Prepping Clients Mentally - Avoiding problems

[neato]

Lately, it seems like I've been getting a lot of work for clients who just don't get it. Those clients that come to you for a professional logo or design. Then when you submit something, they come back at you with their own idea, or a multitude of ideas from friends or family that are frankly just garbage!

I try to keep a humble attitude, after all, in the end, they have to live with the logo.

But how do you guys prep your clients to avoid this mess? What I'm thinking of doing is to hand them a sheet ahead of time describing the design process, explaining that our job is to help them look good and get more business, (maybe mention my experience) and swaying them from getting opinions from every family member and friend they have

I know design is relative, everyone has different tastes. And I want to be balanced, since the customer has to be happy in the end. But I don't feel like I'm doing my job if I don't try to convince them that their ideas aren't good. But how do you do that in a nice way?

Sorry for all the rambling thoughts, it's just been one of those days. I know you can't please them all, but I want to feel good about my work in the end too.

 

[TheSnowman]

It's like we were just talking about this or something???

 

[neato]

Can I get an "AMEN" brother?

 

[genericname]

What I'm thinking of doing is to hand them a sheet ahead of time describing the design process, explaining that our job is to help them look good and get more business, (maybe mention my experience) and swaying them from getting opinions from every family member and friend they have

I've done exactly this in the past, down to the number of revisions, and what the point of each meeting/submission is going to be about.

In the end, none of it has ever worked. You still end up doing what any designer worth their salt has to do; steer the client away from disaster, and minimize the damage.

 

[Gino]

Honestly, I don't think anyone is ever going to be able to ward off the artistic nieces and nephews along with the friends saying this and that with some kind of worded paragraph. They'll think they are unique with their twist on things.

It's nice to have a policy in place you can point to in case they get out of hand, but you can only refer to it. Otherwise, you could lose them if you somehow embarrass them or hurt their feelings.

Mostly what we've done in the past is..... and you probably already know this from working with this as a main part of your business..... you can almost ALWAYS tell who's gonna be a pain. So right off the bat, you let them know you are working for them. You collect your deposit/retainer, so the rest is like a lawyer, doctor or any other professional...... you are on the clock. So after maybe one revision, you again say, hey.... whatever you like, you're paying for this. Later in the conversation, reinforce that you are on the clock and you'll do whatever they see fit. If they come back with more revisions, let them know you have... however many hours in it already and will let them know where they are on the hourly time portion of the deal. They might need to kick in some more cash to keep THEIR ideas rolling. If they squawk, let them know, you've been doing what they've ordered and haven't allowed you to work your magic. If they say they don;t like what you've been doing tell them to settle up and go somewhere else. You've been paid so far, so it's no skin off your nose at this point.

We did a trailer for a guy two weeks ago. Gave him layouts based on his direction. He didn't like some of our tweaks, so we agreed to go in between. Now he comes back and has his wife with him who is demanding we do it as he first wanted, which in our opinion..... layout-wise is wrong. It's costing me about an hour of time and $25. worth of digital printing. He'll have what he wants, but I know it ain't gonna look good. He said to me when his wife left, I'll pay ya for half. I don't think she's right, but it was her layout from the beginning and we changed it. So, I'll get $350. for this and keep everyone happy.

 

[noregrets]

sometimes you just cant win. I am in just this situation at the moment....

Local golf club approach me about a new sign - they tell me that they have bought a second hand sign from an existing golf club and want to re-use the framework and the blank - but with a new design - gave me full creative license on the design.

They told me it was in great condition and I needed to create something to go on a 2.3m diameter circle.

Did a few concepts, all of them looked pretty good. They took them to their committee meeting, now we have what you are talking about......

Aside from the fact the circle that I have to work with is a bent and twisted thin piece of metal that isnt even round, full of dents and fixes, I reluctantly have to go with a design that they have come up with that is going to look horrible.

I have told them as professionaly as I can that it is going to look awful, and am even making them sign a disclaimer that I have warned them it is going to be crap, and yet they still want to go ahead....

 

[neato]

Good responses. Looks like we all face the same thing.

I understand we won't convince them all. I just have a hard time telling someone their idea isn't good and not in their own best interest. My job is to make the customer look good, it's my profession. If I don't say anything, I'm not doing my job. And when someone asks them later "Who did your logo (or sign)?", I want to make sure that my reputation isn't tainted by nephews and best friends opinions.

 

[Gino]

I would venture to say, if someone's ideas or wants are as bad as you're describing now.... I'd tell them, I'm sorry, but in good conscience and my professional reputation at stake, I can no longer be involved. Explain to them precisely what is wrong and ask them to show you where they have ever seen another horrendous appraoch as to the one they are suggesting you go.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

While, what I have to deal with is a little different, the overall theme is the same.

I'll have someone that will send me a design that they had done and it isn't a good idea to attempt that for embroidery given the size that they want it. Not all of them get it and in fact, in some instances I have had them say that so and so did everything and they showed me the design. It's filled with bad things, but it seems like they just don't get it when I try to tell them that this isn't really a good product.

I will say that it happens with designers about equally as it does to the average joe blow. It seems like they are all just used to either web or print design. Don't really know the limitations of needle and thread.

If you happen to find the one way that will magically get them all to understand, please share it. It would help with a little of headaches that I have to deal with.

 

[John Butto]

Neato: you need to have that wife of Gino's customer who design her husband's logo do your bidding. Because when she went back to Gino and told him to keep it the way she wanted it, he did what she asked. Now I know Gino from his stories on here, and for him to comply without saying something is a feat in itself.

 

[Jillbeans]

It's a tricky subject for sure.
I have a lot of potential clients who I call "Doubting Thomases" They come to you because they've seen and liked your work.
You do a briefing with them, get a feel of what they are looking for
(usually I get a good idea within a few seconds)
But then at the end of the conference they ask "But what if I don't like it?"
I tell them that after listening to them and discussing things with them, I have a pretty good idea of what they are looking for, and it normally only takes a few emails to nail their logo into place.

I tell them that while it's important that they like their new logo, it's even more important that potential clients like their logo.
That might be a tool for you to use when presented with the old abortion on a stick looking papyrus curlz sketch their nephew doodled up in Word.
I have learned a few little tricks over the years-and yes I still have to polish quite a few turds.

These don't go into my portfolio. I've come to the realization that a lot of people wouldn't know a good design if it bit them. It's up to us to tell them what works, without sounding too snooty.
(last week a lady told me that I actually scared her)
Also, people like to think that they have had an influence on the logo, so if a customer is dead set for pink, use a small bit of it in the layout and when showing it to them point out that you did use their suggestion. Everyone likes their ego to be stroked.
That person might tell the next person how well you listened to them and what a great job you did.

Chin up, old boy.
Love....Jill

 

[the graphics co]

Some clients just can't get their head around the concept that they don't know what looks the best for their business. You can tell them and educate them until you are blue in the face, it doesn't mean they will listen or care. It is kind of like trying to tell your wife to "relax" if you feel she is overreacting.

It really turns into you having to be mentally prepared to have your design butchered and accept your fate.

Then, you can rejoice on the occasions when a client really allows you to implement your creativity and skill.

 

[noregrets]

Good responses. Looks like we all face the same thing.

I understand we won't convince them all. I just have a hard time telling someone their idea isn't good and not in their own best interest. My job is to make the customer look good, it's my profession. If I don't say anything, I'm not doing my job. And when someone asks them later "Who did your logo (or sign)?", I want to make sure that my reputation isn't tainted by nephews and best friends opinions.

I know what you mean, that is my problem with the golf club sign - there is no way it is going to look good, yet peoples perception will be that I did the sign.....which will do nothing for my reputation

 

[Gino]

Neato: you need to have that wife of Gino's customer who design her husband's logo do your bidding. Because when she went back to Gino and told him to keep it the way she wanted it, he did what she asked. Now I know Gino from his stories on here, and for him to comply without saying something is a feat in itself.

Got that right. We had three small logos on this trailer wrong in her opinion. A 36' long x 8-1/2' high trailer with these three logos along the front bottom. We left ample space of about 8" from the trailer aluminum rail. We just finished dropping them an entire 3-1/4" down. The logos are only 11" tall x 25" wide.... all three of them. Like that mattered a whole lot. So, I did it for nothing, except for what Daddy's gonna give me extra......

 

[Circleville Signs]

Here's the reality - you have total control, it's just a question of whether you want to exercise that control.

Here is how I handle EVERY design project.

1. On the initial consult I go through my portfolio with the client, allowing them to ask questions about the processes that I use to achieve results. They get to see my style of work, and they get to see real world results and testimonials from clients who have allowed me to do what I do.

2. At the end of this consult, I ask for the business. If they want to move forward, 2 things happen. First, I get a deposit. This deposit is equal to 100% of the package that they are purchasing (I have 3 different logo design packages). The second is that I hand them a design questionnaire. This has 15 questions on it. I don't do one single ounce of work until I get that back, fully filled out, with thought, by the client. This keeps me from shooting in the dark.

3. Once I get back the questionnaire, I produce a design brief/contract. This explains how the process works, who owns what, what my rights as the designer are/their rights as the brand owner are. It also details how much of my time they have purchased.

4. THEN I start working.

Here's the kicker - anytime a client brings me a sketch, or niece/nephew art to "start" from, I politely explain to them that this is not the way that I work, and if they are looking for a mouse operator, I am happy to refer them to someone who is less expensive than I am.

 

[Techman]

There is a technique called 'preframing.
that is why the first appointment is so mandatory. your mission is to get your client into the office after you profile them.

During that meeting you 'preframe them to what action you expect. No matter what they say, no matter how they present it your goal is to steer the curse to a final positive outcome. Here is another example of why we all need specific techniques to get our sales techniques out of the stone age.

 

[genericname]

Gary, you are a beautiful man. Roughly the same process I follow, but when I get frustrated, I allow myself to get steam-rolled. I think you illustrated the real factor that's missing from a lot of our processes, and that's discipline.

 

[darrell]

I think this is fitting the Next logo
good solution Gary

 

[genericname]

I think this is fitting the Next logo
good solution Gary

I was thinking of just this kind of thing. The only designer that doesn't have to deal with "Hey, my wife said..." is the superstar designer, and those are few and far between.

I do dream though, of a day where I can tell nightmare clients that I'm the expert, I'm calling the shots, and that they're wife has terrible taste, and what she thinks is pretty will ruin their business.

But until then!

 

[Dan Antonelli]

What kind of document do you use for your kickoff on the creative direction? Do you use an in-depth creative brief to outline the initial art direction, and whether their ideas are appropriate for the target audience at the onset? This is often when you can identify creative differences in the campaign strategy.

I'm not shy in telling clients that their direction or ideas in their brief (or later) are not appropriate, and will come at the expense of their business. My job is to make their target audience happy as a primary objective, not necessarily their own personal preferences. And when their target audience is happy, I assure them, they'll be really happy as well. It's rare when I really need to twist arms, but I think we do a great job of illustrating why you need to trust our expertise in this arena. You need to not only walk the walk, but market your own expertise in a meaningful way in order to help clients believe in your abilities and recommendations. Sometimes its all about how you market yourself, your successes, and your results for other businesses in similar scenarios.

No one care about how great you are - all they care about is how your greatness can translate into success for themselves. Frame your marketing from that perspective, and make sure it answers the question 'Why should I trust you?'