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Help finding a PMS color that is close to a vinyl color

Kottwitz-Graphics

New Member
I need help finding a PMS color to match a vinyl color, or at least a CMYK value.
The vinyl is Avery Olive Green (900 supercast), SC 900-765-O. The closest that I am coming to it is PMS 576 c. I know it won't be a perfect match, so close will work.

Any help is appreciated.
 

myront

Dammit, make it faster!!
Your Pantone color swatch thingy should have the cmyk values under it. Don't go by the program conversion. You'll have to go in and alter those values in order to get closer. We do this all the time. Create several squares, leave the first square at the exact pantone color then just alter the others a bit. Print all the squares and see where you get.
 

myront

Dammit, make it faster!!
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Correct Color

New Member
You'll have to go in and alter those values in order to get closer. We do this all the time.

Just suppose you never had to do that again.

Ever.

What do you suppose that would be worth to you?
 

TXFB.INS

New Member
Just suppose you never had to do that again.

Ever.

What do you suppose that would be worth to you?

sounds great, where can we get this............... how does this work when there are color shifts when you do a new roll or better yet within the same roll
 

myront

Dammit, make it faster!!
Just suppose you never had to do that again.

Ever.

What do you suppose that would be worth to you?

Absolutely impossible! Like getting the spouse to admit they're wrong kind of impossible! LOL

...hmmmm, I suppose if you had some sort of universal color chart that one could feed into there printer system and have it self adjust to best reproduce that same chart...Uhhhh....nah!!
 

Correct Color

New Member
sounds great, where can we get this...............
You get it from me. It's called Color By Correct Color and it's what I do for a living.

how does this work when there are color shifts when you do a new roll or better yet within the same roll
Well, funny thing is after ten years in this business, and after over 600 individual projects, I can count the times I've seen such situations literally on one hand. So all I can say for sure is it's my experience that such things are not the industry norm.

But it is of course true that you can't color manage an unstable workflow, for whatever reason. But what all of my clients do get is lifetime free tech support, so that if you really do indeed have such an issue, I'll work with you to get to the bottom of it, and to find a solution so that you no longer have to deal with it.
 

myront

Dammit, make it faster!!
You get it from me. It's called Color By Correct Color and it's what I do for a living.


Well, funny thing is after ten years in this business, and after over 600 individual projects, I can count the times I've seen such situations literally on one hand. So all I can say for sure is it's my experience that such things are not the industry norm.

But it is of course true that you can't color manage an unstable workflow, for whatever reason. But what all of my clients do get is lifetime free tech support, so that if you really do indeed have such an issue, I'll work with you to get to the bottom of it, and to find a solution so that you no longer have to deal with it.

Our color problems aren't necessarily producing colors by the pantone chart but rather from printing on one printer and when that one goes out printing to another and achieve the same colors as before. We need one print profile for all different medias without having to assign a color profile for each. To me it's not cost effective to rely on one person to know he print process but we can't afford the time it takes to train every employee color management. We need a system whereby we only have to train them to load and unload the printer not color management.
 

Correct Color

New Member
Our color problems aren't necessarily producing colors by the pantone chart but rather from printing on one printer and when that one goes out printing to another and achieve the same colors as before.

Understood. Or even just being able to run the same job simultaneously on more than one printer. That's a very big reason for getting Color By Correct Color. It allows you to do just that.

We need one print profile for all different medias without having to assign a color profile for each.

Well, it might sound easy and painless to do it that way, and lots of people do, but it's not to your advantage. After all, if all media truly did print the same, then there wouldn't be any need for profiles at all. However if you want to take full advantage of every machine on every media, that's not going to get you there.

To me it's not cost effective to rely on one person to know he print process but we can't afford the time it takes to train every employee color management.

You most assuredly do not have to.

What I can guarantee you just from this exchange are three things:

That if you bring me in to set you up with Color By Correct Color I can:

Improve your print quality;

Make you a much easier workflow than you have now;

Save you a lot of money.


 

dypinc

New Member
You get it from me. It's called Color By Correct Color and it's what I do for a living.

how does this work when there are color shifts when you do a new roll or better yet within the same roll

Well, funny thing is after ten years in this business, and after over 600 individual projects, I can count the times I've seen such situations literally on one hand. So all I can say for sure is it's my experience that such things are not the industry norm.

But it is of course true that you can't color manage an unstable workflow, for whatever reason. But what all of my clients do get is lifetime free tech support, so that if you really do indeed have such an issue, I'll work with you to get to the bottom of it, and to find a solution so that you no longer have to deal with it.

Whoa here. Most of the time I agree with, but this time I have to strongly disagree. You didn't really mean what you wrote here did you. If you did that is sure to give the wrong impression as maintaining correct color on digital output devices is just not that simple.

After almost 20 years of running digital output devices there are not enough fingers and toes of the people logged in here to count the number of times I have seen colors shift because of, changes to hardware both inkjet, (heads replaced, firmware changes, yes and even new ink cartridges, etc.) and toner devices, (drums. transfer belts, 2ndBTRs etc.). And media is an even worse culprit, from one roll to another or within a roll, and sheet feed paper, don't even get me started on that. Then another variable is temperature and humidity.

If you think any digital device or media is that stable your kidding yourself. I hope that the training you give enables the user to use the tools (Software and Spectro) to calibrate the device and media back to a known state of printing the correct color and or in more extreme cases to create a new profile to get back to the correct color. Frankly as I mentioned there are way too many variables to every hope to maintain correct color without constance vigilance and a strategy and tools to deal with it.
 

dypinc

New Member
It's called a color bridge.
Everyone that prints should have one, IMHO.

https://www.pantone.com/color-bridge-coated-uncoated

Yes and everybody that has one should also have a spectro to read the Lab values of the Spot Color side to import into the Pantone libraries of their RIP if the named Pantone Spot color is not accurate within the gamut of your output device. But whether you use Lab or CMYK that needs to entered into the RIP as a replacement for the named Pantone Spot color, not somewhere up stream in the print/work flow.
 

Correct Color

New Member
Whoa here. Most of the time I agree with, but this time I have to strongly disagree. You didn't really mean what you wrote here did you. If you did that is sure to give the wrong impression as maintaining correct color on digital output devices is just not that simple.

After almost 20 years of running digital output devices there are not enough fingers and toes of the people logged in here to count the number of times I have seen colors shift because of, changes to hardware both inkjet, (heads replaced, firmware changes, yes and even new ink cartridges, etc.) and toner devices, (drums. transfer belts, 2ndBTRs etc.). And media is an even worse culprit, from one roll to another or within a roll, and sheet feed paper, don't even get me started on that. Then another variable is temperature and humidity.

Well perhaps I as less than clear.

I work almost exclusively in large format inkjet, so I tend to think in those terms, and write in those terms.

So yes, if you widen "digital output devices" to include CLC machines, then yes, they are notoriously unstable.

But I was referring specifically to inkjet.

And, with regard to inkjet, my own experience -- which is fairly substantial -- covering all manner of inkjet devices, processes and media around the world, is that the process is remarkably stable, and much more stable than a lot of what you read on the Internet would lead you to believe.

In fact, my experience is that most aqueous, solvent, and UV machines tend to never drift at all unless there is a change to their ink, or to their head voltage.

Latex is another issue, and interestingly, all of the machines I've gotten calls on over the years that have had drift issues have been HP machines. After an issue I just worked through I'm working up an opinion on that, but I'll keep it to myself for now.

And just by the way, I'd honestly love it if this wasn't true, and these machines were as unstable as many are led to believe.

When I got into this business ten years ago, I assumed all I read out there was true, and that I'd have a ton of repeat business doing color tune-ups and the like. And it's turned out not to be true.

Most of the clients I have, and most of the profiles I write, they run them till they get rid of the machines. They'll get new machines and call me in to profile them, and I'll test the old ones, and it amazes me how little they move in how long a period of time.

I'd also just add that as far as I'm concerned any machine manufacturer that would invalidate existing machine printing conditions with a firmware update ought to be run right out if the industry. I've heard if that happening with HP, although I've never actually seen it myself. But anyone else? No. Never have.

What I have seen many, many, many times over the years is color workflow issues that have been wrongly blamed on machine drift. So while you do learn in this business never to say never, and while I'm not going to argue with you or anyone else over your own experiences, all I can tell you is that my own personal experiences are exactly as I describe.
 

F80M3

Custom Title
You get it from me. It's called Color By Correct Color and it's what I do for a living.


Well, funny thing is after ten years in this business, and after over 600 individual projects, I can count the times I've seen such situations literally on one hand. So all I can say for sure is it's my experience that such things are not the industry norm.

But it is of course true that you can't color manage an unstable workflow, for whatever reason. But what all of my clients do get is lifetime free tech support, so that if you really do indeed have such an issue, I'll work with you to get to the bottom of it, and to find a solution so that you no longer have to deal with it.

How much would this cost if I'm in Hawaii?:cool:
 
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