Is my pricing too high for printed vinyl?

[bluehammer]

After reading this whole thread I'm realizing people are either running work out of their basements and garages with no employees, insurance etc, or they don't know what their actual costs of running a business long-term are. Add up all your monthly costs...ALL OF THEM...don't forget stuff like electricity, gas, oil, software subscriptions, phones, etc. Then figure out how much you need to earn (after cogs) per Month/Week/Hour plus a profit. Don't forget to factor in machine depreciation and unexpected repairs. Then ask yourself what my pay should be. Do I want to just give myself a 60-hour-a-week job for peanuts while holding all the liability, or do I want to run a sound business with employees? The actual costs of running a business are more than most think. In short..$8.00 (the lowest) - $16.00 sq ft laminated on premium vinyl. If they want contour cutting and taping add $2-$3 sq ft. Install is additional and depends on your shop rate.

 

[bluehammer]

Also, Ill put this in a seperate post. Have seperate bank and credit card accounts just for your business and use software like quickbooks to import all the costs. You will quickliy see how much you really need to charge to stay in business. Asking what other people charge doesn’t help. Everyone has different costs.

 

[Action Mary]

Thanks for the replies. I do have enough work right now. Since I just bought my printer I have not had a request like this yet so that’s why I’m asking. I also need to be careful that these race types are not above lying to get a deal. I guess he wasn’t lol


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My hubby races cars and I wrap his. I make it look GREAT. We also do other cars, for friends of his. I give them a bit of a break, but still make money. They are unbelievably cheap when it comes to wrapping their cars. Like the other poster said, they spend big money on their engines and parts and cheap out on the wrap and/or decals because they know it will be wrecked by the end of the year. If they got someone else to design it, and it is print ready, then that guy is charging too much and they are looking around for someone cheaper to print it. Plus they will call you in 3 months and say they wrecked the front quarter, or door panel and can you just print that, and give them a break because they have to spend a lot to fix their car now. I am in Canada and our materials are more expensive here. I actually have guys here that will buy their prints in the states, because it is cheaper, and have me install it. Those guys pay through the nose, and they know it. Also if they say they will bring you in business from their sponsors - it will not happen. Their sponsors already have someone.

 

[Dan Berg]

this one is not laminated and the material is 40 cents/sq ft without any special pricing

Totally different league than some of you guys. First off we triple all material costs. First third pays for the materials. Second third pays for overhead. (cost $2000 to heat the shop, $2,000 for insurance and $5000 a year for electric.) Final third is profit on materials. Shop rate is $100 an hour for every second we spend on the job from start to finish. Our retail price for vinyl is .06 a square inch or $8.64 a sq. ft. Resellers get 25% off that amount.

 

[netsol]

Totally different league than some of you guys

with pricing like that, one would think you would have bigger concerns than whether the fans spin on your epson...

 

[Modern Ink Signs]

I've had a request to print a prepared race car wrap file of 164 square feet. No laminate, just IJ35 on my latex. It was professionally designed so probably 30 minutes of set-up. I didn't get the job the second year in a row (which is fine) because I would not match or get within a little bit of $2.72 square foot. I told the customer that if I sent it to my lowest wholesaler (Signs365) I would paying more than per square foot.

Am I crazy expensive or is she crazy cheap? I would think pricing for this should be a minimum or $4 a square foot - of which I was higher than that.

Race car = cheap (at least that has been my experience over the past 30+ years)

Realtors too!

 

[Notarealsignguy]

Why would you give anyone a discounted rate for someones hobby?

 

[Stacey K]

Since this post keeps coming back up...

I did not print it or match the price...as I stated in the original question. At the time I had my printer only 3 months and had not gotten any requests to print pre-designed work with no laminate so yes, I wanted to know about the pricing. Some people did give good answers which did help me in calculating my pricing. My ex raced and that's how I got into doing vinyl in the first place so I do understand how cheap they are...trust me.

Anyway, have not heard from him this year about printing his stuff for 2023 but in 2022 I did just shy of $1,000 in apparel and embroidery jobs for him and some small decals for hand outs. We will likely never get to the same price point with the vinyl but the other stuff he is willing to pay for so I'm glad I handled to vinyl situation professionally.

He's not the only race car guy that ordered apparel in 2022 but not vinyl...and that's OK!

I have some customers that go other places for apparel but get all their vehicles lettered by me...thatls OK too!

 

[Geneva Olson]

Since this post keeps coming back up...

I did not print it or match the price...as I stated in the original question. At the time I had my printer only 3 months and had not gotten any requests to print pre-designed work with no laminate so yes, I wanted to know about the pricing. Some people did give good answers which did help me in calculating my pricing. My ex raced and that's how I got into doing vinyl in the first place so I do understand how cheap they are...trust me.

Anyway, have not heard from him this year about printing his stuff for 2023 but in 2022 I did just shy of $1,000 in apparel and embroidery jobs for him and some small decals for hand outs. We will likely never get to the same price point with the vinyl but the other stuff he is willing to pay for so I'm glad I handled to vinyl situation professionally.

He's not the only race car guy that ordered apparel in 2022 but not vinyl...and that's OK!

I have some customers that go other places for apparel but get all their vehicles lettered by me...thatls OK too!

Sometimes it's ok to not get the whole job. A similar thing just happened to me. I didn't get shirts, but I got all the signs, wall murals and dimensional letters.

 

[Notarealsignguy]

I had a customer a few years ago that was burying us in work but we were still staying ahead of their final assembly. His solution was to send the easy parts of these jobs out to his secondary vendor and keep the hard stuff with us since we did better at it. I told him that if he was just going to take away the gravy work that our prices would still remain the same as if we were doing the entire job. He really didn't know what to say but he never asked again.

 

[bluehammer]

Since this post keeps coming back up...

I did not print it or match the price...as I stated in the original question. At the time I had my printer only 3 months and had not gotten any requests to print pre-designed work with no laminate so yes, I wanted to know about the pricing. Some people did give good answers which did help me in calculating my pricing. My ex raced and that's how I got into doing vinyl in the first place so I do understand how cheap they are...trust me.

Anyway, have not heard from him this year about printing his stuff for 2023 but in 2022 I did just shy of $1,000 in apparel and embroidery jobs for him and some small decals for hand outs. We will likely never get to the same price point with the vinyl but the other stuff he is willing to pay for so I'm glad I handled to vinyl situation professionally.

He's not the only race car guy that ordered apparel in 2022 but not vinyl...and that's OK!

I have some customers that go other places for apparel but get all their vehicles lettered by me...thatls OK too!

Stacey, May I ask if you do this as a side job or full-time? Do you have/pay for a shop, insurance, electric, vehicle, etc?

 

[bluehammer]

Totally different league than some of you guys. First off we triple all material costs. First third pays for the materials. Second third pays for overhead. (cost $2000 to heat the shop, $2,000 for insurance and $5000 a year for electric.) Final third is profit on materials. Shop rate is $100 an hour for every second we spend on the job from start to finish. Our retail price for vinyl is .06 a square inch or $8.64 a sq. ft. Resellers get 25% off that amount.

I'm on the same page as you.

 

[bluehammer]

My hubby races cars and I wrap his. I make it look GREAT. We also do other cars, for friends of his. I give them a bit of a break, but still make money. They are unbelievably cheap when it comes to wrapping their cars. Like the other poster said, they spend big money on their engines and parts and cheap out on the wrap and/or decals because they know it will be wrecked by the end of the year. If they got someone else to design it, and it is print ready, then that guy is charging too much and they are looking around for someone cheaper to print it. Plus they will call you in 3 months and say they wrecked the front quarter, or door panel and can you just print that, and give them a break because they have to spend a lot to fix their car now. I am in Canada and our materials are more expensive here. I actually have guys here that will buy their prints in the states, because it is cheaper, and have me install it. Those guys pay through the nose, and they know it. Also if they say they will bring you in business from their sponsors - it will not happen. Their sponsors already have someone.

I make it a point to never install anything someone suplies if we can produce it as well. Anyone can hit the print button. Instillation is the skill they pay for. You are cheapening yourself.

 

[Geneva Olson]

I make it a point to never install anything someone suplies if we can produce it as well. Anyone can hit the print button. Instillation is the skill they pay for. You are cheapening yourself.

why wouldn't you install graphics that someone else printed?
People purchase online kits for their cars all the time and we install them. we have a skill that most people don't have. you aren't cheapening anything if you are installing graphics.
we've gotten some long term customers that way.

 

[Stacey K]

Stacey, May I ask if you do this as a side job or full-time? Do you have/pay for a shop, insurance, electric, vehicle, etc?

Full time for 4 years in a shop - yes fully insured, electric, heat, water, health insurance. I own the building and the 3 rental units attached. I'm not a fly by night and pricing is on the higher end for signs/vehicles. Mid-range for apparel. Rural area, town of around 6k so most of my customers are small businesses and "people". Part-time help in summer when it's the busy season.

 

[Geneva Olson]

Cause they come back at you when the printed sticker starts to fail. That and folks don't often want to pay more for install than they paid for the sticker.

So,
If someone comes into your shop and purchased graphics online for like $20 -$50 and wants you to install them for a price, you won't do it?

 

[bluehammer]

why wouldn't you install graphics that someone else printed?
People purchase online kits for their cars all the time and we install them. we have a skill that most people don't have. you aren't cheapening anything if you are installing graphics.
we've gotten some long term customers that way.

If its something specific we dont do, then yes we will consider it, but with the caveat that we have no responsibility if something goes wrong. But if we can supply it at near or at the same cost then we suggest they purchase it from us. I'll tell you why. What happens when something goes wrong on the install. Who pays for the new kit? What if the piece you ruin is just one small piece but the online vendor makes you pay for a whole kit...plus RUSH shipping to make the deadline. What if the material is crap and your installation goes bad or takes three times as long? Longevity of the installation is in question and the customer blames you for a bad install but you know its the material that was inferior. The list goes on... Ask me how I know Been doing this for three decades BTW.

 

[bluehammer]

Full time for 4 years in a shop - yes fully insured, electric, heat, water, health insurance. I own the building and the 3 rental units attached. I'm not a fly by night and pricing is on the higher end for signs/vehicles. Mid-range for apparel. Rural area, town of around 6k so most of my customers are small businesses and "people". Part-time help in summer when it's the busy season.

Gotcha...good for you. Seems like you know your local economy then. Good luck with it.

 

[Geneva Olson]

If its something specific we dont do, then yes we will consider it, but with the caveat that we have no responsibility if something goes wrong. But if we can supply it at near or at the same cost then we suggest they purchase it from us. I'll tell you why. What happens when something goes wrong on the install. Who pays for the new kit? What if the piece you ruin is just one small piece but the online vendor makes you pay for a whole kit...plus RUSH shipping to make the deadline. What if the material is crap and your installation goes bad or takes three times as long? Longevity of the installation is in question and the customer blames you for a bad install but you know its the material that was inferior. The list goes on... Ask me how I know Been doing this for three decades BTW

looks like you have your business down...

 

[Geneva Olson]

I have one coming in tomorrow. I quoted it 6 months ago fab and installed, but he liked the online price better. I told him if he wanted he could bring it in and I'd stick it, but I'd do it at a rate and can't predict how the material will behave, so I can't even estimate the cost to install it.
It's not that I won't do it, its that I'd rather deal with everything that I have control over, not some janky north korean vinyl printed with haitian tears.

we usually have to look at the graphics first. if it's crap vinyl, we won't do it. If it's oracal, 3m or avery, we will install it. if we screw it up, we will fix it.