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newbie needs small text capability--plotter?

uranium

New Member
Hi everyone, I'm really, really new here...

I've got a question that's sort of unique. See, I want advice on whether I can get by with a cheap vinyl cutter, but my circumstances are different than most.

I work with a friend here in Chicago who's been doing vinyl installation for 20 years, 10 of of those years after quitting his job at a sign company where he only installed (and, of course, weeded!). I've been helping him recently on a part-time basis when he needs the help. He has 3 clients who provide the bulk of his work, all temporary installations (less than 6 months), nearly all text, nearly all interior, and generally just in black, white, and grey(s) Oracal.

He's not good at all with computers and has had a local shop do the vinyl work and deliver it. Overall it works, but there are still significant problems. Some are the fault of the company cutting the vinyl (often cut way too deep, sometimes seemingly weeded by trained monkeys etc.) and some of the problems are brought about by the clients, i.e. a public event is on a Friday and they make significant changes to the text the day before.

So, I want to step in and take over about 20% of the business we farm out and take it in-house. I don't have any interest in taking the other 80% of the work from the guys we're using, just the last-minute stuff they can't provide in time, last minute fixing of errors, and a few other misc. things. These days, you can lose a client in a heartbeat.

In short, I don't want a career, just an insurance policy that pays it's own premiums.

So, on a REAL shoestring budget ( I won't even go into why), I need a plotter that can do straight text, including pretty small letters at times, reliably. I mean reliably in a different way, though. See, if the cutter broke down and was offline for a few weeks, no problem, we'd just send the vinyl job out as we do now. And if the machine blew up after a year... it would be sad, but no big deal as I wouldn't be depending on it to keep a roof over my head. What I need is good performance on text, both medium and small. As soon as I could afford a modest Graphtec or Roland I'd get one and put this starter plotter I'm researching right into the closet for emergencies.

Now I've done a lot of searching on this amazing forum, but I can't quite get a handle on the state of the technology as it applies to my needs. I mean, do all the modern machines do medium and small text if set up properly? Does the stepper/servo issue apply significantly here? Do I have to obsess about tracking issues when I'm just hoping to run a few 25"x30" panels of text at a time on a 30" machine?

I'm hoping I'm the ideal customer for one of the less-expensive plotters, because I think I'd rather buy something new than risk buying a used one off craigslist or ebay. I don't have enough knowledge or experience to judge a used machine at this point.

So, to summarize:

What cheap Chinese plotter (if any) will cut small text well....and not burst into flames in the first 6 months?
Also, I am a quick learner. and I have a copy of Corel x3.

Thanks for your time. I love this site. I've learned an incredible amount in the 10 hours or so I've spent browsing/searching through it.
 

Bigdawg

Just Me
Text that small? Keep saving your pennies for that Graphtec or similar... having been the proud owner of a cheap chinese plotter - that more than paid for itself - I can tell you that it won't cut small text very nicely...

really, really recommend you just get what ya' need to begin with...
 

speedmedia

New Member
Yeah the only thing that is going ot work for you with text that small is a good cutter. Graphtec is probably your best best but a good Roland, Mimaki, Summa etc should do the trick for you as well. The cheap Chinese cutters are garbage, either go big or go home and stay there.

Thanks,
Kurt
 

uranium

New Member
1/4" is the smallest we've ever needed

Most is at 1/2" or 3/4"

It's kind of funny being in this position. I'm not concerned with cutter/ software flexibility (as long as it can do text), not concerned with heavy workloads, and not even concerned that much with whether the plotter simply quits after a year.

Last month, our vinyl guys were swamped and suddenly a really BIG sign company was putting up the graphics for our biggest client we couldn't do in a timely manner. The next DAY that company had TWO sales reps on site trying to jump in with their little black briefcases.

Our clients are pretty loyal because we treat them well, but we're talking about our three biggest clients providing 90% of our workload (one provides 50% of all of it), and each one is large enough to lose in a heartbeat. I'm talking competing departments, boards of directors, and lots of people with friends. One muckety-muck higher up that really wants his son-in-law to get that business could really put a cramp in our income.
 

Craig Sjoquist

New Member
I have a cheapo Chinese cutter and the one fro Signwarehouse will work cost about $700

Now 1/4 might not work but I also will use easy cutting vinyl for small stuff, also you may need to change blades more often... but you will get the job done.

now this cheapo Chinese cutter is made with several brand names so you might find it cheaper ..... but the software is also not as good.
 

OldPaint

New Member
so basically your in this.............for a "hobby?" but you dont want to buy PROFESSIONAL grade equipment and expect " off brand junk" to work as well? your settin up your disaster.
FYI, part of the equation to cutting small vinly letters.....
1. PROFESSIONAL FONTS, not the junk you d/l for free off the internet.
2. PROFESSIONAL SIGN CUTTING SOFTWARE. really makes small letter cutting easy.
3. PROFESSIONAL CUTTER. that has PRECISION OF CUTS to the 10 of thousands, rather then +-1/16" of an inch.
and i would guess the only selling point to your loyal clients is YOUR LOWER THEN EVERYONE ELSE PRICE. the reason the other CHARGE MORE.........they invested in PROFESSIONAL GRADE EQUIPMENT.
you may not like my answer and not listen to anything i say, but i been at this a long time, and seen so many fall by the wayside because of what they buy to start with.
either save your money go PROFESSIONAL or get someone with PROFESSIONAL EQUIPMENT to sub out your work.
 

uranium

New Member
Old Paint

It's nothing like a hobby.

I want to make sure we keep our install business going with these 3 clients.
I don't want to take the work from the folks that do our vinyl.
I want to be able to fill in the cracks when we can't get our vinyl on time, or when there is a LAST minute revision.

Everything you say makes sense, but like I said, this is a sorta unique situation. We already sub out our work.

I'm pretty confident that if I worked hard I could capture all the vinyl cutting work for myself and make some decent money (we're not new guys that get business by low-balling prices), thing is though I don't want to do that.

The company we do business with is a decent small business. I don't want to take it all from them. And I don't want to make a living cutting vinyl. I just want to be able to knock out maybe 2 emergency panels a week where we've got 12 hours to turn around and install something that was changed/forgotten/damaged etc.

Maybe I'm a Marxist or something, but I don't want to grow this business by cannibalizing another small business just 'cause they won't ALWAYS work until 11 p.m. on a Friday night for us, I just want to make sure our existing business stays with us, rather than going to the guys with the ties and briefcases.
 

James Burke

Being a grandpa is more fun than working
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say you're "dancing on eggshells" here. Not sure you'll get much helpful assistance due to the nature of your request.
 

AUTO-FX

New Member
I guess if you're going to buy a plotter, there's always some good deals on used ones. look in the classified here, or try Ebay ! I would also like to recommend a graphtec, or vinylexpress, or an upper end roland . just dont buy a china plotter.
 

OldPaint

New Member
It's nothing like a hobby.

I want to make sure we keep our install business going with these 3 clients.
I don't want to take the work from the folks that do our vinyl.
I want to be able to fill in the cracks when we can't get our vinyl on time, or when there is a LAST minute revision.

Everything you say makes sense, but like I said, this is a sorta unique situation. We already sub out our work.

I'm pretty confident that if I worked hard I could capture all the vinyl cutting work for myself and make some decent money (we're not new guys that get business by low-balling prices), thing is though I don't want to do that.

The company we do business with is a decent small business. I don't want to take it all from them. And I don't want to make a living cutting vinyl. I just want to be able to knock out maybe 2 emergency panels a week where we've got 12 hours to turn around and install something that was changed/forgotten/damaged etc.

Maybe I'm a Marxist or something, but I don't want to grow this business by cannibalizing another small business just 'cause they won't ALWAYS work until 11 p.m. on a Friday night for us, I just want to make sure our existing business stays with us, rather than going to the guys with the ties and briefcases.
well...........your request is a really weird way of going about things. seems to me, BETTER PRE-CUT PLANNING, AND letting the customer make last minute changes...........SHOULD BE WHAT YOU NEED TO WORK ON.
YOU....NEED TO EXPLAIN to the customer, CUT OFF DAY FOR CHANGES, EXTRA CHARGES FOR FOR LAST MINUTE CHANGES AND CORRESPONDING TIME DELAYS FOR SUCH. this will save you from needing a "part time" plotter.
i been at this a long time, and HAVE HAD MY OWN PLOTTER since day 1. and yes ive had people do this crap. BUT........I GET PAID, and/or they dont hold me to due date that WAS!!!!! seems to me the customer is running your business.
 
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