my table and I would have had to apply for a goverment bailout after 4 weeks of slow/no work.

I get a little bit of money from a whole lot of people. I don't care if it's a small job or not. I usually, inevitably end up getting several small jobs to make a print run. And end up getting the quick cash. Which I'm totally okay with. Gotta build a business somehow.
I make the little taco stands look professional decking them out in shirts, hats, banners, menus on coroplast. I had one food truck spend $1000 bucks on coroplast signs menus. $150 at time. I'll take it if you won't.