Hp Latex compared to Roland versaart re 640

[lazaros]

Hey guys. Need your input and advice. I am in the process of buying a new outdoor machine. I was leaning toward the roland versaart re 640 until i saw the new hp l26500 latex machine.

I would like to here both positive and negative comments for both machines. I have been researching both machines. something i did not find out though is the cost per square meter to print on outdoor banner(for example).

Another thing tha draw my attention is the fact that the HP printer can print on cloth. Can't the roland print on cloth as well?

Any of you who have experience with the printers would be kind enough to offer your input?

 

[lazaros]

I have found this link but this is from roland.
http://www.ponygraphics.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/L26500_vs_RE-6401.pdf
scroll down to see the comparison...

 

[jasonx]

I have found this link but this is from roland.
http://www.ponygraphics.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/L26500_vs_RE-6401.pdf
scroll down to see the comparison...

You don't print a print head alignment each time you change a roll.
Ink not curing at the sides is a profile issue not a latex issue. Uncured ink is uncured ink and can be fixed by setting the temperatures correctly.

If you want to do volume runs get the latex.

If you want to do short runs of changing your media constantly through out the day get the Roland.

Its good that Roland haven't mentioned any features of the HP. Replaceable printheads, OMAS, Double Sided Printing, Larger print cartridges for longer runs, no solvents, no out gassing can use the prints straight off the printer.

Both have their pro's and con's. We've gone from three Rolands to three latex machines and a UV printer.

 

[lazaros]

You don't print a print head alignment each time you change a roll.
Ink not curing at the sides is a profile issue not a latex issue. Uncured ink is uncured ink and can be fixed by setting the temperatures correctly.

If you want to do volume runs get the latex.

If you want to do short runs of changing your media constantly through out the day get the Roland.

Its good that Roland haven't mentioned any features of the HP. Replaceable printheads, OMAS, Double Sided Printing, Larger print cartridges for longer runs, no solvents, no out gassing can use the prints straight off the printer.

Both have their pro's and con's. We've gone from three Rolands to three latex machines and a UV printer.

thank you for your input jason, much appreciated!
I own a small print shop, and yes i will be changing the media often. I am going to be printing mostly, banner, vinyl, wallpaper maybe flags(all outdoor). I'm hoping (and i am going to try) to get a bigger client base with an outdoor machine, as i am printing on an epson 9800 for now. the epson gives The best quality i have seen so far but it is indoor and it has high printing costs.

 

[jayhawksigns]

Wow, there is a lot of crap in that pdf, and not in a good way.

Maybe they are taking cues from our presidential election as to how to sell equipment.

 

[lazaros]

Wow, there is a lot of crap in that pdf, and not in a good way.

Maybe they are taking cues from our presidential election as to how to sell equipment.

That's why i need your help. pretty much everything i am going through is biased towards the one side or the other!
It's very difficult to find the pure facts and compare them.

 

[jayhawksigns]

I don't know about the new solvents, but I don't mind running long, high ink load jobs anymore. With our JV3, which was a stronger solvent machine, I loathed running those types of prints because even with our air extraction fans running the shop would still smell up. And as the machine got up there in age I didn't trust letting it run overnight so the printing had to be done during shop hours. That isn't a problem with the HP, true there is a smell to the machine, and healthy or not like the solvents, I only notice it when I am hovering over the printer checking on the print.

Power and heat, we haven't noticed a jump in either. Our shop has 12'-14' ceiling so that probably helps on the heat side, but like with the smell, even when I am directly in front of the printer I don't notice an immediate spike in air temp. Power wise, 220 doesn't immediately mean you are drawing more power, its just spreading out the power draw between more wire so that you are not pulling as many amps through the circuit.

The biggest drawback I see is probably the speed of the printer. But when you consider that you can pull a print off of the print and immediately laminate it, without letting it outgas it does help make up for some of that. Same argument some people make for the HP not having a built in cutter. Get the print out of the printer and let it do its job, saving the cutting for a plotter. And no, you don't have to do a calibration EVERY time you change media, I don't.

I ran a JV3 for nine years, loved the machine, hated the smell. Before we started looking I said I would just buy a JV33 without shopping around, but I didn't. Wasn't impressed with the samples we got from the JV33, so I chopped it off of our list. Then I looked at the Epson GS6000. Heard a lot of complaints about things, and honestly it looks like a lot of those could of been installation mistakes. At the time though it was enough to rule it out. So I was looking at the Seiko and eventually the HP. And you know what we bought.

For anyone who has dealt with the odor and outgassing with solvents, the HP offered and alternative that fixed both of those issues. It just depends if you can deal with the "quirks", and for us, right now, I'ld buy another HP without checking out other printers, its impressed me that much.


For ink cost, did a 57"x46" banner, 13oz, moderately heavy ink load and the printer is telling me it cost me $9.39, that is for ink and media.

 

[FrankW]

I support both Rolands and HP's, and a lot of the things written in that PDF is nonsense, and some of the critics also apply for the Roland too (e. g. last page, ink on the platen when printing textile media). I can't believe that this is an official roland document, it's not serious.

 

[Chimuka]

Matthew, Your reply has been the most helpful I have read. I am thinking of changing from a Mutoh 1304 ( which has performed very well over the last 4 years. ) to the latex. I do a lot of short runs with various medias , 30" and switch to 54" calendered and cast. 38" and 54" 13 oz banner material. At times I run regular metalic and ultra metalic vinyls, but it seems like more and more shorter runs. Would you still recomend the latex for my use? Thanks

 

[Vital Designs]

I don't know about the new solvents, but I don't mind running long, high ink load jobs anymore. With our JV3, which was a stronger solvent machine, I loathed running those types of prints because even with our air extraction fans running the shop would still smell up. And as the machine got up there in age I didn't trust letting it run overnight so the printing had to be done during shop hours. That isn't a problem with the HP, true there is a smell to the machine, and healthy or not like the solvents, I only notice it when I am hovering over the printer checking on the print.

Power and heat, we haven't noticed a jump in either. Our shop has 12'-14' ceiling so that probably helps on the heat side, but like with the smell, even when I am directly in front of the printer I don't notice an immediate spike in air temp. Power wise, 220 doesn't immediately mean you are drawing more power, its just spreading out the power draw between more wire so that you are not pulling as many amps through the circuit.

The biggest drawback I see is probably the speed of the printer. But when you consider that you can pull a print off of the print and immediately laminate it, without letting it outgas it does help make up for some of that. Same argument some people make for the HP not having a built in cutter. Get the print out of the printer and let it do its job, saving the cutting for a plotter. And no, you don't have to do a calibration EVERY time you change media, I don't.

I ran a JV3 for nine years, loved the machine, hated the smell. Before we started looking I said I would just buy a JV33 without shopping around, but I didn't. Wasn't impressed with the samples we got from the JV33, so I chopped it off of our list. Then I looked at the Epson GS6000. Heard a lot of complaints about things, and honestly it looks like a lot of those could of been installation mistakes. At the time though it was enough to rule it out. So I was looking at the Seiko and eventually the HP. And you know what we bought.

For anyone who has dealt with the odor and outgassing with solvents, the HP offered and alternative that fixed both of those issues. It just depends if you can deal with the "quirks", and for us, right now, I'ld buy another HP without checking out other printers, its impressed me that much.


For ink cost, did a 57"x46" banner, 13oz, moderately heavy ink load and the printer is telling me it cost me $9.39, that is for ink and media.

I am surprised by your comment about the quality of the JV33 prints (the suppliers were not doing something right). I have a Roland, JV33 and HP26500 and the JV33 prints detailed, vibrant prints consistantly (with SS21 inks). Its an awesome printer and a real workhorse.

 

[lazaros]

Thank you all for your comments. I am going to try and list all the pros and cons of each machine and please feel free to correct me where somethine is not true.
HP l26500 (priced around 25000 US dollars with out the rip)
Probably better quality prints(since it is a 6 color machine) - and a bit more expensive since we are using 6 colors to print.
odorless
prints on a wider base of material(given that the media can withstand heat)
consumes more power due to the heaters
better for long runs.
ready to laminate right out of the printer.

Roland re-640 (priced at 17000 dollars including the rip)
good quality prints(cheaper than the hp since it is a 4-color machine)
prints on uncoated ecosolvent media.
prints need to sit for a while before laminated.
more economic at power consumption.
better for short run prints.
Both machines are industrial strength from what i have been reading so far.
The inks are more expensive than the HP.

please feel free to correct me where i am wrong and add more pros or cons based on your experience!

 

[tomence]

Whatever you buy it's gonna do the same job anyway. It's up to you what you want to buy. Either printer will make you money.

 

[lazaros]

Whatever you buy it's gonna do the same job anyway. It's up to you what you want to buy. Either printer will make you money.

that is true, but i am trying to find out which machine will have the least of troubles, and probably which one is cheaper to run.

 

[tomence]

If you ask me i would say Roland RE because that's what i have. HP is a great printer too, originally i wanted to buy the HP but i changed my mind and got the Roland and i am very happy i did. Very easy to use, in my opinion print quality is better than the hp eventhough it is only a 4 color printer, it comes with 2 year warranty it is a bulletproof printer. You said it in your post that price difference between the two is around $8000-$10000 HP being the more expensive one. Running cost is the same between the two.

 

[lazaros]

If you ask me i would say Roland RE because that's what i have. HP is a great printer too, originally i wanted to buy the HP but i changed my mind and got the Roland and i am very happy i did. Very easy to use, in my opinion print quality is better than the hp eventhough it is only a 4 color printer, it comes with 2 year warranty it is a bulletproof printer. You said it in your post that price difference between the two is around $8000-$10000 HP being the more expensive one. Running cost is the same between the two.

What inks are you using? the originals? or aftermarket ones? how about any clogging issues?
indeed i'm leaning more toward the roland due to the price tag, but if i find out that the hp is giving so much more for the price why not consider it as well?

 

[tomence]

I am using the original eco sol max inks. Since i got the printer i have been printing every day for 3 months now and no clogs so far. The only benefit that i see buying the HP is if you are a vehicle wrap shop and you are busy and need to laminate prints right away, other than that both printers will do the same job at a same running cost.

 

[lazaros]

I am using the original eco sol max inks. Since i got the printer i have been printing every day for 3 months now and no clogs so far. The only benefit that i see buying the HP is if you are a vehicle wrap shop and you are busy and need to laminate prints right away, other than that both printers will do the same job at a same running cost.

I don't do vehicle wraps so far, but it is something i would like to try. But for now the instant dry time it's not a bother for me. thank you for your help though! much appreciate it.

 

[lazaros]

For ink cost, did a 57"x46" banner, 13oz, moderately heavy ink load and the printer is telling me it cost me $9.39, that is for ink and media.

Thank you for the detailed post Mathew. Very helpful indeed!

so these dimensions come to about 1.67 square meters. and it costs 9.39(media included). it comes to about 5.60 per square meter.

Anybody knows the costs for the re-640 in a square meter?

 

[john1]

I love my Roland, Sometimes i don't print for days and no clogs in 2 years. OEM inks is all i run.

I have the machine to auto clean every 8 hours to prevent clogging when not in use.

All i keep hearing is heads being replaced after a simple head strike and the ink costs are pretty high on the HP's.

 

[lazaros]

All i keep hearing is heads being replaced after a simple head strike and the ink costs are pretty high on the HP's.

Even though i don't know, it seems a bit of an exaggeration that a small head strike(i am guessing on the media as it moves left and right) would get the head to need replacement?

As i said i don't know but when you say a simple head strike i suppose you mean on the media?