Roland VS 6400. 4 Color vs 6 Color Setup?

[Diamonicus]

Hello, I'm about to set up a sign shop and we are close to ordering our printer and cutter. We plan on getting the Roland VS 6400 Printer Cutter. And the Graphtech 64" plotter. My question is, Should I stick with the 4 color set up, for production speed, Or go with the 6 color Set up for better colors?
I've heard arguments for each but am still unclear. We don't have a client base yet as this is a new branch of the sign shop so I cant say for certain what we well ultimately be doing more of just yet. I do know that we do want to get into Wraps since we have the space.
Any better ideas weather I will need the 6 color set up with the Lm+Lc, or stick with the regular CMYK.
Thanks in advance...

 

[ricksoccer5]

Go with the 6 color for a wider color gamut.

 

[Diamonicus]

Can you really tell the difference between the two, if you printed the same file? And does the wider color Gamut overshadow the increase in speed and output.

 

[Custom_Grafx]

The speed decrease with the VS is quite significant when you go 6 color or white/metallic.

http://www.rolanddga.com/products/printcut/versaVs/specifications.asp

Speeds are here ^

I run vs640 in dual cmyk, and I get good colour and resolution, and when running in 6 pass, great speed/quality combination.

When doing banners, the 2 pass billboard mode is great, as you can't see the banding at all on things like mesh banner. It's around 23sqm/hr on BB mode on the vs640 when running a 1600mm roll. I've done it and my rough calculations came in at at least 20sqm/hr, which is great.

Why not get a test print from both setups, on the same file and make a choice for yourself based on what you need more...

From what I've heard and been told, the 6colour will show you the most difference when you are printing skintones and the such, it will give you more detail in the mid/light tones.

In any case, one thing is apparent, and that is that you can get better colour from 4 colour if you know about colour management, vs someone who has a 12 colour machine, and knows nothing about colour management.

Overall I'm very happy I went with double cmyk - I get good speed, and good quality. Still I have some things to learn about colour managment... but slowly getting there... I hope!

 

[artbot]

gamut is the same. speed is way faster. you will use less ink so square foot cost will be lower (less ink because achieving tones with darker colors allows for lighter dither). i run dual cmyk and use white and silver ink running from my black channel whenever i need it from an auxiliary cart. basically run dual cmyk if you want to make more money.

...consider this. if i had a cup of blue paint. would adding water to it increase the gamut of that blue paint? no. it will just allow that blue paint to go on smoother.

 

[Bly]

If you plan on printing photography or art prints six colour will give you less grain in light areas. For signs four colour will be fine.

 

[Dave Rowland]

sadly the 6col VS range is dead slow compared to other printers for same money.... i was so dissapointed with it at demo. Latex knocks socks off this printer

 

[JoshLoring]

If your looking for speed- stay away from the metallic printers. Even by removing the metallics, The VS (248sfhr dual cmyk) can't compete with the Roland XC (441sfhr) and XJ (449sfhr) speeds.

The market for metallic is slim.. And if you want to do vehicle wraps stay away from it.

 

[Diamonicus]

While that's True Josh, the CX is a faster printer, it is also bit more expensive. Also I was not planning on using metallic inks. Just either the Dual CMYK, or the CMYK +Lc,Lm.
i'm starting to lean toward the 6 color, because Speed may not be an issue yet, considering we are just starting, and thus aren't likely to be swamped with orders anytime soon. it's could happen, but I have friends in the business who don't run their machines 8 hours a day. so speed never became a problem. Now that could be due to how they market their shop, I don't know for sure.
I do know that I would love to be doing Banners and Wraps. And as a graphic designer, could potentially be creating some vibrant layouts. if the 6 color will give me the smoothest output, I don't see a major downside. except for the Cost factor of replacing inks faster.....
good thing I still have some time to decide.

 

[rjssigns]

Running Lc+Lm does not increase gamut. The only purpose is to make smoother gradients.

 

[FS-Keith]

do not waste your money one a graphtec, they are junk. spend the extra money and get a mimaki

 

[jhanson]

do not waste your money one a graphtec, they are junk. spend the extra money and get a mimaki

Is this your opinion or experience? I've heard of a lot of satisfied Graphtec users, and aside from the occasional hardware glitch haven't really seen much go wrong with the FC7000 and FC8000 models.

 

[Robert M]

Printer cutter and a cutter

Have to ask, why get a printer / cutter and a vinyl cutter?

 

[jhanson]

Have to ask, why get a printer / cutter and a vinyl cutter?

For a very small sign shop, a printer/cutter combo can save floor space. However, once you start running a lot of production a combo unit will hold you back since you can't cut while you print -- it is one or the other.

If you start off with a combo unit, though, you can always add a standalone vinyl cutter with optical recognition, for only a modest investment, at a later point when it becomes necessary.

 

[Diamonicus]

That's why we are getting both the cutter printer, and the stand alone cutter, it gives us the most versatility for which ever situation occurs. if for some reason we have so much printing that cutting will hold up the printer we can just cut it on the cutter (lets be realistic, what percentage of print jobs also need cutting? NEVER with a banner). if we only had the one, yes it could cause a problem for a busy shop. however if the workload is not that crazy, I'd rather have the one machine do both, rather than have to always remove and register the print. Of course if the job has to be laminated, I'll have to do it either way. But i'll get the most experience and have better options having both. Also space is not a major issue right now. the room is about 25 feet long.

 

[Robert M]

Mimaki

Have you looked at the Mimaki CJV30-160. It is their printer/cutter. It has a list of 22k vs 26.5K on the Roland and the Mimaki has the auto take up (2k more from Roland) included. they are also currently giving up to 2k in free ink. Both printers use Epson DX5 heads so quality should be similar.

 

[Diamonicus]

I probably didn't go with Mimaki, because I am unfamiliar with that machine. I have used Rolands before. I didn't know about the price difference (which looks good, perhaps if I had known sooner) oh well, and at the same time none of the sales people pushed me toward Mimaki or leaned me in that direction. The Rolands may be a little more popular for some reason and they may have happy customers. We put the order in today however, so perhaps the die is cast as they say. I guess we shall see.

 

[DRamm76]

Can you really tell the difference between the two, if you printed the same file? And does the wider color Gamut overshadow the increase in speed and output.

Yes there is a difference between the 2. I have both a 6 color and a 4 color on our showroom floor and there is a significant difference. I would go with the 6 color