Need Help Floor graphic calamity

[boxerbay]

in high traffic areas like malls we use ij180cv3 as the base and then a 10mil textured polycarbonate laminate.

 

[jtiii]

Another question...... who's idea was it to question you or the principal, if they could put the Stone Floor Protectant down before doing so ?? Seems odd someone had enough sense after the fact to stop and ask questions. Someone knows something here and is not stepping forward.

Two points to clarify here -
There IS stone floor protectant down already. We did an isopropyl wipe test, had good initial tack, and went ahead.

I am the one who messed up here. A few days before the install I sent over info about waxing the graphics after install, and the janitor replied "Floor coating we use is a 3M product Scotchgard stone finish. It is a very thin, but durable, floor finish. Only concern is that we do not apply many coats of this product and it is very expensive." I looked it up, didn't think it would pose a problem ("floor coating is floor coating" my genius brain said) and went ahead. Then after install the janitor said that the product is SO thin that he didn't think it would seal and protect the edges. Only then did I contact 3M. Here is the chat transcript -

Initial Question/Comment: We have installed floor graphics in an elementary school. 3M says they should get several coats of wax. Our customer doesn't use wax, they use 3M Stone floor protector. Can it be applied OVER wax? We need to seal the graphics (over 1000 paw prints) before the kids start tracking mud, ice melter, etc

Brady M: We would not recomend it.


John T: How should they seal this floor?


Brady M: the Stonefloor protector is fine for sealing the floor but you will not be able to use the stone floor protector over the graphic.


Brady M: this issues is if you need to address the edges per our recommendation you may need to use another product, but it is not suggested to coat another product over the stone floor protector


John T: What would you suggest I tell the customer to protect these floor graphics?


Brady M: the overlaminate is the only protection that you will be able to use


John T: I thought y'all recommend waxing it


Brady M: in most cases the recommendation would be to overlap wax on to the edges of the graphic to make it safer to walk on. this is not possible with the stone floor protector. the Overlaminate will be the only protection the graphic has and may peel up on the edges with out the addition material from the wax to bridge from the floor to the graphic.

John T: Oh yeah we definitely have an overlaminate on these


Brady M: You could test a floor wax for compatibility with the Stone Floor Protector but we do not recommend the use of any other product to be used with the stone floor protector.


John T: So if you have clients using your floor graphics and your floor protector do you just advise them that there is no medium to long term solution for protection then?


Brady M: unfortunately yes


Brady M: or anything test would be up to the end use to determine suitability.


John T: And just to clarify, are you saying that the stone floor protector can't be used over graphics even if they have an overlaminate?


Brady M: Correct.
​

 

[boxerbay]

The above is correct. under no circumstance should you imply any long term warranty on floor graphics. you only need one lady with a nail for a heel to damage the prints.

 

[Gino]

Yeah, sounds like ya just bite the bullet and hope for the best..... or take them all up and go according to directions..... whatever that might be.

Truly..... good luck !!

 

[equippaint]

Try it and see. She still didnt say that it absolutely will not work, she essentially said it may work but it is up to you to test it. It'd be a different story if she were to say we dont recommend it because in our testing we found.... or there are known chemical incompatibilities etc.
Call 3M and see if you can use their laminate over Averys vinyl and you will get the same response. It works just fine though.

 

[jtiii]

She still didnt say that it absolutely will not work, she essentially said it may work but it is up to you to test it. It'd be a different story if she were to say we dont recommend it because in our testing we found.... or there are known chemical incompatibilities etc.

So an unfortunate update - I found another 3M product called Resilient Floor protection that's designed for laminate flooring, but it says this: "Scotchgard™ Resilient Floor Protector is compatible with conventional floor finish and may be used as a top coat" so I called 3M, thinking that although this is no good for terrazzo it may work over wax. I actually got Brady, the same guy I'd chatted online with Friday. He remembered me right away and said he'd been talking with the lab guys because he thought it kinda stunk that they had no solution. I told him my idea and he put me on hold and called the lab to discuss.

He came back on with three nuggets of wisdom -

1) wax will not stick to the Stone stuff so the whole floor would have to be stripped first,
2) the resilient stuff is incompatible with the stone stuff so we couldn't do a "spot wax" over the graphics and then apply resilient over all,
3) wax needs regular maintenance and once it's covered by the resilient it will eventually "delaminate" from the floor graphics.​

So the upshot is I'm going to talk to the principal about trying a couple of options on small sections of hallway.

For extra protection, I would go around all the edges with a torch and a rollepro to make sure every edge is sealed down to the terrazo really well.

I'm going to go back this weekend and do that (although with a brayer instead of the rollepro).

Thanks for your advice / commiseration everyone!