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How so............................ ??

Discussion in 'Materials' started by Gino, Jul 19, 2012.

  1. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    There's another thread going on about the selling of chemicals.

    So as not to mess that one up.... I started this one.


    Why wouldn't you have to have a license to re-sell goods you don't have a right to ??

    In other words...... how does the manufacturer of these chemicals and solutions know you are selling it correctly, let alone safely ??

    For our distributors or vendors to sell their products, they need to have a clearance as far as territory goes, haz-mat materials and all kinds of other obligations that we don't have. In theory, that's the same as buying ink from a distributor and re-selling it. You don't have permission to do that.... or do you ??

    If that's the case, then you could sell printers, media and whatever else you want without having the worry of having inventory.

    In my thinking, it's the same as using someone else's trademarked or copyrighted materials without consent. The manufacturer might not want you doing it for many reasons. The main one being, you just might be depleting your own distributors abilities. Why not just send a client to them directly ?? Oh, because they don't have authority to buy it being an end-user. So, why or how do you have the ability ?? Just because you ignore rules or is it in fact allowed. Do you have a license in your state implying that you can sell things other than signs ?? Can you sell cupcakes, pies and steaks without asking the Board of Health to check out your setup.

    I totally understand trying to make an extra buck, but why in this fashion if you aren't really allowed to ??

    Your vendor might say go ahead, sell as much as you can. But does the manufacturer agree with this ??
    Just a yearning to learn. :rock-n-roll: Gino
     
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  2. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    Do you really think Roger Bailey is going to object to selling more Rapid Tac or Remover? Highly unlikely....and you can buy the stuff on ebay or elsewhere on the internets... so I'm not too concerned about it personally.
     
  3. FireSprint

    FireSprint Very Active Member

    I don't think most of the chemicals we use, even in the screen printing industry, are regulated.

    It would be one thing if we were selling regulated chemicals, that then would definitely be illegal.

    Just to be clear here though, we don't sell chemicals, I am just playing devil's advocate.

    Gino, I think you're playing it safe, and when you have a successful sign business like yours, why take the risk and jeopardize that for few bucks you might make on some side deal. For some others, that couple of bucks might be worth the risk if there is any.
     
  4. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    Thanks for the input. This thread is really about discussion or debate.... not who is or isn't doing it, but how.



    That's a fair assumption, Bigdawg, but is it correct ??

    I can think of a lot of people or companies that would like to sell more stuff, so does that make it fair we just decide who we think will and won't be offended or have a problem with it ??

    That's kinda my whole point, if we can decide who will let us sell some weasel p!ss, then why can't we just use any ol' clip-art we want and just decide on our own if someone objects or not ??

    Or, decide to start selling anything we want with no regard to what we really are allowed to sell or not.

    Just wondering where the rules stop and start for the same kinda process.
     
  5. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    one would guess that if it has that diamond on it with a number and a hazard symbol, you shouldnt be reselling it. but I believe you are talking about rapid remover - AKA citrus based cleaner
     
  6. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    Because clip-art is intellectual property. And Rapid-tac is a product. Apples and oranges there.

    There are no restrictions or terms of use statement on Rapid Tac (just went and read my bottles :smile:) on reselling or anything else that says it is only for those in the sign industry. And since it isn't regulated and unless there is a specific prohibition from reselling, then IMHO it is fair to buy and resell.
     
  7. maskman

    maskman Member

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    I believe there is a distinct difference in selling Clip art then a product like a remover and here is my thought processon it

    when you buy clip-art , part of the agreement, upon purchase, Is that you will not resell the product as clip art . It is ok to use it for shirts and signs and such and sell them but not the clip art , Itself

    Where as a cleaner or other so called Tanagable (sorry for the spelling) . Once you buy it from the MFG/ Store. It is you property to do with as you will. Yes ,If someone gets hurt ,I would Guess(???) It could fall back on the seller,Esp. In this day and age but you bought the product and it is yours . Like a printer ,car ,flowers etc.
     
  8. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    Okay, but when you sell these removers or adhering products in these new containers... are you or anyone else doing this..... including all the warnings, fire instructions, health precautions and all the other vital information in writing on the container ??

    Every container I have, [I just looked, too] has all these rules and do's and don'ts on them. Otherwise, if someone used them from one of your un-marked containers.... you re-packaged this stuff incorrectly and are then re-selling this stuff, making a profit from Roger's or whomever products and not doing your job 100% according to their standards.

    I could see if like some of the others.... you just handed a bottle out in the original container and did it as a favor and not tried to make a buck or two on something so small. If the public or end-user can't get it on their own, I don't understand the need to sell them something meant for our use ??

    Like someone said, I just tell them to put some drops of baby shampoo into a bottle and add water. That's completely safe.

    In fact, this isn't just about Roger's stuff, but anything we're re-selling without licensing for in the first place. I have licenses for designing, fabricating and installing just about any sign possible. However, I still have to get further licenses or stamped approvals to sometimes proceed to the next level when fabricating a sign or installing one. So, why don't y'all need a license to be selling stuff to the public ??
     
  9. maskman

    maskman Member

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    I would think, If they are taking a container( Example:RapidTac) and placing it into another container ( unmarked) then it would not only be a copyright infringement but Unsafe.

    It would be like giving someone a unmarked container of Draino and not advising them against the dangers of mixing with Gasoline (DO NOT DO THIS!!!!!!)


    ANY CHEMICAL SHOULD BE LABELED !!!! PERIOD!

    There maybe a law saying it has to be . So that would be another law suit . Not to mention if there was no MSDS
     
  10. ChicagoGraphics

    ChicagoGraphics Major Contributor

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    Wouldn't that mean you can't sell anything even blank coroplast?

    Rapid remover is not harmful if swallowed, I did it a few years ago by mistake and the worse part about it was the taste of oranges for a few days.
     
  11. TheSnowman

    TheSnowman Major Contributor

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    Yea...I'm with Chicago. And is Application Fluid really harmful? It's hardly a chemical it seems to the bare hands. I use it all the time and it just makes everything smell like vanilla...I don't see that as a side effect to working with it.
     
  12. maskman

    maskman Member

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    Coroplast is a product that can not be mixed with another product . Yes, you can attach vinyl to it but it is already in a finished form ( so to speak)

    Where as a liquid can be mixed with other chemicals when they leave your sight. Yes it is nontoxic but lets say ....
    You ( example) sell some and The person you sell it to ( being inexperenced ) mixes it with windex or ammonia or some other chemical . Is it still non-toxic ? will it put off toxic fumes?

    It by itself is non-toxic but there are still warnings and a MSDS
     
  13. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    I sell it as I receive it - in gallons. We don't break it down for anybody.

    I'm not really getting where you are coming from about the selling end (although I do understand your health and safety concerns). People buy and resell products all the time. If I sell a blank piece of coro... do I need to get permission because it's not a completed sign? Of course not...
     
  14. ColoPrinthead

    ColoPrinthead Swollen Member

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    I think the main issue is whether you are an authorized distributor who receives volume and vendor pricing. I had the misfortune of working for a shop here in town that tried to be a print house and distributor/vendor in order to get their media on the cheap and it didn't work out all. They didn't have the production or media sales to keep up the charade and years later they had rolls of media from their first or second order.

    In my opinion I think there is no problem selling application fluid (all the warnings are on the label) other than you can't sell it at a competitive price and volume to make a worthwhile profit (of course your average custy wouldn't even know what app fluid is or where to get it so I guess you could double what you pay if you want to be like that).
     
  15. ucmj22

    ucmj22 Very Active Member

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    I think the only way you might get in trouble for reselling it is if there are regulations on information that must be on the bottle or included with the sale. if you rebottle it and sell it without the required information you could be in trouble. Other than that I really dont see where the issue is.
     
  16. john1

    john1 Guest

    The last thread was talking about application fluid, Not nuclear chemicals.

    This thread still goes hand in hand as it's related to the previous one about "juice"

    Not trying to start another argument but i understand buying something crazy then selling it but we are talking application fluid. Not a big deal and we hardly get a vendor pricing on it vs someone who is joe blow because you can go on eBay and buy it for about the same if not cheaper most of the times no matter who you are.

    People are out there cutting drugs and re-selling them illegally and we are bickering over application fluid for customer installs, lol

    All in good debating though Gino :)
     
  17. Coloradosigns

    Coloradosigns Major Contributor

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    not going to lie, i just sold 2 gallons of rapid remove to a trucking company moving their decals. They did this so they don't have to pay us to do it. Thank GOD, I don't have the time, nor the want to do it. Now we just got 36 semis to rebrand when they're done :)
     
  18. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    What, just what.... if you redistributed your rapid tac into small bottles without labeling them and used remover instead of application fluid by mistake ??

    You WOULD not be here today telling me you did it and it tasted like oranges. You'd be a goner. And why ?? Because you goofed up. So doing this to yourself is fine, but selling your incompetence to end-users without a license sounds a little irresponsible.

    What kind of quality control policies do you have in place to prevent this from happening ??

    If there's nothing wrong with it... why is it spruced up to smell like oranges or Chrsitmas cookies ??

    Anything that has a nice odor to it, tends to tell me, there's something in it pretty stinky and possibly a tad bad if I drank it. Or what if some kid wandering through the house smelled oranges and decided to drink it ??

    Oh my, I didn't label it, but I thought you were going to do signs with it, not let it lay around your house for your 4 year old to drink. Wha ?? you say you're not a sign shop. You didn't know it was bad for you ?? Now why would you not know it ?? Oh, there's no label on it. I'll talk to the manufacturer and see if we can't get around this lawsuit you have me involved with. This is foolish, I told you how to use it and I don't care if your kid can't read, yet. You shouldn't have it around the house if you don't know what you doing.

    If this doesn't make it.... how about the many chemicals around the house which tell you not to mix this with that or there will be problems ?? Do your second-hand bottle say all of this ??

    Selling Cor-X. Yes, I have a license telling me I can sell it as a sign or in some form of advertising products. If someone wishes to use it for their guinea pig cage..... more power to them, but if their guinea pig eats through it, gets sick and dies.... I didn't sell it for anything other than a piece of advertisement.

    Again, we're all getting bogged down with rapid tac..... can you re-bottle sign paint ?? Screening inks ?? Emulsions ??


    Slappy.... you mentioned you have a truck-side to your sign shop. When you sell oil for engines or degreaser or even filters....... can you sell anybody you want.... or do you have to get permission to sell a particular brand ??

    Can you sell Fram, Bosch and your own version all on the same rack ?? Can you even sell your own home made filters ??

    I know when I had a soda machine in the shop, I couldn't buy soda from anyone else, but my supplier. I even used to store some beer in the back of the machine and the guy got p!ssed off and told me to take it out. Hardly think I could use someone else's product or the manufacturer's might get upset.
     
  19. maskman

    maskman Member

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    The only problem I really would have is if it is in a Unmarked container ,Where non-of the safety concerns are stated.

    there is a difference, as I stated above,(IMHO) between selling clip-art and selling a Clearly marked Original bottle of cleaner /Adhesive remover ,etc.

    I see a difference between a piece of Coro (solid ) and a bottle (liquid) Chemical of any type.
     
  20. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    Hahahahaha... your guys must have it down a whole better than mine.. It takes them about a gallon every 4 vans...
     

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