I think I will be a vegetarian...

[WildWestDesigns]

WHERE DO YOU PEOPLE GET THIS INFORMATION???? under your aluminum hats???
you have no idea of homo sapian ANATOMY!!!
1.CECUM: Most mammalian herbivores have a relatively large cecum, hosting a large number of bacteria, which aid in the enzymatic breakdown of plant materials such as cellulose; in many species, it is considerably wider than the colon. In contrast, obligatory carnivores, whose diets contain little or no plant material, have a reduced cecum, which is often partially or wholly replaced by the vermiform appendix.
2.APPENDIX: I STILL HAVE MINE!!!! its purpose was to digest hard seeds or other material like small BONES, that could not be digested by the stomach acids or small intestine. Attached to the first portion of the large intestine is a troublesome pouch called the (veriform) appendix. The appendix has no function in modern humans, however it is believed to have been part of the digestive system in our primitive ancestors.
3. where in the hell did you come up with this: "We derive the nutrients from roughage mainly by consuming animals that are able to consume roughage efficiently." that is so WRONG.......you cant get complex carbs that where in plants, by eating the meat of the animal that ate the plant!!!!!!!!!SCHEEEEZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!!
4.this is one thing you have right!!!! "roughage is intestinal cleaner." without that, you increase the chances of COLON CANCER!!!! again we go back to human anatomy! the intestinal tract of a human is primarily OMNIVORE/HERBIVORE!!!!
Carnivorous animals have intestinal tracts that are 3-6x their body length, while herbivores have intestinal tracts 10-12x their body length. Human beings have the same intestinal tract ratio as herbivores.
5. as to your sister & niece, i think they would have been trying to be VEGAN. this is a level of VEGETARIANISM, that is the hardest to sustain. due to the fact: ALL VEGANS DO NOT INGEST ANY ANIMAL PRODUCT!!!! now to futher explain, i was a vegetarian for 19 years. BUT......i was a LACTO-OVO VEGETARIAN. we did ingest EGGS & DAIRY PRODUCTS. in doing so we kept up the AMINO ACID levels that i belive your sister/niece did not. now for 19 years, i did not eat meat and i survived very well. when i went back to eating meat(2 years ago)as prescribed by a CARDIOLOGIST, who informed me of some thing i did not know. 85% of the cholesterol created in the body..........comes from CARBOHYDRATES!!!!! i was told this by 3-4 other doctors. NOW........this goes to a whol other subject of CARBS, GOOD & BAD...which is which.
GOOD................COMPLEX CARBS. are high-fiber foods, which improve your digestion. They help stabilize the blood sugar, keep your energy at an even level, and help you feel satisfied longer after your meal. CRUCIFEROUS VEGETABLES are the best: Arugula,Bok choy,Broccoli,Brussels sprouts,Cabbage,Cauliflower,Chinese cabbage,Collard greens,Kale,Kohlrabi,Mustard greens,Radishes,Rutabaga,Turnips,Watercress. other COMPLEX CARBS, such as Whole grain bread, bagels, buns and rolls are examples of these. Also pasta, macaroni and breakfast cereals that are made from whole grains.
SIMPLE CARBS.............BAD!!!!! Table sugar, Corn syrup, Fruit juice, Candy, Cake, Bread made with white flour, Pasta made with white flour, Soda pop, such as Coke®, Pepsi®, Mountain Dew®, etc. All baked goods made with white flour, Most packaged cereals.
so there you have it.......................learn to eat the right foods, and PLEASE LEARN ANATOMY )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

You do realize that animal nutrition(equine mainly) is what I have been trained in for higher education and that I had involved in that field for over a decade?

I have had human A&P as well, as most professors recommend that you have that even if your specialty is animal science due to be able to explain commonalities and differences.

You do derive a portion of what they eat. You just do not get the full benefit of it. It's the difference of taking a pill or getting a shot directly where it needs to go. The pill gets diluted as it works it's way through the system and only a portion of it actually makes it to it's goal, however, if you have a shot right where it needs to be, more often then not you get the whole she-bang. The difference between going a head and eating roughage and bypassing the "middle man" is that we are hugely in efficient with that consumption.

I didn't say appendix was missing from everyone, I still have mine as well. I'm merely stating that it is disappearing or evolving out of our system.

 

[OldPaint]

You do realize that animal nutrition(equine mainly) is what I have been trained in for higher education and that I had involved in that field for over a decade?

I have had human A&P as well, as most professors recommend that you have that even if your specialty is animal science due to be able to explain commonalities and differences.

You do derive a portion of what they eat. You just do not get the full benefit of it. It's the difference of taking a pill or getting a shot directly where it needs to go. The pill gets diluted as it works it's way through the system and only a portion of it actually makes it to it's goal, however, if you have a shot right where it needs to be, more often then not you get the whole she-bang. The difference between going a head and eating roughage and bypassing the "middle man" is that we are hugely in efficient with that consumption.

I didn't say appendix was missing from everyone, I still have mine as well. I'm merely stating that it is disappearing or evolving out of our system.

XCUZZZE ME............from what you posted, and what your sayin in this post, WHY DID YOU EVEN POST THE 1ST?????
deriving a PORTION OF what THEY EAT.........????? well no poopoo!!!! they eat plant matter, which turns into MUSCLE, and that is now mostly PROTEIN.being a LACTO OVO VEGETARIAN...does the SAME THING IN THE HUMAN BODY))))))) so by being a vegetarian, you dont need all the FLESH, to do the same thing)))))) as for getting any COMPLEX CARBS from eating flesh.....it aint gona happen
i always tell people this , who give me this crap about how the human body cant survive without all that meat protein. "you know that old saying: YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT?" it aint so. truth is more like this: "you are what you dont EXCRETE!"!!!!!!!! the minimum daily reguirement for protein are 56 grams a day. the body does not store protein, unless your into bodybuilding, which most of you couch potatoes/ desk jockeys AINT!!! The rest of the protein in that BIG MAC, STEAK........gets flushed down the toilet.
in the jungles of africa, there are carnivorous and vegetarians. right? most of the strong animals are carnivorous huh? wellllllllllllllllllllllllll. let take a look at one of the STRONGEST, AND MOST LIKE US............THE SILVERBACK GORILLA!!!!! he is a VEGETARIAN!!!!! so now their goes your whole meat eating theory. got bananas????????hahahahahahahahahaha

 

[WildWestDesigns]

the minimum daily reguirement for protein are 56 grams a day. the body does not store protein, unless your into bodybuilding, which most of you couch potatoes/ desk jockeys AINT!!!

Exactly right. Starches and the like, if not used after so long are later converted into fat. Protein is excreted if your body doesn't need it based on your level of activity. The more smell that your urine has, typically means your getting too much protein. All my horses get 14%, if one isn't getting enough of a workout, I can tell by smell, because they aren't using it all.

Minimum daily requirement is going to change though due to your level of activity, age, sex etc. Based on my lifestyle, I'm at a 3000 calorie diet and I'm no spring chick and if you look at most nutrition labels they are based off a 2000 diet.

This will really blow your mind, I used to balance feed rations using Pearson's Square(not to be confused with Pearson's chi-square test). A person that y'all think is nuts in the head when it comes to this stuff balanced feed rations, have to deal with C ratios. Boy was my educational dollar wasted.

 

[OldPaint]

my sister in law lives up in mcdonald/oltawa tenn. she has horses. i got ruined on horses as a kid. the horse farm near me, was for TROTTERS/PACERS. not fun horses. most of em crazy. breeding lines so intermingled to get the best speed out these, dont make for fun horses. if you ever heard of ADIOS, HANOVER horses? big dollar$$$$$$$$

 

[WildWestDesigns]

my sister in law lives up in mcdonald/oltawa tenn. she has horses. i got ruined on horses as a kid. the horse farm near me, was for TROTTERS/PACERS. not fun horses. most of em crazy. breeding lines so intermingled to get the best speed out these, dont make for fun horses. if you ever heard of ADIOS, HANOVER horses? big dollar$$$$$$$$

Oh yea, when the inbreeding factor is high, you won't have dull horses that's for sure. The walking horses round here are horrible about that, mainly due to how the association is setup.

The horse farm that was near you did they use roman candles in their training program? That has lead to a lot of "interesting" results let's just say.

Heard of Adios.

 

[Gino]

All this talk about horses.... I'm ready for a neighburger ))))))))))))

 

[WildWestDesigns]

All this talk about horses.... I'm ready for a neighburger ))))))))))))

I had a professor that said that the weren't as bad as you would think. That's one thing that I couldn't handle. Pig, cows, chickens, not much of a problem at any step of the way that you want to talk about.

 

[anotherdog]

Wow what a lot of exclamation points in this thread!!!

It's quite simple; With just about every square mile of viable land either in use or built on and with most of the worlds population teetering on the edge of starvation, we must have more efficient ways to feed people (or stop them breeding). Tank grown meat is just more efficient (cheaper) and you simply won't be able to tell the difference in your hamburger.

A side effect is that they can grow it without the cholesterol and the intestinal bugs associated with real meat.

Lastly no guilt. Did anyone watch Food Inc.? I'll give it a try, has to be better than vegetarian carpet burgers.

 

[FrankenSigns.biz]

If "they" decide that this is what we are to be fed, it is what we will eat. The following generation will be grossed-out that we once ate animals...

 

[Kwiksigns]

Put hot sauce on anything and it taste good!

 

[OldPaint]

i dont think they used that unless its what they called a "twitch." now that is some kinda cruel tool.
anotherdog, you ever been to a VEAL FARM? after seeing this i dont think you would be so inclined to mass produce meat.
also all you meat eaters need to watch SUPERSIZE ME!!!!!!!!

 

[WildWestDesigns]

i dont think they used that unless its what they called a "twitch." now that is some kinda cruel tool.

No, it's not a "twitch". A twitch, depending on how it's used is much milder then a lot of things out there. Same thing with spurs. Less is more with those tools, but unfortunately, it's easy to abuse the horses with those. I've seen horses that were ridden with a hackamore(for those that don't know that's a bridle without a bit, it applies pressure across the bridge of the horse nose) that have nerve damage, because people just yanked backwards with the hackamore and those are perhaps the least "powerful" means of control that we can have with a bridle.

anotherdog, you ever been to a VEAL FARM? after seeing this i dont think you would be so inclined to mass produce meat.

Those that run a cow/calf operation have dealt with this to some extent.

also all you meat eaters need to watch SUPERSIZE ME!!!!!!!!

If you are eating a diet solely of fast food, I'm sorry, but you get little sympathy from me and I used to like mcD's growing up when they still had the dark mystery meat in the mcnuggets.

Everything in moderation (with the obvious exceptions of course).

 

[OldPaint]

i had my 1st heart attack when i was 42(1986). smoking 3 packs marlboro a day, 12 pack diet coke bout every other day. when the wife would cook chicken, she had to do 2!! one for me and she would have some of #2. 1 pound of pasta, wife had a small normal dish, I ATE THE REST!!!! was a WENDY'S right near the house, right next to it was a DUNKIN DONUTS!!!! i ate so goood)))))) i knew what happened when i had all that pain. never knew the extent of the damage i had till jun 2009, when i had a heart cath done. they saw the right artery was blocked, but since i didnt go to any hospital or doctor when it happened, over the next year or so my heart grew what the doctors called COLLATERAL VEINS. now these are smaller veins, but more then one so the blood flow is much as the vein that was blocked had. when i had the open heart surgery dec 28th, 2010, the doc told me they looked at replacing the blocked right artery, but the collateral veins were doing as good a job any bypass they could do.
now back to 1986. after the heart attack, i couldnt do much physical work. i quit smoking, and about 2 years later we started doing TAI CHI, and went to vegetarian lacto ovo eating. long story short, i lost 25-30 pounds, increased my lung capacity, got my body strength back , andnever felt better all the while my body was repairing the blocked artery. got 21 years without any medical intervention. i atribute this to the vegetarian diet and the TAI CHI. so now i eat meat, but still dont a lot of beef or pork. rotisery chicken is great.

 

[bob]

No, it's not a "twitch". A twitch, depending on how it's used is much milder then a lot of things out there. Same thing with spurs. Less is more with those tools, but unfortunately, it's easy to abuse the horses with those. I've seen horses that were ridden with a hackamore(for those that don't know that's a bridle without a bit, it applies pressure across the bridge of the horse nose) that have nerve damage, because people just yanked backwards with the hackamore and those are perhaps the least "powerful" means of control that we can have with a bridle...

A twitch is far from cruel. Any one who thinks so is operating on how it looks and not any understanding of horses or twitches.

Au contraire about the spurs. The spurs with he biggest rowels are, all things being equal, the kindest spurs. It has to do with surface area and ability to roll, not appearances.

A mechanical hackamore is beyond argument the nastiest piece of gear in it's category extant. Moreover if you have it operating the what passes for the bridge of Old Dobbin's nose, you have it way too low. Not to be confused with a traditional hackamore fashioned from a bosal and a length of rope. In the words of a friend and perhaps one the best spade bit hands around, a bosal is the biggest con job ever played on a horse.

One does not control horses with tack, one merely influences them. With the exception of the mechanical hackamore, which leaves the beast nowhere to go and is an abomination. As well as piano wire twists that were in vogue with cutters a while back.

 

[Custom_Grafx]

Still looks healthier than artificial sweetener. At least it originates from an animal... look at the bright side

 

[WildWestDesigns]

A twitch is far from cruel. Any one who thinks so is operating on how it looks and not any understanding of horses or twitches.

Read my post again. I didn't say a twitch in of itself was a cruel tool. But trust me, I can make it cruel.

Au contraire about the spurs. The spurs with he biggest rowels are, all things being equal, the kindest spurs. It has to do with surface area and ability to roll, not appearances.

You are right, the bigger rowels are the milder, while bronc spurs with the pinpoint rowels are one of the more severe ones(I've used them all at one time or another), however, I can make even bumper spurs cruel.

I know better then to go by looks alone in this game.

A mechanical hackamore is beyond argument the nastiest piece of gear in it's category extant. Moreover if you have it operating the what passes for the bridge of Old Dobbin's nose, you have it way too low. Not to be confused with a traditional hackamore fashioned from a bosal and a length of rope. In the words of a friend and perhaps one the best spade bit hands around, a bosal is the biggest con job ever played on a horse.

If you think the mechanical hackamore is bad, you must have missed the "brain chain" that went through pleasure horse trainers.

One does not control horses with tack, one merely influences them. With the exception of the mechanical hackamore, which leaves the beast nowhere to go and is an abomination. As well as piano wire twists that were in vogue with cutters a while back.

You're getting more philosophical about that. "Influence" will very from tack to tack, some very mild or none at all to too much force can cause very nasty damage depending on how much force was used.

Now, they can find ways to get around them, some are really good about getting that bit in a certain position and just running and you have little to no control depending on the situation.

The sphere of influence changes between a regular o-ring snaffle to a jr. cow horse snaffle to a correction bit (long or short shank) to rutledge roper to a chain bit. That is not a list of mild to severe by the way. Each bit with a different (or no mouthpiece) puts pressure on different areas of the mouth, so influences of the bit change depending on where you want that pressure to be and how much. Same thing if the bit has a shank on it or not. Then depending on where you put the reins on the bit might change it's influence as well. For instance, a jr. cow horse bit has a small shank on it. You get more pressure and leverage if the reins are attached to the shank, however, if you attach it to the "o-ring" portion of the bit, it's more like a regular snaffle with a twisted wire mouthpiece. This isn't getting into copper mouthpieces and non-copper mouthpieces (copper causes the horses to salivate).

Getting back remotely to this thread, I can use nutrition(that's remote connection to the thread, nutrition) to help "influence" how the horse behaves at a show. Not in a cruel way, although you can do that to.

If one's influence is high enough, I would argue that's control.

 

[signswi]

It's quite simple; With just about every square mile of viable land either in use or built on and with most of the worlds population teetering on the edge of starvation, we must have more efficient ways to feed people (or stop them breeding). Tank grown meat is just more efficient (cheaper) and you simply won't be able to tell the difference in your hamburger.

Or we could just eat less meat. The big issue is that China's middle class is starting to eat like America does, massive consumption of animals that require huge amounts of resources to produce. If everyone just ate what our bodies needed instead of two cheeseburgers a day there wouldn't be much of a problem.



Of course we're also genetically predisposed to eat as much meat as we can get our hands on so it's a rough battle (our chemical triggers and psychological triggers haven't realized we're no longer in a scarcity environment) and I'm as much of a hypocrit as anyone on that front, I eat way too much meat.

 

[bob]

...however, I can make even bumper spurs cruel...

We are in agreement as to most things horse but...

What you call 'bumper' spurs I assume to be spurs called 'knobby' or 'Prince of Wales'. These are the most innocent looking spurs extant and, at the same time, the cruelest. They don't roll over the animal, instead they push a bow-wave of flesh leaving a wake of bruised meat in their path.

Back in the day when I was involved in both playing and umpiring polocrosse the only time I ever made a player remove his spurs was a pair of knobby abominations. He was riding a grey horse and the animal's sides were purple with bruising from these things.

Now back to vegetarians versus reality...

 

[Gino]

I like meat, so I eat meat. I like fish, so I eat fish. I like vegetables, so I eat vegetables. I like pizza, but I go without for the most part. I like a lot of things that aren't good for me and just about any other person on the planet, but I choose not to eat those things that are bad for me.

For some people it takes a lot of self control, for others, it comes easy. We have a guy working for us as 'Casual Labor' and he's only 26 and has all kinds of health problems from gall bladder attacks to back spasms and has horrible teeth and sort of smells sometimes. He probably weighs in around 320lbs and is about 5'6" or 7". He's grossly out of shape, but does do fine work for us.
However, I don't think he's gonna be around long. He pants and is out of breath after a few minutes of activity.

His diet is horrendous and he doesn't seem to care and blames all of his ailments on something else than his diet.... or lack of.

Anything in moderation, our bodies can tolerate. I'm diabetic and I can still have anything I want, as long as I don't overdo it. I enjoy most things, but have learned to eat differently. In the last 6 months, I've lost 16lbs. I feel better, my numbers have dropped considerably, but I know my limits.


Whether you poke a horse in the side, a camel or a rhinoceros..... the fact remains we'll get food from whatever source we need. We need very little as is, but between the television commercials and all the big companies keeping us plumped up with fake foods, chemicals and taste buds.... we're doomed in the animal kingdom and are very rapidly going towards being droids.

Oh.... and I'm still allowed this, so it's my only vice.......... . ​