Thank god for old thread!

[GypsyGraphics]

Thank god for old threads!

I received an email today from an old client that I haven't heard from since early 2010. Normally my response to an email that reads "we're in a pinch and need your help" would be "nice to hear from you, how can I help." I knew that wasn't the right way to respond to this particular client, as I remembered it ending like a bad breakup. So I went in search of our last email communications to refresh my memory, before replying. I save all my business email but realized, having updated computers and changed email programs, going back to 2010 wasn't going to be as simple as hitting search.

… instead i logged onto s101, typed in Boopsie and hit search.

http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?61022-Client-s-email-leaves-me-at-a-loss-for-words&highlight=boopsie

THANK GOD FOR OLD THREADS!

That was no bad breakup… it was an ugly divorce. What’s that saying about the definition of “stupid?”
There's not a chance in hell i’m marrying them again!

 

[iSign]

Oh, thought this was gonna be about a favorite perfectly faded old pair of blue jeans

 

[GAC05]

I thought this was going to be about questionable fashion choices from our formative years.
But still a good cautionary tale.

wayne k
guam usa

 

[Rick]

Is this about clothing? Wait, the day I take off work
and I missed a wardrobe malfunction?!?

So I leave you alone for one day and this is what happens...
having seen the other designers layout, I can see you
wanting to help them... but after reading that post all the
way through again...

RUUUUNNNN!!!!

 

[GypsyGraphics]

i do have old jeans from my formative years.... and if i tried to wear them.... there surely would be a wardrobe malfunction.

but taking on this client again would be a brain malfunction.... no matter how much it kills me to see that hideous layout!
(i think they knew seeing another designer massacring it would drive me crazy)

 

[Suz]

Oh goodness! I got a call like that last night, after 8pm... Started with an apology for calling so late, then asking me to "send over a photo" he sent me a couple years ago. I was going to do it until he explained that he wanted the version of the photo with all the stuff I added, like lettering and graphics. Yikes!

So, feeling your pain this morning!

 

[Billct2]

I just said somewhere that some loser clients have no memory or conscience and when they've burned through all the other vendors your turn will come up again.

 

[GypsyGraphics]

wow pat... you seriously read through that whole thread? even i couldn't bring myself to read all of it... just enough to refresh my memory and be reminded of some of the great advice that was given. but, like you... felt the anxiety... all over again.

as for the saga starting all over again.... i still haven't responded to the email. i'm trying to decide if ignoring it all together is best or respond saying i'm not available. what i feel like i want to do... is probably not a good idea buuuuutttt.... i want to offer a few suggestions for them to pass on to the designer at the magazine, that would at least improve their full page ad, as they only have one revision.

i'm still questioning if that would be a professional and considerate way to reply or just opening a can of worms.


suz.... i was just asking someone about you the other day!
you sound like me.... your initial reaction is to be helpful, until you realize your about to be taken advantage of.

bill... you hit the nail on the head... "loser clients have no memory." in bob recent email, you'd think we were on great terms.


Gigi – Boopsie is in a pinch and needs your help. Can you do anything with this full page add, and if so, what would it cost? It is going into a nice publication and she is paying for a full page, but their graphic designer does not have anywhere near your skills!

Please let me know.
Thank you.
Bob

 

[Billct2]

I'd just politely decline because I have too much of a backlog to take care of it.
No suggestions, no referrals no nothing. except NO!

 

[iSign]

"I can't really afford the time any more than you have typically been able to afford covering me for it, but if I was paying for a full page ad, I'd certainly recognize the value of investing $500 to get the most return on my advertising investment.

If you do intend to invest at least that much, I think your current layout could be made far more effective"

This doesn't say you would be willing to help, but does get a few points made... perhaps

 

[Rick]

Stop looking at the layout!

Broom them fast!

YOU KEEP LOOKING AT IT!!! STOP!!!!

They left another message... buttering her up with compliments,
then asking that if she can't get to it, if she knows anyone starting
out (meaning real cheap) that has time (meaning real fast)...

It would be fun to show up the other designer (who has a degree
at a prestigious design school) and make a quick few hundred
dollars...

So after all the back and forth today, I just asked her... 'without judging
you, do you want to do the job'... she confesses "yeeessssss"

Stay tuned for another episode of "SUCKA DESIGNA"

(I'm thinking I just got sucka'd too)

 

[iSign]

what i feel like i want to do... is probably not a good idea buuuuutttt.... i want to offer a few suggestions for them to pass on to the designer at the magazine, that would at least improve their full page ad, as they only have one revision.

Happy October gg!
I hope this thread finds you and your family well. I see your PITA radar is continuing to serve you well!

I hear praises of your client firing skills repeatedly. I remember when you first started posting here, the "fire often & fire early" approach hadn't yet been honed to the fine art it's become today!

Your time management & dignity maintenance skill sets have come a long way and it is gratifying to see how successful your self preservation talents have gotten you. Congrats!

Listen, could you please fire Boopsie in a format that we can all read about & enjoy?
Her businesses cannot afford to pay & even though they are "happy to compensate you" ...well, they can't afford to

Anyway, fighting fire with fire... I decided to appeal to the "flattery may get you somewhere" liability that occurs in human nature from time to time!

 

[GypsyGraphics]

YOU KEEP LOOKING AT IT!!! STOP!!!!

.... So after all the back and forth today, I just asked her... 'without judging
you, do you want to do the job'... she confesses "yeeessssss"

I CAN'T STOP.... it's like watching a train wreck. look away, look back, look away

and i didn't say i was GOING to do it... i confessed that YES (i wanted to stop the train wreck)!


a few more confessions....
1) YES, i get a kick out of showing up hoity-toity designers
2) HATE HATE HATE seeing any portion of my work in a baaaad layout
3) really really HATE being buttered up (& don't for one minute buy it)
4) really really LOVE getting a REAL positive and unrehearsed client's response to my work
(a recent favorite... upon seeing a mock up of a menu and funky cool menu holder was told i was "bomb-diggity")

 

[GypsyGraphics]

I hear praises of your client firing skills repeatedly. I remember when you first started posting here, the "fire often & fire early" approach hadn't yet been honed to the fine art it's become today!

wait what???????
oooooh iiii get it.... sarcasm.

 

[GypsyGraphics]

Well since he introduced the concept about COST himself....I would just quote it (including PITA tax of course) and tell him what kind of turnaround you're looking at.

that's pretty much what i did (kinda sorta)

I'd just politely decline because I have too much of a backlog to take care of it.
No suggestions, no referrals no nothing. except NO!

yeah yeah... i kinda sorta did that too!

really really... i didn't do the sucka designa thing!
i was sympathetic but fake hard-nosed... all legit-n-sh!t. hehe
really... you believe me don't ya?

 

[Rick]

I CAN'T STOP.... it's like watching a train wreck. look away, look back, look away

and i didn't say i was GOING to do it... i confessed that YES (i wanted to stop the train wreck)!


a few more confessions....
1) YES, i get a kick out of showing up hoity-toity designers
2) HATE HATE HATE seeing any portion of my work in a baaaad layout
3) really really HATE being buttered up (& don't for one minute buy it)
4) really really LOVE getting a REAL positive and unrehearsed client's response to my work
(a recent favorite... upon seeing a mock up of a menu and funky cool menu holder was told i was "bomb-diggity")

You know what happens when you try to stop a train wreck...

I think your solution was the best way to have handled this...
having the client research what they want, and then throwing it back
on the other designer for another round was the best way to go about it...

Since we live in a small city (for California) any negative comments might
make it difficult to get local work. We guys can have a harsh approach...
it's definitely to our favor that you are able to soften the edges.

 

[GypsyGraphics]

well i must have done something right... i got a nice thank you from Bob... and they're doing exactly what i suggested.

cool... got to be nice, helpful, and hopefully won't have to see my logo work in a gawd-awful ad. i told them i'd like to see how the redesign turns out,
but i suspect i won't hear from them again until they're in another "pinch."

 

[iSign]

wait what???????
oooooh iiii get it.... sarcasm.

well, not exactly sarcasm... or not just that...

before you posted about "buttering up" and how you never buy it...
...theories were put forth that there might be a chance it was starting to wear you down, towards helping them...

...so I was trying to put equal pressure into supporting the "NO sayer" in you, to help you keep saying NO

 

[copythat]

: )

Thanks for the read. I am a hoarder. I keep separate files on a removable hard drive. I've had those clients (PITA's) I've been told by a few that they demand their artwork they paid for, and that they will tell "AHEM" BBB about me or they will sue...:ROFLMAO:...well that annoys me. We have a section in all correspondence to any order that says.

"To keep our top quality design affordable, we retain rights to the finished design. If you require a copy of the files, an adjusted creative service and archive fee will apply"

So I have no problem sending them high res PDF's, as long as it's paid for first. But no the bucks stops there.



Sign Up!

 

[GypsyGraphics]

well, not exactly sarcasm... or not just that...

before you posted about "buttering up" and how you never buy it...
...theories were put forth that there might be a chance it was starting to wear you down, towards helping them...

theories schmeries
if they'd have shown me the layout and asked what they should do, they'd have gotten an intimidate response. it was the BSBU (BS Butter UP) that made me not want to help at all. i had to take the BSBU out of the equation to respond in a way that i felt was professional.

i didn't redesign their ad, i simply replied to their email with constructive criticism and suggested they give the designer better direction with samples of what they were hoping to achieve.

i don't think that makes me a sucka designa... i think it was good business.

 

[GypsyGraphics]

I've had those clients (PITA's) I've been told by a few that they demand their artwork they paid for, and that they will tell "AHEM" BBB about me or they will sue...:ROFLMAO:...well that annoys me.

what really gets me is clients saying, i should be using Word for layouts, so clients can edit their files. and suggest that using InDesign is just a way to make them have to come back for edits.

i don't know what's funnier...
thinking i should use Word :ROFLMAO:
or
thinking the native files are "theirs" :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

 

[Rick]

After all this...

I WANNA KNOW WHAT THE NEW LAYOUT LOOKS LIKEAAAAAAA!!!!