Healthcare

[Texas_Signmaker]

You want to discuss healthcare...do it here as the title implies.

You want my opinion to start off? I don't really want to share it because it's a waste of time... But since my install got pushed to next week, I have some to waste...

I don't have any ideas on how to fix it, I'm not smart enough or care enough to figure out really what's wrong. If it were a simple solution I'm sure of the 350 million of us ONE would have figured it out by now.

All I know is I don't like paying $1500/mo with a 15k deductible...but that's coming from someone who hasn't had costly health issues soooooooo

 

[equippaint]

Its not up to the public to figure it out. These knuckleheads up in DC are paid good money plus lifetime perks to do the heavy lifting for us, not sit up there and bicker amongst themselves with the cameras watching in their own little dog and pony show. Fix it, scrap it, replace it, regulate it, nationalize it, for the love of god something besides sitting around talking about it and making it about politics instead of people for the past 20+ years. If whatever they do doesn't work, then do something else, not a real difficult concept.

 

[Jburns]

Remove the monopolies and let each provider compete across state lines
Give me ten companies to choose from like auto insurance

 

[WildWestDesigns]

something besides sitting around talking about it and making it about politics

Uh, they are politicians, of course, it's going to involve politics.

If whatever they do doesn't work, then do something else, not a real difficult concept.

To me, that would also include expecting politicians to get stuff done.


Speaking as someone that has gone a very long time without insurance and has had fairly expensive testing done recently (thankfully didn't led to anything serious), I've not been a fan of insurance companies as sometimes there seems to be this distinct feeling that health professionals place a little more concern on what the insurance company is going to think about a plan of action then what is truly best for the patient.

Now, this is just me speculating, but that's the scary thing that seems to cross my mind on this topic.

 

[Gino]

Gotta go home. I'll weigh in later. Have some things to do around the house more important than talkin' politics and healthcare. Like mentioned, that's what all those knuckleheads are doing for us, anyway. We voted them all in, so they should just get the job done.

 

[iPrintStuff]

The NHS in the UK gets a lot of hate but would 100% prefer it over what you guys have over there. (Granted it’s not perfect, but it works).

Massive premiums and then your insurance only wants to pay 10% anyway.

My contributions come off before I get my pay and I barely notice them.

Getting a serious health condition is bad enough without potentially having to leave your family with mountains of debt if you die. I’ll keep my 3 hour ER times no problem as long as it doesn’t cost me 5k for showing up!

In all fairness, the NHS would be great if people actually used it properly, I was in the ER recently (apprentice + finger + knife). And 90% of the people there were just time wasters and should have just made a local doctor appointment. One lady was there with mild sunburn.. can’t help but feel if there was a huge bill for being seen that it would have been a lot more empty!

Basically, if Breaking Bad was set in the UK, Walter would have been treated by the NHS then went back to teaching. So you have your health system to thank for making that story a bit more interesting.

 

[equippaint]

The NHS in the UK gets a lot of hate but would 100% prefer it over what you guys have over there. (Granted it’s not perfect, but it works).

Massive premiums and then your insurance only wants to pay 10% anyway.

My contributions come off before I get my pay and I barely notice them.

Getting a serious health condition is bad enough without potentially having to leave your family with mountains of debt if you die. I’ll keep my 3 hour ER times no problem as long as it doesn’t cost me 5k for showing up!

In all fairness, the NHS would be great if people actually used it properly, I was in the ER recently (apprentice + finger + knife). And 90% of the people there were just time wasters and should have just made a local doctor appointment. One lady was there with mild sunburn.. can’t help but feel if there was a huge bill for being seen that it would have been a lot more empty!

Basically, if Breaking Bad was set in the UK, Walter would have been treated by the NHS then went back to teaching. So you have your health system to thank for making that story a bit more interesting.

You get the same here. People with no insurance or medicaid hitting the er with nonsense or pill shopping. Wait times are just as bad. Had an employee in the er, spent the night and half the next day on a bed in the hallway. Then with my daughter, wait, triage, ultrasound and back into the waiting room sitting in a wheelchair with a barf bag doubled over in pain for a couple hours. Even that doesnt bother me much, its not a hotel, its really just the sky high charges.

 

[bannertime]

The NHS in the UK gets a lot of hate but would 100% prefer it over what you guys have over there. (Granted it’s not perfect, but it works).

My concern with that, which is the same majority of military veterans that use the VA; the US government is very inefficient at running programs. We've got two of the largest VA clinics where I'm at and I'm was still 6 months out for an ENT issue. Pretty much told me to go see a regular ER if it was too bad to wait. It was nearly 4-5 weeks just to get a consultation.

My mother is a recent cancer survivor (Stage 3b melanoma) and her treatments billed out to around $1.5mil. Cigna and a treatment provider paid all but a few thousand. If her treatment had been handled by the VA, she'd actually be dead.

Now if the system could run like my active duty care was, where you signed you name and waited to be called, that'd be amazing. I had to retrain myself not to go to the doctor for every little thing because of how easy it was, and that'd be a huge problem here. Similar to what you explained.

People keep pushing for a single payer here, but I don't think they realize what they are getting into. So some program is going to get rushed through and it's going to suck.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

You get the same here. People with no insurance or medicaid hitting the er with nonsense or pill shopping. Wait times are just as bad. Had an employee in the er, spent the night and half the next day on a bed in the hallway. Then with my daughter, wait, triage, ultrasound and back into the waiting room sitting in a wheelchair with a barf bag doubled over in pain for a couple hours. Even that doesnt bother me much, its not a hotel, its really just the sky high charges.

Ya'll should try those stand alone ERs.. They are nicer then 5 star hotels...They give out free take-home blankets and free snacks and drinks. Promise to see you in less then 5 mins.

 

[iPrintStuff]

Via a quick google, the average UK worker pays about £1800 (approx 2350$) on national insurance per year. No extra charges on top of that, no matter how sick you get! Even the pills/prescriptions are free.

We do pay for dental but it’s nothing compared to what you guys pay. £60 for root canal lol (78$)

 

[equippaint]

My concern with that, which is the same majority of military veterans that use the VA; the US government is very inefficient at running programs. We've got two of the largest VA clinics where I'm at and I'm was still 6 months out for an ENT issue. Pretty much told me to go see a regular ER if it was too bad to wait. It was nearly 4-5 weeks just to get a consultation.

My mother is a recent cancer survivor (Stage 3b melanoma) and her treatments billed out to around $1.5mil. Cigna and a treatment provider paid all but a few thousand. If her treatment had been handled by the VA, she'd actually be dead.

Now if the system could run like my active duty care was, where you signed you name and waited to be called, that'd be amazing. I had to retrain myself not to go to the doctor for every little thing because of how easy it was, and that'd be a huge problem here. Similar to what you explained.

People keep pushing for a single payer here, but I don't think they realize what they are getting into. So some program is going to get rushed through and it's going to suck.

The point is to not rush things and come up with a proper system somehow or another. Wait times are bad for specialists outside of the va too. If someone has a real life threatening issue, they will get in. Thats partly why there are long waits.
We all could argue this all day long but saying we cant do something because it wont be as good as it should be or they will bastardize the program is an excuse for the intellectually lazy representatives that we keep employing with our votes.
When you get a huge power bill you dont sit back and say welp, its still cheaper than running my house off a generator. You start shutting windows when the ac is on and turning lights off behind you. I just dont understand how we got here. Its a drag on the economy and is eventually going to blow up if it continues at its current pace.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

We all could argue this all day long but saying we cant do something because it wont be as good as it should be or they will bastardize the program is an excuse for the intellectually lazy representatives that we keep employing with our votes.

And yet, people still vote them in expecting different results.

When you get a huge power bill you dont sit back and say welp, its still cheaper than running my house off a generator. You start shutting windows when the ac is on and turning lights off behind you. I just dont understand how we got here. Its a drag on the economy and is eventually going to blow up if it continues at its current pace.

Yes, that's us doing something about it. Not expecting politicians to come up with something that will work, where I would be hard pressed to imagine that they have the exact same issues that we do on the front line. There is a huge disconnect about what politicians deal with to what we deal with. Expecting them to come up with something that will work, when they don't have to deal with it themselves, in my mind, doesn't make much sense.

You get the same here. People with no insurance or medicaid hitting the er with nonsense or pill shopping.

Or, you have someone that went to a walkin doctor (only way to get someone on short notice, as in the next morning) and they wanted you to have a test and referred you to someone. Problem was, the place that they referred you to didn't take your insurance and wouldn't do "out of network" or even "self pay", so either it's get referred somewhere else that doesn't have that policy (if possible) or it's go to the emergency room to get the test done.

 

[brycesteiner]

My opinion is there are two solutions. Neither will make everyone happy but it will take care of the costs.

1. Either the government is all in and no private insurance for health (excluding dental) like Britain - single payer, or
2. The government is completely out and that includes medicaid/medicare and the prices would drop to realistic levels too as the competition would increase and take care of itself. When you have the same funder the prices will be put to the maximum they can get. When they have to actually get paid by people, the prices and services would be competitive.

Right now there are so many false medicaid claims filed it's not even funny. Just talking on the phone can get the taxpayer charged because they can. A bar of soap - $50; A syringe - $73, etc.

The worst possible was Obamacare as it tried to merge private and public - you are forced to buy from private insurers. If you don't you get heavy fines, which I have been several times now.

Can you imagine if there was a law that everyone was forced to buy signage or you would be fined? It sounds like the plan was more to keep insurance and doctors in business rather than keeping you healthy. I also pay a fortune each year now and I hate it. I see the billions in profits the insurance companies are making and that's because I'm forced to pay them. And guess what? You all ready know this - many times it only covers half after a $10,000 deductible.

The government needs to get out of it altogether and quit forcing me to subsidize those SOB's

Thanks Tex for getting me fired up.

 

[TimToad]

My concern with that, which is the same majority of military veterans that use the VA; the US government is very inefficient at running programs. We've got two of the largest VA clinics where I'm at and I'm was still 6 months out for an ENT issue. Pretty much told me to go see a regular ER if it was too bad to wait. It was nearly 4-5 weeks just to get a consultation.

My mother is a recent cancer survivor (Stage 3b melanoma) and her treatments billed out to around $1.5mil. Cigna and a treatment provider paid all but a few thousand. If her treatment had been handled by the VA, she'd actually be dead.

Now if the system could run like my active duty care was, where you signed you name and waited to be called, that'd be amazing. I had to retrain myself not to go to the doctor for every little thing because of how easy it was, and that'd be a huge problem here. Similar to what you explained.

People keep pushing for a single payer here, but I don't think they realize what they are getting into. So some program is going to get rushed through and it's going to suck.

We already have single payer, it's called Medicare, VA and Medicaid and they run on a 2-3% administrative cost as does the other so called wasteful "entitlement" program Social Security.

The reason we can't have nice things in the U.S. is because the 1%ers have convinced average, working class folks that anything that doesn't pad their pockets is bad and is going to suck. As the outlier in the ENTIRE industrialized world, I'm willing to take the chance that it isn't going to suck, costs will be contained and we'll stop showering lobbyists from hospital corporations and insurance executives with profits they don't have to earn through delivering better care. American rugged individualism and self-annointed exceptionalism isn't going to cure anybody of anything except bolster one's false pride.

The 40 or 50 other developed countries with national health insurance can't ALL be wrong. When the various quality of life figures come out every year, the fact that those with good social safety nets ALL score above the U.S. is telling and shouldn't be ignored.

Nearly every study of cost containment and effectiveness have revealed that not only would we all save money, it would boost the economy.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

Funny how I messaged you and told you I made a thread that you can discuss your Heathcare opinions freely instead of being attacked for doing so in someone else thread, and you messaged back saying it was "a harassing message and your going to report me" yet you take advantage of the thread I created?


Tex:
There ya go. Now you and Gino have nothing to whine about.. Half the arguments are you all yelling about who is posting what in someone else's thread.. Well, it takes 5 seconds to make a thread.. Now you can have an adult conversation freely... get croaking!

Toad:
I consider this harassment and will be reporting this message.

 

[equippaint]

We already have single payer, it's called Medicare, VA and Medicaid and they run on a 2-3% administrative cost as does the other so called wasteful "entitlement" program Social Security.

The reason we can't have nice things in the U.S. is because the 1%ers have convinced average, working class folks that anything that doesn't pad their pockets is bad and is going to suck. As the outlier in the ENTIRE industrialized world, I'm willing to take the chance that it isn't going to suck, costs will be contained and we'll stop showering lobbyists from hospital corporations and insurance executives with profits they don't have to earn through delivering better care. American rugged individualism and self-annointed exceptionalism isn't going to cure anybody of anything except bolster one's false pride.

The 40 or 50 other developed countries with national health insurance can't ALL be wrong. When the various quality of life figures come out every year, the fact that those with good social safety nets ALL score above the U.S. is telling and shouldn't be ignored.

Nearly every study of cost containment and effectiveness have revealed that not only would we all save money, it would boost the economy.

The usa will get it wrong, I think thats a big fear. It will be some cobbled up garbage because it will be a clusterf of knowledge and experience colliding with bravado, resistance and stupidy with a good helping of sabotage from those that just want to say see, I told you this wont work.
Much the same as people sitting on the side lines with their fingers crossed hoping that the economy tanks just so they can say haha, told you Trump would bankrupt us.
As for 1 percenters, they are not alone. The fair share of leaches in this country also drag us way down and are a drain on society. This all is independent of political affilitation, both sides own their share of these types yet each seem to think they are squeeky clean and the other has a monopoly on the losers

 

[dypinc]

My opinion is there are two solutions. Neither will make everyone happy but it will take care of the costs.

1. Either the government is all in and no private insurance for health (excluding dental) like Britain - single payer, or
2. The government is completely out and that includes medicaid/medicare and the prices would drop to realistic levels too as the competition would increase and take care of itself. When you have the same funder the prices will be put to the maximum they can get. When they have to actually get paid by people, the prices and services would be competitive.

Right now there are so many false medicaid claims filed it's not even funny. Just talking on the phone can get the taxpayer charged because they can. A bar of soap - $50; A syringe - $73, etc.

The worst possible was Obamacare as it tried to merge private and public - you are forced to buy from private insurers. If you don't you get heavy fines, which I have been several times now.

Can you imagine if there was a law that everyone was forced to buy signage or you would be fined? It sounds like the plan was more to keep insurance and doctors in business rather than keeping you healthy. I also pay a fortune each year now and I hate it. I see the billions in profits the insurance companies are making and that's because I'm forced to pay them. And guess what? You all ready know this - many times it only covers half after a $10,000 deductible.

The government needs to get out of it altogether and quit forcing me to subsidize those SOB's

Thanks Tex for getting me fired up.

They didn't it call the "Unaffordable Health Control Act" for nothing.

 

[TimToad]

The usa will get it wrong, I think thats a big fear. It will be some cobbled up garbage because it will be a clusterf of knowledge and experience colliding with bravado, resistance and stupidy with a good helping of sabotage from those that just want to say see, I told you this wont work.
Much the same as people sitting on the side lines with their fingers crossed hoping that the economy tanks just so they can say haha, told you Trump would bankrupt us.
As for 1 percenters, they are not alone. The fair share of leaches in this country also drag us way down and are a drain on society. This all is independent of political affilitation, both sides own their share of these types yet each seem to think they are squeeky clean and the other has a monopoly on the losers

Given enough time, the Supreme Creamsicle Genius WILL bankrupt us. He wouldn't know how to run an ecomony any better than he did at business. What kind of moron inherits $425 million and goes bankrupt four or five times, gets blacklisted by every bank in America and stiffs countless suppliers, vendors, etc. in the process?

In case you haven't noticed, every credible economic forecast has us with 2% growth for 2019, we've already seen a RECORD rise in the deficit as well as a TRILLION+ annual bump in the national debt are projected. Fiscal restraint isn't exactly his forte. Chronic abuse of the bankruptcy courts is.

The so called leeches at the bottom of the pile aren't costing the Treasury billions and billions.

 

[TimToad]

Funny how I messaged you and told you I made a thread that you can discuss your Heathcare opinions freely instead of being attacked for doing so in someone else thread, and you messaged back saying it was "a harassing message and your going to report me" yet you take advantage of the thread I created?


Tex:
There ya go. Now you and Gino have nothing to whine about.. Half the arguments are you all yelling about who is posting what in someone else's thread.. Well, it takes 5 seconds to make a thread.. Now you can have an adult conversation freely... get croaking!

Toad:
I consider this harassment and will be reporting this message.

I can't believe you would post a private message between us and let this much time go by since i replied back and told you it was a belated April Fool's joke. What a dick move. I just knew your motives weren't sincere.

 

[GAC05]

I'm on the Death Plan - I plan to die when my warranty expires.