Pantone Swatch Books - Which One?!

[splizaat]

Hey guys,

As of now, our workflow has been design in illustrator (selecting pantone swatches) > print in versaworks (convert spot colors) to roland printer. 90% of our customers are not using pantones, the other 10% we are able to get as close as possible.

My question is, which pantone swatch books are you guys using? Are you using the fancy color bridge ones or just the standard Formula Guide here: http://www.pantone.com/pages/products/product.aspx?pid=998&ca=1

I'd like to be able to take color swatches up to a customer's existing signs/stickers and match them so when we go to have shirts printed as well, we can notify our screen printer of the pantone number and make our jobs printing and matching colors on the roland that much easier. Are the COLOR BRIDGE guides necessary or are you finding the standard guides work just fine??

Matt

 

[petepaz]

IF YOU CAN AVOID IT DON'T EVER SHOW THE CUSTOMER A PMS SWATCH!!!!!
just kidding. we use PMS solid coated swatch book and you probably also want the PMS /CMYK swatch book to help with your conversions. the other good thing is the most recent update to versawork has PMS identification. the machine still has it's limits you will only get so close to a pms match when printing cmyk. the problem is most customers expect an exact match.

 

[rjpjr]

Color Bridge

The solid printed color swatches are on one side with the closest CMYK equivalents on the other.
We have found this feature helps the customer understand the possible printer limitations.

 

[jfiscus]

Pantone Color Bridge is the one you want.
I bought some Pantone GOEY(?) Bridge book once, and never ONCE used it.

 

[splizaat]

OK I'm bringing this one back from the dead (sorry). We're finally making the leap this week as we knock goals off our list for 2014.

We're convinced the Color Bridge Pantone books are the ones we need. Do you recommend picking up the set that has both coated and uncoated or saving the money and just getting the coated book?

 

[Moze]

Depends what you're doing with them. Print to paper/stock and you'll generally want the uncoated. Print to glossy or paint a sign cabinet and you'll generally want the coated.

 

[binki]

If you only get one then get the bridge book. We have the bridge and the coated book.

 

[splizaat]

The bridge is the system....they have bridge coated, and bridge uncoated. Then the bridge set that has both.

 

[hansman]

IMHO The PMS numbers are just a reference - target. I usually convert to the printer/ profile I am using anyway. Most of the time I do NOT let the rip do the conversion for me. Then of course the 2nd most important issue to tackle is to be sure the printer is linearized correctly. Its amazing to me how many people just send things to the rip with mixed color spaces (RGB, LAB, CMYK) and just let it automatically convert on the fly!

 

[splizaat]

Correct. I plan to use the PMS charts as a REFERENCE....starting with the PMS swatch, test print a few different ways and see if we can get it as close as possible. We never just hit print...but we are starting to get more requests for pantone colors and up to this point we've gotten lucky - I want to know when I pass a print off that I really did do my best to hit that color.

We mainly print vinyl, perf, clear vinyl and glossy roland paper stock. Nothing uncoated...I'm assuming just the coated swatch will be ok??

When it comes to Pantone I have a TON of questions though - I overthink things wayyy too much....like what if a customer has an uncoated pantone they're using for their company branding -- is there a corresponding Coated swatch that matches? Or should they always be able to provide me both a C and U PMS swatch? We deal with a lot of companies where someone puts the order in, the design department tells them their swatch is ###U and they relay it over not having a clue what it is. Trying to streamline the process whenever it applies

 

[mpn]

The coated and uncoated PMS colors stay the same, i.e. pms 300 coated and PMS 300 uncoated is the same color, the only difference is the stock it was printed on.
My suggestion would be to stick with the coated version if you never print on matte / uncoated substrates. Even with the pms books there are variables including the aging of the paper they are printed on.
Gotta replace the books every year as well if the color matching is that critical for the job.

Other key tools involved in pms matching include a color correct light box for viewing and a densitometer for measuring.

 

[Moze]

Correct. I plan to use the PMS charts as a REFERENCE....starting with the PMS swatch, test print a few different ways and see if we can get it as close as possible. We never just hit print...but we are starting to get more requests for pantone colors and up to this point we've gotten lucky - I want to know when I pass a print off that I really did do my best to hit that color.

We mainly print vinyl, perf, clear vinyl and glossy roland paper stock. Nothing uncoated...I'm assuming just the coated swatch will be ok??

When it comes to Pantone I have a TON of questions though - I overthink things wayyy too much....like what if a customer has an uncoated pantone they're using for their company branding -- is there a corresponding Coated swatch that matches? Or should they always be able to provide me both a C and U PMS swatch? We deal with a lot of companies where someone puts the order in, the design department tells them their swatch is ###U and they relay it over not having a clue what it is. Trying to streamline the process whenever it applies

The Coated (C) and Uncoated (U) refer to how the colors will look on coated or uncoated paper. The formula is the same for both corresponding colors. If they spec a coated or uncoated color, it's important to make sure they understand the system and how the media or material being printed or painted affects the final color.

 

[Moze]

(...or, what mpn said...)

 

[Mosh]

I print a PMS chart on each of the materials I use the most, and still I see color differences. Most customers will not notice 2%-5% color shifts, really depends on the application.

Here is a chart http://www.cal-print.com/InkColorChart.htm AND NOTICE, it says it is a reference ONLY, same as ANY pantone chart you buy.

 

[dypinc]

One thing to remember about about a Pantone book with printed spot colors (not process simulation) is that you can read the spot color with a spectro and input that lab value info into your RIP. I have run RIPs where this was a necessity to get accurate spot colors. Most good RIPs have the ability built in to replace the default lab values for a spot color just by reading a spot color with a spectro. Also makes matching any color including paint chips by just designating them as a custom spot color and read the paint chip etc. with a specro and applying that lab value to the custom spot color.

 

[MIMO]

Bridge coated - 99% of the time

As many have already said, Bridge Coated is a good all purpose one. I have a complete set and 99% of the time am just using the bridge coated. The only time I use uncoated is for one customer who needs a dead matte poster stock and when we are outsourcing small offset work. And remember to store the book in a drawer away from the sun rather than fanned out on your desk

 

[splizaat]

Thanks so much for everyone's help. Ordered the Color Bridge Coated swatch book today!!!

 

[splizaat]

Ok I've got some more questions. Does anyone have a good link to a file with a pantone chart with all pantone swatches in it? I'd love to try and print one for reference....

I know of one shop who printed a pantone swatch chart and when a customer comes in looking for a specific pantone, they take their pantone swatch book and match it up on the wall with a pantone swatch they printed. It may be the wrong NUMBER swatch, but it matches the official swatch -- plug it into the file and off they go. Similar to using a roland swatch chart, but they're using pantone swatches...

 

[visual800]

if you must buy a PMS chart get a used on on ebay. Those things aint cheap. We use sold coated and uncoated in one. i never show the customer either one, the book is for MY benefit not their confusion.

I never match PMS, I will come close and I explain that. I also explain the PMS colors change on whatever surfaces you put it on. you cannot obtain the same values in house paint, printing on pater and signage it will never match

 

[splizaat]

correct I want a file to print all the PMS colors off my own printer though