Problems with decals on vehicle windows

[signmeup]

The other thing I've found is if you pick up the fallen vinyl it's perfectly sticky on the back, just like new.

 

[TheSnowman]

I had the same problem on a fire chef's SUV about two years ago. Cleaned the window good, put it on dry, and the first snowfall we had, you could move them around like magnets on a fridge.

I didn't know what else to suspect other than Rain-X, but that's really random on the side windows. So I just cleaned it w/ every remover I had in the shop, and this time, it's been no problems since...so I really have NO clue what it was...so just point towards Rain-X of some kind.

 

[G-Artist]

That "coke" thing is now an urban myth.

Up to somewhere in the early 70's Coca-Cola™ would actually remove rust from chrome bumpers, etc (with a bit of scrubbing). Not anymore. All the formulas for all their soft drinks have gone through multiple revisions.

If cake Bon Ami doesn't do the trick then there is really something to be apprehensive about.

I was at an auto body shop recently and I overheard the owner tell a customer that he had to charge quite a bit extra to remove some sort of customer applied finish (Mother's Wax??) in order to do a repaint. All the "space age" products that are available for auto protection plus auto industry add ons that are routinely applied nowadays seem to be biting aftermarket folks in the butt.

Has anyone tried a cleaner, such as Ditzo 440 (body prep prior to painting), followed by a general clean up with Bon Ami???

Just a thought,

 

[scarface]

To be honest, I did some RTA decals in Oracal 651 and the customers say now they are peeling up out of nowhere after being weeks old.

It has snowed the past month so somehow snow is messing with things even when a ice scraper isn't used on the area

 

[signmeup]

It has something to do with snow. What...... I don't know. The van I've been battling was fine until it snowed but wasn't all that cold out. It was like the snow melted and the decals went with it. If it was really cold and it snowed nothing happened. I think it's haunted.

 

[gabagoo]

I just received a 2010 Caravan and I was setting up the logos on the back side windows with masking tape. Turned my back to get my tape measure and when I turned around the logo was gone. It slipped off. I tried the tape and it literally would not stick to the glass.

I used rapid tack and then some methyl hydrate and the tape held this time. Maybe it is some form of silicone they spray on new vehicles?

 

[signmeup]

Is the paint like that too?

 

[gabagoo]

God I hope not....Gulp!!!

 

[Malkin]

I had this happen on my own car & a few customers vehicles. I started following the directions I saw on a spec sheet for some perf window film & it helped. Basically just clean the glass with your mild soap/water solution first, then clean with a 2:1 water to isopropyl alcohol mix. Try to not let the alcohol evaporate, continue to wipe until dry. Your finger should drag across the glass.

I have also noticed that every time the problem happened, it was during a time of cold rain turning to snow.

 

[luggnut]

maybe its some kind of condensation like the side of a cold glass? cold and wet snowy weather vould cause the window to sweat?

 

[signmeup]

I'm sure that's part of it. What allows the condensation to form under the vinyl instead of on top of it is the mystery. I have decals on my van windows that have been there for 5 years with no issue. I only have one van I've done that has this problem.....what's so special about this van? I think it's something in the glass.

 

[DGDesigns]

A local glass company mentioned to me that there is a "Rain X" type coating on some vehicle glass. I was told to use Bon Ami for cleaning as other mentioned. I also use high tack vinyl as my base layer.

 

[Jim Doggett]

Could be nano-coating, too. Especially on back windows.

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

my guess is that the manufacturers of the glass of these vehicles are treating it with a product that is not promoting adhesion. is this only happening with relatively new vehicles or can anyone report that this has happened on an older model vehicle?

i have a few contacts who are chemists at 3m even though this is an avery problem i will shoot them an email and see if they are aware of any issues or changes, if this is an automotive glass issue and not a specific brand (despite all of the hoopla there are not many differences in the majority of the vinyl manufacturing companies formulas) issue they will know about it.

i have seen custom architectural glass do some really strange things with severe temperature changes other wise i would immediately think it was a vinyl issue (and it very well may be) but if it is only newer model cars it may be a glass issue.

again has anyone seen this happen with an older vehicle?

 

[Malkin]

DAN: For what it's worth, about 7 years ago it happened on the windshield of my '85 Fiero. The day after installing I found the letters (cast white vinyl) slid all the way down (after a cold/rainy night). I was still pretty inexperienced at the time and only cleaned using soapy water.

 

[Jim Doggett]

"my guess is that the manufacturers of the glass of these vehicles are treating it with a product that is not promoting adhesion. is this only happening with relatively new vehicles or can anyone report that this has happened on an older model vehicle?"

Hi Dan,

That's nano-coating. It's a safety / environmentally friendly deal. No window cleaners and improved visibility. And it's way more permanent than Rain-X.

I used to be with Yellotools, a company in Germany. They got together with one of the lead scientists that created nano-coating annd developed what may be the only product to remove it. (they call it Nano-ex)

You might be able to get it in the US. I'm not sure if hazardous material shipping is an issue. But you can check with them at info@yellotools.com

Best,

Jim

 

[wes70]

my guess is that the manufacturers of the glass of these vehicles are treating it with a product that is not promoting adhesion. is this only happening with relatively new vehicles or can anyone report that this has happened on an older model vehicle?

i have a few contacts who are chemists at 3m even though this is an avery problem i will shoot them an email and see if they are aware of any issues or changes, if this is an automotive glass issue and not a specific brand (despite all of the hoopla there are not many differences in the majority of the vinyl manufacturing companies formulas) issue they will know about it.

i have seen custom architectural glass do some really strange things with severe temperature changes other wise i would immediately think it was a vinyl issue (and it very well may be) but if it is only newer model cars it may be a glass issue.

again has anyone seen this happen with an older vehicle?

I can confirm that this has happened to me on two seperate occasions. Last year before xmas on a 1996 chev express passenger van and this past Nov on 1994 Dodge window van. On both vans, the lettering literally slid off the glass onto the body. The owner of the chev van said it was possible that one of his drivers may have used rainx on the windows, but the dodge had no previous glass treatment applied.

I also believe that the weather and/or temperature is the cause.

 

[signmeup]

my guess is that the manufacturers of the glass of these vehicles are treating it with a product that is not promoting adhesion. is this only happening with relatively new vehicles or can anyone report that this has happened on an older model vehicle?

i have a few contacts who are chemists at 3m even though this is an avery problem i will shoot them an email and see if they are aware of any issues or changes, if this is an automotive glass issue and not a specific brand (despite all of the hoopla there are not many differences in the majority of the vinyl manufacturing companies formulas) issue they will know about it.

i have seen custom architectural glass do some really strange things with severe temperature changes other wise i would immediately think it was a vinyl issue (and it very well may be) but if it is only newer model cars it may be a glass issue.

again has anyone seen this happen with an older vehicle?

I used 2 different brands on my "van from Hell". The van is a 2000. Edited to add....actually 3 brands. There were digital prints involved too. They seem to fair a bit better than the cast vinyl.

 

[signmeup]

A local glass company mentioned to me that there is a "Rain X" type coating on some vehicle glass. I was told to use Bon Ami for cleaning as other mentioned. I also use high tack vinyl as my base layer.

I used bon ami with a power buffer for my third install on the same van.....15 minutes per window. Didn't help.

I think the glass has something in/on it from the manufacturing process. The windows that are giving trouble may be the first ones off the mold after a new coat of mold release is applied.

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

is this happening with both wet and dry applications?

if it is wet applications are you using a reliable product?

lets try to isolate the conditions that are causing this so that people are not losing money.