Ink Carts 50% full but need to be replaced. HELP!

[rcook99]

Ok here is my problem. I bought my Mutoh 1204 uesd from a dealer. It was stripped down the the rails and comletely gone through including a new print head. I noticed in December that when it called for replacement of one of the ink carts and I went to change it there seemed to be ink still in the cart. I proceeded to open the cart and noticed the bag still had plenty of ink. I weighed the cart and it weighed out at 9.3oz and a full cart weighs 13.3oz. This is a difference of 4oz which means there is still about 3.5oz of ink left in the cart. Can anyone tell me what might be causing this problem and how to fix it?

Keep in mind when I bought the machine I did not notice it as a newbie I just went by what the machine read for ink and when it was needed I changed them. So this might have been going on from day one but not a 100% sure.

 

[FatCat]

The quick answer is to always have a few spare cards (CMYK) laying around for situations like this. If your carts read zero and you know there is ink still in them you can swap cards and go back to printing. The downside of course, is that doing this you never know exactly how much ink is left and risk sucking air into the lines if you're not paying attention.

 

[tsgstl]

Are they 220ml or 440ml?

 

[rcook99]

FatCat, I thought about that but as you stated you may run into more problems doing so.

tsgstl,

They are 220ml

 

[FatCat]

FatCat, I thought about that but as you stated you may run into more problems doing so.

tsgstl,

They are 220ml

It won't be a problem as long as you pay close attention to it. If your cart is still approx 1/4 full there is quite a bit of printing you can do with that ink. Unless your printing most of the day, or have a huge job to run, I would think you could just keep weighing the cart(s) every night or morning to keep tabs on it. When you get close, throw it away.

As for what is causing your problem, I can't say. You said you just bought this, were these your first ink carts? Might be due to the initial ink fill (if it was empty when you got it) or just a mis-calibration in the printer. Perhaps you were doing a lot of cleanings or little charges? These types of things tend to throw the cards out of whack slightly. Usually I always had a little ink leftover in my carts for one reason or the other. Wasn't as much as you, but still not a big deal.

However, I've long since converted both my 1204 and 1604 to bulk so I never run out of ink.

 

[rcook99]

It won't be a problem as long as you pay close attention to it. If your cart is still approx 1/4 full there is quite a bit of printing you can do with that ink. Unless your printing most of the day, or have a huge job to run, I would think you could just keep weighing the cart(s) every night or morning to keep tabs on it. When you get close, throw it away.

As for what is causing your problem, I can't say. You said you just bought this, were these your first ink carts? Might be due to the initial ink fill (if it was empty when you got it) or just a mis-calibration in the printer. Perhaps you were doing a lot of cleanings or little charges? These types of things tend to throw the cards out of whack slightly. Usually I always had a little ink leftover in my carts for one reason or the other. Wasn't as much as you, but still not a big deal.

However, I've long since converted both my 1204 and 1604 to bulk so I never run out of ink.

Inks were full when I had the printer delivered and set up. I also have spoken with the dealer and they have signed in to my computer to check and see what kind of shape my Maint. station and other parts are in and they are all above 90% except for one which was still around 78%. Waiting to hear back from them as well. It is set up to clean itself every 12 hours. This was set by the tech at setup.

 

[FatCat]

Inks were full when I had the printer delivered and set up. I also have spoken with the dealer and they have signed in to my computer to check and see what kind of shape my Maint. station and other parts are in and they are all above 90% except for one which was still around 78%. Waiting to hear back from them as well. It is set up to clean itself every 12 hours. This was set by the tech at setup.

OK, so have you run more than 1 ink cart through the printer and this is ALWAYS happening? Or, is this the first set of carts in the printer and you haven't replaced any yet?

 

[rcook99]

No this is not the first set of inks by any means in fact this is probably the 5th or 6th but keep in mind I didn't pay attention to the other inks as I went by what the printer said and just assumed (I know never assume lol) they were empty until for some reason it seemed like it was still full so I proceeded to weigh an empty and full cart and of course noticed there was 3.5 - 4.0 oz left in the bag. This could have been happening from the day I changed the first set of inks as I did not pay attention to the weight as I was relying on the printers information center. (Chalk that up to being a newbie)

 

[signage]

What actually tells the printer it is low on ink? a sensor on the cartridge, or the printer, or is it the chip attached to the cartridge. If the chip does the printer calculate the amount used when a file is printed?

 

[Gino]

Don't know what the problem could be, but that's got to be a bummer.... throwing all that ink away all this time.

I'm not acquainted with the Mutoh's , but how does the machine alert you to the fact, your ink is low.... or out ??

In the Roland's there is a tab that shoots out and it sets off a beeper. Can you by-pass the tab, it you have something similar and just keep a close eye on it ?? That might be what Fat was saying, but it is how we monitor ours much of the time. Never run dry, yet..... in almost 6 years.

 

[FrankW]

The 1204 do not support 440ml-Ink-Cartridges. This could be the problem. Dot count shows the ink should be empty.

A little bit of ink will remain in the ink cartridges anyway.

 

[rcook99]

but that's got to be a bummer.... throwing all that ink away all this time.

Yes it does but I will say Fellers is standing behind the issue and I should be receiving a set of inks any day. So that helps but I still need to find the cause of the problem.

The pictures show what tells how much ink is in the carts.

 

[rcook99]

The 1204 do not support 440ml-Ink-Cartridges. This could be the problem. Dot count shows the ink should be empty.

A little bit of ink will remain in the ink cartridges anyway.

Frank, I am not using 440ml I am using 220ml. Yes some ink i understand but 3-4oz left in the cart when it holds only 7.5oz is not right at all.

 

[Gino]

Yes it does but I will say Fellers is standing behind the issue and I should be receiving a set of inks any day. So that helps but I still need to find the cause of the problem.

The pictures show what tells how much ink is in the carts.

Did Fellers sell you the 'used' equipment ??

 

[rcook99]

Did Fellers sell you the 'used' equipment ??

No Gino! I bought it from a mutual friend of ours that I met when I was at your shop and they are working very well with me in trying to find the problem. They have had there tech. guy log in to my computer to check the printer and its parts. They all seem to show no problems as far as they can see from the Mutoh software. I buy my inks from Fellers as I usually have other items to buy and they ship for free.

 

[FrankW]

Frank, I am not using 440ml I am using 220ml. Yes some ink i understand but 3-4oz left in the cart when it holds only 7.5oz is not right at all.

OK, 220ml. Even if the ink cartridges are empty they to not seem empty. The ink is not in the plastic cartridge but in a plastic bag inside the cartridge, so perhaps when shaking the cartridge you feel the plastig bag flattering?

But: even if the "ink empty" indicator wasn't activated the ink will be reported as "empty" as soon as the estimated amount of ink is used the printer electronic calculated. Perhaps its something wrong with the chips.

 

[Gino]

No Gino! I bought it from a mutual friend of ours that I met when I was at your shop and they are working very well with me in trying to find the problem. They have had there tech. guy log in to my computer to check the printer and its parts. They all seem to show no problems as far as they can see from the Mutoh software. I buy my inks from Fellers as I usually have other items to buy and they ship for free.

That's what I originally thought...... and I'm sure I know who the friend is. He is probably about 'the man' with the most integrity in this business, I know.

So, why is Fellers sending you some free ink, if it's not their fault ?? That doesn't sound fair, unless the inks are at fault, but then wouldn't there be more of a widespread problem going on ??

 

[signage]

OK, 220ml. Even if the ink cartridges are empty they to not seem empty. The ink is not in the plastic cartridge but in a plastic bag inside the cartridge, so perhaps when shaking the cartridge you feel the plastig bag flattering?

But: even if the "ink empty" indicator wasn't activated the ink will be reported as "empty" as soon as the estimated amount of ink is used the printer electronic calculated. Perhaps its something wrong with the chips.

Can this program be out of calibration?

How would one adjust this program?

Also what is the weight of 220ml of your ink less the cartridge?

 

[rcook99]

[QUOTESo, why is Fellers sending you some free ink, if it's not their fault ?? That doesn't sound fair, unless the inks are at fault, but then wouldn't there be more of a widespread problem going on ?? ][/QUOTE]

Because I had already had our friends tech. guy sign in and check the printer and they said it was probably the ink carts which were bought from Fellers. Once I called them and explained the problem they stood behind the product and sent me the paperwork to ship the old ink back to Mutoh.

Free shipping is nice but I think I will be buying my inks from the company I bought the printer from. The free shipping is not worth the possiblity of he said she said if you know what I mean. Not saying that this has happened but trying to minimize the chance. (Lesson learned)

 

[rcook99]

Also what is the weight of 220ml of your ink less the cartridge?

Brian, 220ml is 7.5oz obviously understanding that different types of fluid can vary but. If you look at my earlier post I posted the weight of a full cart and the ones I am sending back. Mine were also compared to a friends carts who uses the same printer and his are empty when compared to mine. I did not weigh his empty though. It was easy to see his were empty as they were flat.

Not sure of the calibration side of things.