Does anybody use flat pricing for their vehicle wraps?

[player]

Don't spit out a number you have no basis for then. Whats the point of showing a picture to a customer and telling him what something cost when they want the same thing but different design? Then following your logic, what if the price of what you showed them is less than the quote? If you did a full wrap on a sprinter and it was $4000 plus design, why would the next one be any more or less?
You're charging for the custom part of it in the design fee, the rest is repetitive so I personally don't see the point of wasting time putting on some dog and pony show for a wrap.

I agree.

I was thinking more like "This cost $3K, but we will have to do a custom estimate for your different vehicle and graphics."

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

Shopping around prices can be very time consuming and costly so the savings really need to justify the expenditure. If you cost your business $60/hr and give up an hour a day to doing this with the phone calls, evaluating items etc then it will take a minimum savings of $300 to just break even. So when your shop refrigerator takes a dump, it would make better financial sense to purchase one from the first store that you go to rather than make a day out of it. I'm not advocating to be foolish about purchasing decisions but pick your battles.
From looking on here it seems that just about everyone simply charges by sq ft and I haven't seen any mention about factoring in any variables. If that's the case, why run through the motions over and over again? Doing all of these quotes eats up a ton of time.

I agree.

Most all of us are earning $1/minute . Good chunk are earning $2 or more. Keep that in mind when dicking around on the phone and saving a penny.

 

[TimToad]

I understand the points you're making but the difference is that I'm looking at things from the perspective of what creates the best customer experience and you're looking at it from a numbers perspective.

The focus for us in all areas of our business is providing the best possible customer experience that creates loyalty and keeps people coming back to us. That's worth more to us than making a slightly higher margin per job.

Yeah, they'll love you and keep coming back if they realize that you've left a good chunk of profit on the table for them to save at your expense because you're too lazy to figure out a good system for estimating prices.

Take 30 minutes sometime and call 10 or so places to get quotes on vehicle wraps. The majority will tell you they'll have to call you back with a price and others will say you'll need to bring your vehicle in for measurements before they can give you a quote.

Serious customers who are the kind we want to cultivate and target, value quality, service and professionalism. They aren't the ones calling 10 places for quotes or expecting quotes over the phone sight unseen.

If somebody is price shopping, do you think they'll drive to 3-4 locations to get all the quotes or do you think bring the shop that made pricing easy at an advantage?

With all the variations in vehicles, client needs, etc. how can anyone honestly expect a professional wrap shop to ignore all those variables and spout off some flat rate price? If I ever had a salesperson who started doing that, I'd either renegotiate their commission terms or get rid of them.

I understand the challenges that come with what I'm proposing but I'm confident this is a scalable and profitable business model that will simplify the sales process and improve the customer experience at the same time.

The challenges to this are multifold. First, without cooperation and buy in from other area shops, you open the door for being frozen out of being able to gain client confidence or upsell clients on better jobs as you all race each other to the bottom once your advertised flat rates are known by your competition and exploited to their advantage. This approach hamstrings your creative team and artificially limits them from proposing a better than basic idea or adjusting a concept once the flat rate price is locked in. There has to be room for allowing a design to evolve into its best form by the time its finalized. How would you break down the commission structure for your sales staff? A lower percentage on flat rate jobs that don't achieve the same profitability as a design that was approached more comprehensively? Sure, you might bring more volume of work into the shop, but if it isn't as profitable as other jobs, what's the point of doing that? You'll be working your team harder for less AND the sales staff will make less. All the salespeople I've ever known feed off the prospect of upselling and higher ticket sales, not lower or ones constrained by artificial limits placed on their skills.


If anybody has gone this route that would be willing to share your prices, it's be greatly appreciated!

 

[ams]

I quit doing wraps, but I told everyone it was $3,000 - $3,500 for their car.

 

[TimToad]

I think when some of you hear "flat rate" you think ALL wraps are X dollars. That's not what I'm talking about. Commercial vans, are X... 15' Box trucks X ... Sedan Full wrap X, Sedan half wrap X, Van/SUV is X...

Develop some simple categories and price them out. I ALWAYS separate design time and tell them is X$ /per hour that will be added to finial cost at pickup.

Is a 15' box truck with flat fiberglass sides the same as a 15' aluminum box truck with rivets or screws every six inches?

Very few of our customers like surprises at the end of the process. They want things spelled out as clearly as possible and we do to in order to get approval signatures on proofs and contracts.

 

[equippaint]

Is a 15' box truck with flat fiberglass sides the same as a 15' aluminum box truck with rivets or screws every six inches?

Very few of our customers like surprises at the end of the process. They want things spelled out as clearly as possible and we do to in order to get approval signatures on proofs and contracts.

I think the idea is getting missed. Its not 1 price for everything across the board, its a flat rate per vehicle type. So for a 16' FRP box it would be one price, aluminum another. Chevy cargo van $x, transit $x, pro master $x etc. Maybe the pro master and transit would be the same? It's to streamline the estimating process that is very time consuming especially for smaller shops.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

Is a 15' box truck with flat fiberglass sides the same as a 15' aluminum box truck with rivets or screws every six inches?

Very few of our customers like surprises at the end of the process. They want things spelled out as clearly as possible and we do to in order to get approval signatures on proofs and contracts.

I wish I could see one of the magical, no rivet trucks... I don't think one exist

 

[equippaint]

I wish I could see one of the magical, no rivet trucks... I don't think one exist

I think that the older Uhaul FRP bodies dont have any huck fasteners.
We repaired a wrecked aluminum body with no rivets in the sides. The panels overlapped (like penskes) and bonded to the posts with some sort of adhesive. When we called for parts the manufacturer told us they never built a truck like that but it was definitely factory

 

[TimToad]

I wish I could see one of the magical, no rivet trucks... I don't think one exist

Yup, lots of box trucks have fiberglass sides. Really nice to work on. Easily half the time as riveted.

 

[TimToad]

I think the idea is getting missed. Its not 1 price for everything across the board, its a flat rate per vehicle type. So for a 16' FRP box it would be one price, aluminum another. Chevy cargo van $x, transit $x, pro master $x etc. Maybe the pro master and transit would be the same? It's to streamline the estimating process that is very time consuming especially for smaller shops.

I fully understand, support what everyone is attempting to accomplish, but the devil is in the details. I was just trying to illustrate the difficulty in narrowing the realm of possibilities too much. I think one way we could all help our own time management is by simply asking well prepared questions of prospective customers to separate the wheat from the chafe and distinguish whether a request for a quote is serious, speculative, or the proverbial uninformed tire kicking.

I remember getting reamed by the usual suspects over actually providing potential logo design customers with a short, thought provoking questionnaire about their brand, preferences, expectations, etc. In other words, a brief design questionnaire to replace sitting on the phone or in person for an hour with someone who might not be fully comfortable answering them on the spot, but at full ease to do so on their own at their own pace.

 

[AKwrapguy]

I wish I could see one of the magical, no rivet trucks... I don't think one exist

I worked for a beverage distributor, their whole fleet was single piece fiberglass refrigerated trucks. No rivets, no seams. Not that uncommon up here.

 

[TimToad]

Yeah at first I had that fear too, that competitors would just undercut me, but this has not been an issue at all. Even if we are higher, that won't stop someone from ordering. When a customer sees your prices proudly posted online it sends a message that your not hiding them so the must be good!

Also, with faster quoting, you can speedup your turn-around times.

Do what you can to streamline the whole ordering process and manufacturing process so you can get your turnarounds amazingly fast. If your competitors are 3-5 weeks and you can get stuff done in a week, people will be willing to pay more for that service and will be happier.

It's been my experience that just as many people are suspicious of service businesses who can get to the work in really short order. Quick service on something like knock out banners, etc. is one thing, taking on wraps or more complex projects in under a few days signals to most people that you aren't very busy and maybe the quality isn't as good as others.

Since we've actively gone after bigger and more complex, multi dimensional projects with multiple week or longer timelines, the quality of both our clientele and creativity of our work has dramatically risen as well as our profitability. We still squeeze in plenty of quick turnaround jobs, but the bulk of the work is now in better, more interesting, creatively challenging projects.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

It's been my experience that just as many people are suspicious of service businesses who can get to the work in really short order. Quick service on something like knock out banners, etc. is one thing, taking on wraps or more complex projects in under a few days signals to most people that you aren't very busy and maybe the quality isn't as good as others.

Since we've actively gone after bigger and more complex, multi dimensional projects with multiple week or longer timelines, the quality of both our clientele and creativity of our work has dramatically risen as well as our profitability. We still squeeze in plenty of quick turnaround jobs, but the bulk of the work is now in better, more interesting, creatively challenging projects.

I have often thought of that perspective too.. I only do non-electric signs, lots of installs and that such, so I usually have material on-hand and can get going on it without waiting. When I start getting things pushed out longer then a week I just work overtime to get it all done or start raising prices till I get the workload under control. My situation is different then most sign shops, I'm just a one man show so I can make those decisions about pricing on the fly as I see fit. (Yes, I can quickly update my "flat rate" pricing on my website within about 10 mins. to react to my schedule...it's called "dynamic-demand pricing")

 

[player]

We don't flat rate wraps, but when people ask we do give ballpark prices for the various types...partial car, full car, partial truck, full truck, partial van, full van, etc., with the proviso that we are only giving them rough estimates so they can have an idea. Probably 90% of the people who ask then back off from the idea of getting one when they find out how much they are. Most of them have the idea that it will only be a couple of hundred dollars. That's also where we find out that the idiots have destroyed customer intelligence, and most times when people ask how much wraps are they really didn't want a wrap at all, but instead just wanted their business name put on the door or window. But we have so many people who've entered the industry lately that only print everything, and call everything wraps, that this is what the customers think all signs are called.

Yes. We used to letter vehicles. Now the name on a door is a "wrap". I hate the term when it is used like that.

 

[TimToad]

I have often thought of that perspective too.. I only do non-electric signs, lots of installs and that such, so I usually have material on-hand and can get going on it without waiting. When I start getting things pushed out longer then a week I just work overtime to get it all done or start raising prices till I get the workload under control. My situation is different then most sign shops, I'm just a one man show so I can make those decisions about pricing on the fly as I see fit. (Yes, I can quickly update my "flat rate" pricing on my website within about 10 mins. to react to my schedule...it's called "dynamic-demand pricing")

There is some psychology to it. With anything any of us post here on nearly any subject, almost EVERYTHING is open to adjustment, interpretation, individual circumstances, tweaking, the vagaries of the galaxy, etc.

 

[Zendavor Signs]

I see the merits of both sides here. As a busy salesperson/estimator, it would be nice to have some set pricing to quickly give estimates. Of course, there would need to be some very clear assumptions on the pricing. For me, the bigger communication gap with the customer seems to be explaining the difference between a full wrap, partial wrap, and "typical lettering". I have on my to-do to develop some set pricing with generic examples to give people an idea of the differences in cost and look. I would plan to not have this be public or online, same as I do with other price lists we have. The "price sheets" or "flat pricing" are only to assist the sales process, not become the sales process.

 

[Jester1167]

I wish I could see one of the magical, no rivet trucks... I don't think one exist

They exist, I just did one and laughed all the way to the bank. They told me the size and had no images and said quote it and install it. I was pleasantly surprised when I showed up.

 

[signman315]

We have set pricing for full wraps on small utility vans (NV2500/small sprinter), large utility vans (2500, etc.), small pickups (ranger), large pickups (150/ram), and quad cabs. Makes it easy and quick to be able to run off quotes for customers on the fly, and in the field.
We pad them over what cost is in case there are issues... but there really aren't. We're still making money and don't have to do 15 calculations to quote a van.

This comes with experience and knowing that each class of vehicle has basically the same square footage. Once you’ve done it long enough you realize that calculating the square footage comes out almost the exact same from vehicle to vehicle...within the same class i.e. sedan to sedan, van to van, and so on. It’s the install that varies greatly for reasons already mentioned. But I’ll be honest I still calculate the square footage to price it out, it makes me warm and fuzzy haha but only after throwing a rough figure at the client and if it doesn’t scare them off then move forward. So I’ll use “flat” pricing for estimates and do the math for true quotes. It’s important to know the exact numbers when quoting for large fleets and working an agreement on some kind of bulk discount. Giving a break without knowing your margins is a good way to get washed.

 

[equippaint]

They exist, I just did one and laughed all the way to the bank. They told me the size and had no images and said quote it and install it. I was pleasantly surprised when I showed up. View attachment 135691

How'd you get the big text on the sides so square and let the DOT numbers go down hill?

 

[equippaint]

I have often thought of that perspective too.. I only do non-electric signs, lots of installs and that such, so I usually have material on-hand and can get going on it without waiting. When I start getting things pushed out longer then a week I just work overtime to get it all done or start raising prices till I get the workload under control. My situation is different then most sign shops, I'm just a one man show so I can make those decisions about pricing on the fly as I see fit. (Yes, I can quickly update my "flat rate" pricing on my website within about 10 mins. to react to my schedule...it's called "dynamic-demand pricing")

Legit question - what do you do when your demand increases from the same customers and not from an increased base? That is our problem now, we raise quotes pretty high for "walk ins" and they go away but our established people keep loading us up with more than we can handle. Most already have corporate approval on pricing which takes time and they are using pre-established capex budgets. I almost want to give quantity surcharges rather than discounts.