John Butto
New Member
A "quickie" with the massage lady...
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Sign for Massage Therapist, critique please
- Thread starter AmyW
- Start date
AmyW
New Member
More tweaking, how are these? (keeping the phone # off as Gino advised, but I'm afraid she'll take issue with that)
Any advise how to make the "appointment only" bit look better on the oval one? Without the flourishes I feel like it's just floating randomly but I'm not sure how to fix that.
Regarding color, I agree completely that earth tones would do a lovely job of setting the tone, but the colors of her house just don't work that well so I figured it's safest to go for either a sandblasted cedar sign or keep it black and white (which is why I wanted to try add a shadow to give it a bit more dimension/interest if she chooses against the cedar)
This is in a new subdivision which was trying for high-end but the developers dropped the ball on enforcing their design guidelines so some houses are lovely, others not so much.
Any advise how to make the "appointment only" bit look better on the oval one? Without the flourishes I feel like it's just floating randomly but I'm not sure how to fix that.
Regarding color, I agree completely that earth tones would do a lovely job of setting the tone, but the colors of her house just don't work that well so I figured it's safest to go for either a sandblasted cedar sign or keep it black and white (which is why I wanted to try add a shadow to give it a bit more dimension/interest if she chooses against the cedar)
This is in a new subdivision which was trying for high-end but the developers dropped the ball on enforcing their design guidelines so some houses are lovely, others not so much.
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Gino
Premium Subscriber
Last one for the night..............
Don't tell her.... Gino said to leave the phone number off...... but be professional about it and ask her to look around one day at all the really nice signs and which ones have a phone, extra copy and just totally useless garbage vs. the ones that expressly say.... This Is Me ??
Beauty shops, Pizza shops, Chinese Restaurants, tattoo parlors, Nail salons, real estate companies and so forth. All businesses which are a dime a dozen and they look like they're begging for you to call with their number plastered on the sign.
You mentioned this is in a very nice development. I'll say this again.... you better check with your local authorities and see what she can and cannot put out.
For instance, if anyone could put a sign up, this neighborhood of hers would look like an upscale strip mall. Is that going to be allowed ?? I doubt it. Okay, let's go a little further. Let's suppose an Adult Book store wants to open. Do you want them advertising on their front lawn that you live next door to something like that ?? I wouldn't want to be their neighbor and I highly doubt someone else will..... if they can help it. Check with your local codes or don't do this thing at all. Heck, they might have a size restriction of 2 Sq Ft. Then what are you going to do ??
Now on your drawing so far....... White & Black...... you feel is calming or relaxing ?? Stop right now and remove your feelings 100%. That's about as sterile as you can get. You have the two extremes going at it. Talk about tension. Healing and calming colors are usually pastel, subtle and easy on the eye. Oh.... earth tones are not relaxing and besides, they've been wa-a-a-ay overused since the 70's. You must be young.
I'd re-think some of your approaches and tackle it again in the morning.
Don't tell her.... Gino said to leave the phone number off...... but be professional about it and ask her to look around one day at all the really nice signs and which ones have a phone, extra copy and just totally useless garbage vs. the ones that expressly say.... This Is Me ??
Beauty shops, Pizza shops, Chinese Restaurants, tattoo parlors, Nail salons, real estate companies and so forth. All businesses which are a dime a dozen and they look like they're begging for you to call with their number plastered on the sign.
You mentioned this is in a very nice development. I'll say this again.... you better check with your local authorities and see what she can and cannot put out.
For instance, if anyone could put a sign up, this neighborhood of hers would look like an upscale strip mall. Is that going to be allowed ?? I doubt it. Okay, let's go a little further. Let's suppose an Adult Book store wants to open. Do you want them advertising on their front lawn that you live next door to something like that ?? I wouldn't want to be their neighbor and I highly doubt someone else will..... if they can help it. Check with your local codes or don't do this thing at all. Heck, they might have a size restriction of 2 Sq Ft. Then what are you going to do ??
Now on your drawing so far....... White & Black...... you feel is calming or relaxing ?? Stop right now and remove your feelings 100%. That's about as sterile as you can get. You have the two extremes going at it. Talk about tension. Healing and calming colors are usually pastel
I'd re-think some of your approaches and tackle it again in the morning.
bob
It's better to have two hands than one glove.
No.
Typically one does not bend upper and lower case type. This is because the ascenders and descenders tend to look clumsy when when text is bent along a path. You can get away with it on a line of sans serif with no ascenders and especially no descenders. You should never do it with a serif face. Unless you have some really good reason to do so. You don't.
Those floral decorations are the wrong color, the wrong size, and in the wrong place. That they are symmetrical is far more an exercise in smarm than effective design.
The slight grey drop shadow makes me want to clean my spectacles.
Marlene
New Member
totally give up on the oval idea as it just looks bad. the last version is so out of balance. do you understand what people have been saying about balance? some people have no idea what that means when it comes to a design and it is a learned skill so not crapping on you for being clueless, just thinking you need to hone your skills. bob is right on the upper/lower case on arcs, it just doesn't work and that also adds to the off balance look. the other one isn't bad, it is getting there.
SignManiac
New Member
I like what John came up with. Less is more. It's your job to tell her what she needs and not the other way around.
AmyW
New Member
Nope, I'm fairly clueless (sorry) I thought it had to do with symmetry. But then again I totally haven't been paying attention to that at all on the oval one. I'm here to learn, and trying to do it as quickly as possible, so thanks for any and all tips
Jillbeans
New Member
It's too late at night for me to post a suggestion, but what I will say is that you need to tighten up your elements. Massage and Therapy have too much space between them, and your lines of copy do as well.
Your layouts are full of holes, and you are breaking a few design rules.
Such as arching caps and lower case, and using too many (bad) fonts in a layout.
None of your examples are very good, not to sound mean, but they don't really prioritize the meaning of the sign. They are all kind of wishy-washy and weak.
I have done a few signs for massage therapists, usually they are right up there with hair dressers as being idiotic clients to work with, they usually always want some obscure meaningless symbol just like chiropractors always want a damn spine.
Maureen is right, no sharp elements.
Font choices would be the dreaded Papyrus or a nice looking script.
I used an A&S one on the last massage sign I did.
Let go of the oval...make the shape of the sign fit your copy not force the copy to a shape.
Love....Jill
Rather than watching Boston hand the Pens their hineys here is a late-night suggestion.
This uses Bogey....write the price of the font into your job, isn't it only about $25? It's a tool you can use again.
The hands are ones I drew for a massage sign years ago and can be purchased from istock.
It's by no means a masterpiece but I think it's cohesive.
My suggestion is in black and white but most massage types like earth tones.
Your layouts are full of holes, and you are breaking a few design rules.
Such as arching caps and lower case, and using too many (bad) fonts in a layout.
None of your examples are very good, not to sound mean, but they don't really prioritize the meaning of the sign. They are all kind of wishy-washy and weak.
I have done a few signs for massage therapists, usually they are right up there with hair dressers as being idiotic clients to work with, they usually always want some obscure meaningless symbol just like chiropractors always want a damn spine.
Maureen is right, no sharp elements.
Font choices would be the dreaded Papyrus or a nice looking script.
I used an A&S one on the last massage sign I did.
Let go of the oval...make the shape of the sign fit your copy not force the copy to a shape.
Love....Jill
Rather than watching Boston hand the Pens their hineys here is a late-night suggestion.
This uses Bogey....write the price of the font into your job, isn't it only about $25? It's a tool you can use again.
The hands are ones I drew for a massage sign years ago and can be purchased from istock.
It's by no means a masterpiece but I think it's cohesive.
My suggestion is in black and white but most massage types like earth tones.
Attachments
Pat Whatley
New Member
Marlene
New Member
Pat's looks good. the colors are nice. the layout is interesting enough that people will notice it.
not paying attention to that at all on the oval is the problem. to learn you have to pay attention to what you do and why it doesn't work. you can learn a lot from the members here as we do share what we have learned. keep trying and posting and with each post, you may start to see what we do. look at Pat's layout and then look at yours. look at how he balanced the layout, used color and fonts to tell people what to expect from this business. look online at logos for this type of buiness to get a feel as to what others of the same service have done.
not paying attention to that at all on the oval is the problem. to learn you have to pay attention to what you do and why it doesn't work. you can learn a lot from the members here as we do share what we have learned. keep trying and posting and with each post, you may start to see what we do. look at Pat's layout and then look at yours. look at how he balanced the layout, used color and fonts to tell people what to expect from this business. look online at logos for this type of buiness to get a feel as to what others of the same service have done.
AmyW
New Member
Another try on the oval. (I know you advised against it but I really like the shape, and it works really nicely the way Jillbeans did so I'm trying to follow her example)
Is the curved text on the bottom still a bad idea? (I swiped the "massage" to get the font in there for now and will buy it if we go with this one. Same with the hands)
ETA: not sure what happend to the border, somehow it didn't convert to jpg nicely
Is the curved text on the bottom still a bad idea? (I swiped the "massage" to get the font in there for now and will buy it if we go with this one. Same with the hands)
ETA: not sure what happend to the border, somehow it didn't convert to jpg nicely
Attachments
AmyW
New Member
Hopefully you're not all fed up with me yet 
I'm so grateful for your time and advice.
I want to show her two options to choose from, so trying to get the rectangle/tree one looking better now, but it's feeling more like a biz card than a sign and I don't know how to fix that. Any advice?
I'm so grateful for your time and advice.I want to show her two options to choose from, so trying to get the rectangle/tree one looking better now, but it's feeling more like a biz card than a sign and I don't know how to fix that. Any advice?
Attachments
John Butto
New Member
So you go to Massage Therapy School for a while, I don't know maybe 6 months or so, and get a degree. You want to hang out a shingle and start a business. You get someone who is a newbie to make your sign and they put clip art together and some fonts and they get the information within 24 hours on how to do it. I am not making this up, it just happened. No wonder there is no respect for sign people anymore. I should write a book "Sign Scrapbooking". Anyone can do it, we take someone else's artwork in the form of clipart or rework someones art, some fonts and presto. Do not, I repeat, do not ever complain about people cutting prices and hacks down the street anymore. Come on, this use to be a business for a select few with talent and it has gone the way with honest politicians. I feel like I'm stuck on Zombi Sign World and have to run and hide so as not to be bitten. And this is not a slam on the poster looking for help, it is just the truth on what is happening to our business. We are below massage therapist on the food chain.
bob
It's better to have two hands than one glove.
Use the LHF Stevens Percepta that Jillbeans used, or one like it, for the sans serif text. I would have gone a bit heavier than she but that's me. The point is that this particular face looks like it's hand lettered. The slight but delicious concavities on the vertical and horizontal strokes and the subtle thickness variation on the curves. Good stuff. The sans face you chose looks more at home on a highway off-ramp sign indicating the route to the local home for the mentally indisposed.
It doesn't look a damn bit better curved along the bottom.
Stop the contrived cuteness with the border. If you want a border use a border, not a poor attempt at an optical illusion. If it were me I might try a double border, heavier outside, lighter inside.
The hands...Well at least one of them resembles a hand, the other a piece of wood washed up on a beach. Anyway, they are too light and way too detailed relative to the other elements. If you must have hands, or some other body part, try to make them the same weight as perhaps the border and make them stylized. No one wants to see fingernails and finger joint wrinkles.
Marlene
New Member
your last oval isn't too bad. the hands aren't helping the sign I think it is hurting it as it makes it hard to read. you would be better off with a nice branch of a tree then those hands.
now on to the other option. go into your font menu and delete that horrid Papyrus, Brush Script, Old English and Comic Sans, do it now!!!!
now on to the other option. go into your font menu and delete that horrid Papyrus, Brush Script, Old English and Comic Sans, do it now!!!!
Always work off customer's request- incorporate the tree
-Always work off the customer's request and incorporate the tree. If you do not incorporate the customer's initial ideas in sign design you are telling them that they are unable to convey their business passion. If they agree to have you convey their passion and their business tanks, what are they gonna do? Blame that stupid sign that you created that did not reflect their passion.
I think the tree idea works for her business. It must be strong and convey shade and relaxation. A half silhouette of an old oak or maple on the left side reaching over the top of an oval sign would work.
Try to convince her to make her name- or better- just her last name the title on the sign. Massage Therapy as a title is too common. It should be the sub title. Remember- one word signs are strongest, two lines of text may be needed, three lines of text risks loss of interest and four or more lines of text may cause instant repulsion.
The script fonts are cool but they are very common for the "wellness" industry.
A script font would compliment and match an old shade tree graphic- use her personal signature of last name and make it legible.
An elongated sans serif font for sub title. - Stretched lettering conveys relaxation.
Just hope her signature is some what vertical to contrast the horizontal tree. Ha Ha.
Good Luck.
-Always work off the customer's request and incorporate the tree. If you do not incorporate the customer's initial ideas in sign design you are telling them that they are unable to convey their business passion. If they agree to have you convey their passion and their business tanks, what are they gonna do? Blame that stupid sign that you created that did not reflect their passion.
I think the tree idea works for her business. It must be strong and convey shade and relaxation. A half silhouette of an old oak or maple on the left side reaching over the top of an oval sign would work.
Try to convince her to make her name- or better- just her last name the title on the sign. Massage Therapy as a title is too common. It should be the sub title. Remember- one word signs are strongest, two lines of text may be needed, three lines of text risks loss of interest and four or more lines of text may cause instant repulsion.
The script fonts are cool but they are very common for the "wellness" industry.
A script font would compliment and match an old shade tree graphic- use her personal signature of last name and make it legible.
An elongated sans serif font for sub title. - Stretched lettering conveys relaxation.
Just hope her signature is some what vertical to contrast the horizontal tree. Ha Ha.
Good Luck.