I just made the biggest blunder one could make on a full wrap for a full size van

[ddubia]

I started making signs when you had to have a can of paint and a brush, and I've made some mistakes in that time but nothing as costly as this one. I'll try to keep it as short and sweet as I can 'cause frankly, I don't want to talk about it. I want it to go away.

First I should mention I've never printed a full size wrap before. Everything up to now has been partial wraps with no overlaps. (I may have already said enough)

Full wrap on an extended 2004 Chevy van using 3M IJ180C-10 with 8518 over laminate. It has a background gradient of Dark Blue in the front to Light Blue in the middle to Dark Blue at the rear. There's some large graphics
along with some lettering which I chose to print and cut separate and apply over the initial install to ensure it was straight when finished.

I'm sure everyone's on the edge of their seat to hear what the blunder is. Well...

The blunder is that I set the overlap at 3" so I'd have 1.5" on each side of each panel except the ends. I ran three paneled files, each side and the back.

It printed nice, laminated very well. I cut the panels out of the material and when my son came in to begin the install he found there was no overlap between the back doors!

Dang, I figured. But I can reprint them in plenty of time. But I was getting nervous because sometimes things just ain't that simple. We went and checked the other panels and there's not an overlap on any of them!!

I've got a full size van printed and ready to install and have no overlaps between panels.

I went back into Onyx and brought up the files in Preflight and sure enough the tick box where you set your overlap amount is 0.0". I specifically set it at 3.0" before printing. At least I'm sure I did as I was reading through the User Manual as I was setting it up to make double dang sure I didn't make a mistake. And so I didn't commit it to print until I was sure I had all my ducks in a row.

I remembered that I did, at one point, adjust the panel sizes to avoid a seam at tough spot but that's all. Thinking maybe that caused the overlap to reset to 0.0" and I hadn't noticed, I again set the overlap and then purposefully adjusted the panel sizes but it had no effect on the overlap. So I'm at a complete loss as to how it happened. But it happened on all three files.

I know that sounds like I'm saying it just happened and couldn't have been my fault but I'm not blaming Onyx or anyone other than me. Been real busy and tired lately and I could have overlooked it somehow even though I thought I was being relentless in my quest for perfection. (I just now had the thought while writing this that maybe having just read about the overlaps and feeling I fully confident that I understood it made me feel as though I just did it). Hell, I don't know.

But figuring out how it happen is the least of my worries right now. I have no overlaps and need to get this installed.


Has anyone ever had this happen and come up with a reasonable install fix for it? This van job is no Lamborghini but I treat every one as though it were. I sure don't want to have to tell the customer his job won't be ready on time and I dang sure don't want to print the whole job over but if I must I will.

Somebody tell me no one will notice this and everything will be ok. Please? Lol

Can I print strips to place over the seams without them sticking out like big, swelled-up. pus filled sore thumbs? Can I melt the seams together with a torch so that nobody will notice? (Just kidding there. Trying not get drunk and get into a bar fight with myself.) I need someone to give me some kind of direction.

Any takers?

 

[2B]

yes you can butt up the seams and then lap a strip down as the overlap.

called a "flush cut seam"

http://read.uberflip.com/i/236088
page 113 (118 if using the online page count)

 

[Z SIGNS]

Someday's you eat the bear.
Someday's the bear eats you.

Cheer up if that's the worst thing that happens in your chosen craft consider yourself lucky.

Some days are better than others.

 

[ddubia]

Yeah Z, you shoulda seen how much better it was earlier today when I'd cut the last panel, did a fist pump saying, "Yeah, perfect and with time to spare!" hahaha


2B... I relaxed a bit when I read your suggestion knowing that it's an accepted method.

 

[player]

You only have to print the middle panel over on each side, not all 6 panels.

 

[wildside]

Anything more than a half inch overlap is too much

Make sure you didnt click the dreaded "weld overlap" in the panel setup in onyx, cause that will kill your overlap completely. Had that lesson learned on a 24ft box truck wrap.......

 

[CanuckSigns]

Versaworks gets pretty flakey with paneling prints some times, I make sure I triple check now!

 

[Snydo]

Flexi has a seperate 'Panels' tab in Production Manager, pretty foolproof.

 

[phototec]

Not that it has happened to me, I'm just old school and create my own panels, each as a separate file with bleed (overlap), tic marks color bars and labels printed on the bottom of each panel.

Some of my first wrap jobs were 45' trailers, and that's when I stared creating individual custom panels from the master artwork file. I can make my seams wherever I want them based on the particular design, and NOT have some software making the decision for me.

Anyway, to answer your question on how to fix the mistake (IMO) is to recreate the center panel on each side stretching out only the center area of the panel, leave the edges (about 6") as they are so they will match-up and blend with the existing panels, you will add more image ONLY into the center part of the panel (did I make sense).

A photo of the layout would be helpful?

I would NEVER ever slop-up the job by adding a small strip to cover the seam (what s your customer going to think when he see that), bite the bullet and reprint the two center panels after making them fit.

 

[ddubia]

Maybe I set it up wrong but this is an extended Chevy van and the set up is 5 vertical panels on each side.

My logic in having the software generate the panels was so that I could send and RIP the entire side as one file, thereby ensuring the seams would match color-wise as the whole side would be processed as one. I did this rather than mechanically making my own panels and then RIPing them individually taking the chance that the RIP may interpret the panels slightly differently somewhere along the line causing a color shift that would be visible at the seams. I've seen jobs where the panels didn't match color to color and assumed that RIPing separate panels was the reason. It would only take a 2 or 3 percent difference to be noticeable one panel over another one.

So to avoid using strips as in the "flush cut seam" method I would have to reprint three panels on each side plus the two back panels. At least that would save me 4 of the 10 panels but I was really, really hoping for a better deal than that. Lol.

Funny how the slightest oversight can cause such a massive pain in the arse.

 

[phototec]

Maybe I set it up wrong but this is an extended Chevy van and the set up is 5 vertical panels on each side.

My logic in having the software generate the panels was so that I could send and RIP the entire side as one file, thereby ensuring the seams would match color-wise as the whole side would be processed as one. I did this rather than mechanically making my own panels and then RIPing them individually taking the chance that the RIP may interpret the panels slightly differently somewhere along the line causing a color shift that would be visible at the seams. I've seen jobs where the panels didn't match color to color and assumed that RIPing separate panels was the reason. It would only take a 2 or 3 percent difference to be noticeable one panel over another one.

So to avoid using strips as in the "flush cut seam" method I would have to reprint three panels on each side plus the two back panels. At least that would save me 4 of the 10 panels but I was really, really hoping for a better deal than that. Lol.

Funny how the slightest oversight can cause such a massive pain in the arse.

As you mentioned, sometimes you see a difference between panels (Print Shading), however in my experience it's NOT caused by sending separate panel to the rip, it has more to do about the difference in the printer from one side to the other, heater temperature difference from one side to the other, printing alignment due to wear on one side vs the other, like most small jobs are printed on the print head dock side, so more wear on that side.

When I print very large display graphics, I always rotate every other panel by 180°, so the sides of two panels that but each other and need to match perfectly, are both printed on the same side of the printer (lets say the right side). So half of the panels are printed right side up and the half are printed upside down (every other panel), that way you get the BEST tonal match possible.

Large professional display graphic companies do this all the time, we had a company print a very large display graphic of a Dell computer for a trade show and they taught me this trick, it's the ONLY way to get the Print Shading to match perfect from one panel to the other.

See attached Print Shading Guide (PDF) below, it explains this technique very well.

 

[SightLine]

Eek!! In this case I'd probably print a 1.5" wide strip for each overlap so it provides a 3/4" overlap for the left and right panels. Certainly not the ideal solution but would save a ton of material and to avoid having seams facing forward you would apply the rear panel, then a strip, then the next panel, etc... Although 3 panels for the side of an extended full size van says something is very wrong to begin with - if that's the case then its probably going to be a full on reprint and a nice pile of wasted material and time down the drain.

For what its worth Flexisigns paneling is near foolproof and really makes things simple. We always use a 3/4" overlap and that is what you set it for. In the paneling screen you can drag the panels lines about to put the overlaps where you want them, you can click a box that will just auto-panel the side in all exact same width panels, you can select the panels individually and tell them to print or not print individually, you can drag new panel lines both vertically and horizontally and even a combination of both (for example you can drag a horizontal panel line over what would be above the front fender then select not to print that big section since it is not needed). Also in Flexi - on another screen is a checkbox for automatic tile flip which inverts every other panel when printing. This is what makes sure the overlaps both are printed on the same side of the printer. You can also select to print a small numbered tile map. This shot shows how Flexi does it - an example side wrap for a short NV - notice the far left has 2 sections paneled and crosshatched (the crosshatching means I've deselected those to not print).

I now it's not really helpful for your scenario but it shows at least how Flexi deals with paneling (its very flexible) and tile flipping for printing to avoid color shifting at panel seams.

 

[ddubia]

tec, that is good information and makes a world of sense. In fact, now that you mention it I remember reading about that method back in '08 when we first got the printer. A customer asked for a quote on printing some wallpaper. Knowing that if the customer bought it I'd have to know how to print it. So I studied on it and ran into that method. But he didn't buy and I haven't had to print an overlap until now. It never occurred to me preparing for this job.

Having slept on it I find I don't feel any better about it than I did last night. Maybe worse. Last night my approach was to make light of my mistake rather than sink into despair. I guess it's my way. Besides, it allowed me to sleep. This morning is the reality show as I'm faced with missing a deadline, which I hate, and losing a lot of money in wasted materials which I hate equally.

 

[player]

It happens, get over it.

Start printing and finish up.

 

[Kentucky Wraps]

I've never had that problem because the panels I send to the rip (versaworks) already has the overlap in them.
BUT I like the solution of just reprinting the middle panels on each side...rather than a think strip between each panel.

 

[crystalcoastgraphics]

If it's just the three panels, just reprint the middle as player said. And also as others have said, 1.5" overlap is way to big, cut it back to no more than 3/4" and roll with it. Don't worry about the front facing seam, only way you could even possibly have an issue is if they use those car washes with the brushes often. But most people tell customers to hand wash only anyway

 

[ddubia]

I'm having a bit of a lack of understanding when some of you guys mention 3 panels per side. The side of this van is over 220" long. Just can't do that in 3 panels. As SightLine says, "Although 3 panels for the side of an extended full size van says something is very wrong to begin with - ", I have to mention that I never said 3 panels. There is 5 panels along the side. I did say that if I were to reprint the entire job I'd have to reprint 3 panels for each side. (wouldn't have to print the first or last panel of each side). I feel something got lost in the interpretation. I am likely responsible for that.

 

[Hicalibersigns]

Having slept on it I find I don't feel any better about it than I did last night. Maybe worse. Last night my approach was to make light of my mistake rather than sink into despair. I guess it's my way. Besides, it allowed me to sleep. This morning is the reality show as I'm faced with missing a deadline, which I hate, and losing a lot of money in wasted materials which I hate equally.

Get over it. Chalk it up to a learning experience and move on. Chances are pretty darned good that you will not make that mistake again. It's how we learn.

 

[ddubia]

Hicaliber, I'be been over it since last night when I discovered the problem. Lol

And you're right... I'll NOT make this mistake again! hahaha

I'm old enough to know that now that it has happened and I have no way to go back and make not to have happened. So what you are hearing from me is not despair, "woe is me" nor dwelling on the mistake. What you are hearing from me is my thinking and questions as I work toward the best solution. The fix, whichever way I chose to go as I work through my own thoughts alonog with the advice of you good people, will all be printed by the end of the day.

When it's all over the customer will be happy. He's not concerned that I missed the deadline.

To quote the great Mike Jackson, "Better right than Thursday". That was something his customer said to him when Mike had to tell him he was going to miss the Thursday due date to correct some issues he was having.

 

[synergy_jim]

welcome to wraps….. I did the same thing back in the day. I think my first roll of 180c was a complete learning experience.