System OS upgrades

[Tony Teveris]

Just a note that people should be thinking about if they have not already and that is new computers or their computer's operating system upgrade.

The next release of Omega will ONLY operate on Microsoft W2K or XP. Why, well it is just too much work to support the older systems for one and as the newer OSs come out there are features we like to take advantage of that make the overall system better. I know for some this is a real PITA but in the end it is better for all of us.

 

[Arlo Kalon 2.0]

Dang Tony! And just the other day I posted about wonderin' if ANY sign program worked on Linux! Got ticked off at Billie Gates when he wanted me to spend $84 for another SEAT on my XP because I tried to activate it again when I hadda rebuild a computer to get my new Omega workin'. Well, anyway, I won when I chatted with 'em on their Bhopal, India hotline. And the upcoming releases of Omega have features that ARE well worth the upgrade... it's just that I have finally gotten bone tired of MS. Does Omega work on Macs?

 

[Bobby H]

The Win 2K and XP limit on graphics software is not such a new development. Most of the major graphics applications on the market now demand a minimum of Windows 2000 or XP to run. The newest releases from Adobe, Macromedia and Corel fall into that category. Some applications won't even run on WindowsXP Home (such as a number of major CAD and 3D apps).

As for Linux, don't hold your breath waiting for major graphics titles to port there. Two big problems stand in the way. 1: there are too many variants of Linux. 2: much of the Linux user base wants everything "open source" (read: free).

 

[Techman]

WindowsXP Home (such as a number of major CAD and 3D apps).

Could you name one or two? I would like to why they do not..

Because XP home is not much different from XP pro ,, other than certain networking elements such as VPN server ability. And a few other tidbits..

As far as open source in Linux. there is one goal they have and that is to have the ability to run M$ office products. Its just a matter of time before this goal is met.



Techman

 

[Derf]

I Love my MACs Tiger Rocks

I guess I like my Red Headed stepchild Win XP pro PC too its jut that with the PCs you have to be some what more savvy to make them work well. Death to the (help you do every thing) wizards and the dog that helps you find things. I hate that stupid dog.. so I got rid of it

Sorry just had to through that out!

 

[Bobby H]

Could you name one or two? I would like to why they do not..

Alias|Wavefront Maya is one app I know for a fact will not load under WinXP Home. That goes for both the "Personal Learning Edition" and commercial versions.

Previous releases of AutoCAD and Studio3D Max would not work under WinXP Home, but the latest releases will (strangely enough).

Softimage|XSI will not run under WinXP Home.

Bentley Microstation requires Win2000 or XP Pro.

Catia V5 requires Win2000 or XP Pro.

There's more applications I could add to the list, but I think that's enough to illustrate the point.

Because XP home is not much different from XP pro ,, other than certain networking elements such as VPN server ability. And a few other tidbits..

XP Home can't network to any more than 5 PCs, and doesn't network well with various other flavors of Windows. Most families setting up home networks are doing so with a mix of old and new machines. XP Pro will network better to old Win98SE, WinME and Win2000 machines (not to mention a Mac here or there). XP Home does not support symmetric multiprocessing. So that makes it a pretty bad choice if you load it into a new system with a dual core processor. It doesn't handle memory as well, and on and on. Basically, it's garbage.

The thing I can't understand is this, if WinXP Home and Pro both look and feel very much alike why would any user load the cruddy version onto their machine? Even if the choice is only to save a few bucks, it's still a bad choice. IMHO, Microsoft shouldn't even be selling that version of XP at all.

As far as open source in Linux. there is one goal they have and that is to have the ability to run M$ office products. Its just a matter of time before this goal is met.

Emulation is still emulation...and it stinks for a large part. I'm only going to run a Linux based machine or a machine running some other variant of UNIX only if all my applications can run natively on it. Some of those 3D and CAD apps I listed can actually do that. But Adobe, Corel and Macromedia don't have any plans to port their graphics titles to Linux. Adobe reaffirmed their intentions to develop only for Mac and Windows based systems.

 

[iSign]

I have 4 XP pro workstations, 2 are new purchases with XP Pro sp2 already loaded, one is XP pro that was reformatted & upgraded to XPpro sp2. The last one is still on sp1 & I like it the best. There is an odd issue with my old archive data discs that makes them more difficult to use & the sp1 machine seems to be the way around that issue. I would like to change one or more of the sp2 machines to sp1.

2 questions about that.

Can it be done at all without reloading all mt software & drivers etc??

If I own a (non-pre-installed) licensed version of XP sp1... but the CD is damaged... is there a way to get another one from M$ fopr the price of burning & shipping a disc and NOT the price of the whole dang $180 I already paid?

if not, I found XP Pro SP1 on the net for $180... does anyone know any M$ plans that would make paying $180 for SP1 a bad idea?

 

[Bobby H]

I don't think you can uninstall SP2 once it is successfully loaded onto a XP Pro computer. You can bail to SP1 during the upgrade process, but I think Windows gets rid of all the old files once the service pack is completely installed.

It is a pain to reformat and reinstall applications, but the process is now a lot more easy than it was in the past. You can boot the computer off the CD. Remember those days of having to use dopey 1.44MB floppies to boot up in DOS mode to reformat? Arrgh! System restore discs with most new name brand PCs (particularly those from Dell) simplify the process further. You don't have to turn the place upside down looking for old driver discs and such. Optical disc drives and hard drives are much faster, making the application reinstallation process go more quickly. Really, the biggest thing that takes up my time is figuring out which fonts I want to reinstall.

 

[Derf]

Yeah, you can uninstall SP2,

I had to, in order to get Flexi Sign Pro to not have a port error. you just go to the add/remove software icon and uninstall sp2.

Derf

 

[Yamalube]

I had to, in order to get Flexi Sign Pro to not have a port error. you just go to the add/remove software icon and uninstall sp2.

Derf

SP2 enables the personal firewall by default. You can add exceptions (open ports) as needed for specific software applications. You may also have to add program exceptions to allow specific programs to run. The firewall Icon is located in the control panel.

I think XP professional is a better platform for business applications. Home addition is geared more for use in the home.

 

[Techman]

I think its opinions verses XP home and XP PRO. At first the net was filled with concernes about Home vs Pro. Most concerns were not proved valid. It is now felt thta both versions are good softwares. And, are "about" the same as I mentioned above. I run XP home on every thing except my test machine which is XP PRO. I was using XP PRO when it was still in beta and in fact predicted several problems (that later proved correct) that would haunt signmakers..

Most of the problems people had was not due to home verses pro. The problems was within the OUTLOOK kernal...

Previous releases of AutoCAD and Studio3D Max would not work under WinXP Home,

Not necessarily true,
The problem with those softs was usually traced to the graphics capabilities on the older video cards.

Bentley Microstation still only asks for: Microsoft Windows® 2000 (SP2 or higher recommended*), Windows XP Professional, Windows NT® 4 (SP6 recommended*), Windows 98 (Second Edition recommended)**, Windows Me**, Windows XP Home Edition.

Catia V5 calls for Windows® 2000/XP Home Edition/XP Pro.

The problem with XP home and win 98 comunicating was "usually" that tcp/ip was not installed or configured correctly.

As far as 5 machine limitations I know of very few that need more than 5 machines. Even win 2K server was sold as a 5 seat license.

In the end, it loos like Home vs Pro will be debated until (longhorn) now named Vista is released.
The average user will not need anything more than XP home. The average user does not use VPN, or use more than 5 machines. The average user does not use dual processor machines either.

I predicted that SP2 was going to be a nightmare for signmakers long before it was released. A few posters here will remember when I posted that the SP2 fiasco was goona happen when they upgraded to SP2..

 

[Bobby H]

As far as 5 machine limitations I know of very few that need more than 5 machines. Even win 2K server was sold as a 5 seat license.

We have 5 desktop machines and a notebook computer just in our studio (there's 13 total in our shop). Our two oldest machines have Win98SE on them; the rest are Win2000 Pro and WinXP Pro. By mistake, Dell sent us one machine with XP Home loaded on it a couple years ago. It didn't work worth a squat on our network (it wouldn't see any of the Win98 and Win2000 machines). And that's on top of the fact all our network settings were set properly.

Win XP Home is simply and deliberately hamstrung with limitations. This doesn't have anything to do with multi-seat licenses either. A copy of WinXP Pro or Home edition sold OEM or over the counter for a normal computer install is only good for one computer, not five. The five computer limit I'm talking about has to do with the limit on networking. You can't network to more than 5 PCs with an XP Home based system, even if all the PCs have their own separate license of Windows. XP Home just doesn't work nearly as well in mixed operating system environments and environments with lots of computers as XP Pro (or Win 2000 for that matter).

The average user does not use dual processor machines either.

First, a computer used for designing signs, cutting vinyl, etc., is not an average use type of computer. With raster based graphics and digitally printed output getting ever more popular, as well as the growing popularity of motion and video graphics for electronic message centers, the use of dual processor or dual core machines is getting pretty darned important.

Also, Intel has it in its plans to phase out all single core processors it makes. Everything is eventually going dual core and multi-core. That means everyone is going to need an OS that supports symmetric multiprocessing and applications that are threaded to take advantage of the extra CPUs. To Adobe's credit, Photoshop has been multithreaded for more than a decade.

 

[Derf]

Did I say I love My MAC..... oh yeah I did!

But in a Dell ?????? I don't think so..However Dell Chairman Michael Dell has been interested in selling a Mac OS X Dell PC when Jobs announced the switch to Intel's chips. No word from Apple on this latest development.

 

[Bobby H]

The latest development on the "Mactel" front is Apple getting quite ornery toward a number of Mac-enthusiast websites. Apple ordered them to take down photos and video showing the Intel-based MacOSX developer kit software running on plain vanilla Intel based PCs. Apparently it didn't take much work for some hackers to get around the DRM chipset featured in the developer kit Intel based Macs.

The thing that will happen in the long run is Apple will eventually be selling the Intel version of OSX right off store shelves for anyone to put into their machines.

John Dvorak (from PC Magazine, etc.) put forth some quite plausible scenarios on how this would happen. Intel based Macs would have the restrictive chipset so only they could run the new OS right from the start. Hackers will get around it (as has already happened). This will actually give Apple some free product testing as curious users find out what works and what doesn't. Apple will be able to fix any problems and eventually release a product for the store shelves that has been well tested in the wild. Jobs will say, "we tried to keep it exclusive to Apple branded hardware, but now we're just giving the people what they want." Apple will end up looking good regardless.

The big thing I'm hoping for in the Mactel deal is the ability for an Intel based Mac to dual boot both Mac OSX and Win XP Pro. With that capability, I could keep using the Windows based software I've spent thousands of dollars on and then be able to buy Mac-only apps like Final Cut Pro.

 

[Techman]

A copy of WinXP Pro or Home edition sold OEM or over the counter for a normal computer install is only good for one computer, not five.

ya tell me all about it.. BLAH BLAH BLAH.... I think i'll go write a few more XP drivers to releive the stress.