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What would you charge?
- Thread starter sdnj
- Start date
MtnView
New Member
You said you had come to an agreement on price. Sounds like it was based on cut vinyl. There won't be any repercussions for the client blocking the viewing area with that much vinyl?
We do the full window for $70 all one color. Add two more colors, I be
at about $95. I give repeat customers a little brake.
Gino, Are you sure about that being illegal? If that's so why are some
service vans made with no back window at all? I think if you have
rearview mirrors you can black out the entire back glass if you want.
Just seems curious.
at about $95. I give repeat customers a little brake.
Gino, Are you sure about that being illegal? If that's so why are some
service vans made with no back window at all? I think if you have
rearview mirrors you can black out the entire back glass if you want.
Just seems curious.
MtnView
New Member
After the mention of cargo vans with no rear windows I looked up Michigan law. I found this. I did not post the entire document. If you only had one outside rearview mirror on the drivers side you would probably be SOL but two mirrors are pretty much standard these days.
MICHIGAN VEHICLE CODE (EXCERPT)
Act 300 of 1949
257.709 Windshields and windows; prohibitions; rearview mirrors; exceptions; windshield wipers; exemption; hot air windshield defroster or electrically heated windshield or other device; windshield device; definitions.Sec. 709.
(1) A person shall not operate a motor vehicle with any of the following:
(a) A sign, poster, nontransparent material, window application, reflective film, or nonreflective film upon or in the front windshield, the side windows immediately adjacent to the driver or front passenger, or the sidewings adjacent to and forward of the driver or front passenger, except that a tinted film may be used along the top edge of the windshield and the side windows or sidewings immediately adjacent to the driver or front passenger if the material does not extend more than 4 inches from the top of the windshield, or lower than the shade band, whichever is closer to the top of the windshield.
(b) A rear window or side window to the rear of the driver composed of, covered by, or treated with a material that creates a total solar reflectance of 35% or more in the visible light range, including a silver or gold reflective film.
(c) An object that obstructs the vision of the driver of the vehicle, except as authorized by law.
(2) A person shall not drive a motor vehicle if driver visibility through the rear window is obstructed, unless the vehicle is equipped with 2 rearview mirrors, 1 on each side, adjusted so that the operator has a clear view of the highway behind the vehicle.
(3) This section does not apply to any of the following:
(a) The use of draperies, louvers, or other special window treatments, except those specifically designated in this section, on the rear window, or a side window to the rear of the driver if the vehicle is equipped with 2 outside rearview mirrors, 1 on each side, adjusted so that the driver has a clear view of the highway behind the vehicle.
MICHIGAN VEHICLE CODE (EXCERPT)
Act 300 of 1949
257.709 Windshields and windows; prohibitions; rearview mirrors; exceptions; windshield wipers; exemption; hot air windshield defroster or electrically heated windshield or other device; windshield device; definitions.Sec. 709.
(1) A person shall not operate a motor vehicle with any of the following:
(a) A sign, poster, nontransparent material, window application, reflective film, or nonreflective film upon or in the front windshield, the side windows immediately adjacent to the driver or front passenger, or the sidewings adjacent to and forward of the driver or front passenger, except that a tinted film may be used along the top edge of the windshield and the side windows or sidewings immediately adjacent to the driver or front passenger if the material does not extend more than 4 inches from the top of the windshield, or lower than the shade band, whichever is closer to the top of the windshield.
(b) A rear window or side window to the rear of the driver composed of, covered by, or treated with a material that creates a total solar reflectance of 35% or more in the visible light range, including a silver or gold reflective film.
(c) An object that obstructs the vision of the driver of the vehicle, except as authorized by law.
(2) A person shall not drive a motor vehicle if driver visibility through the rear window is obstructed, unless the vehicle is equipped with 2 rearview mirrors, 1 on each side, adjusted so that the operator has a clear view of the highway behind the vehicle.
(3) This section does not apply to any of the following:
(a) The use of draperies, louvers, or other special window treatments, except those specifically designated in this section, on the rear window, or a side window to the rear of the driver if the vehicle is equipped with 2 outside rearview mirrors, 1 on each side, adjusted so that the driver has a clear view of the highway behind the vehicle.
Gino
Premium Subscriber
The way it was explained to me was.... if you have windows, you have to be capable of seeing through them 100% unless you use vehicle perf. Opaque vinyl, regardless of size or color will not be tolerated.
Do people do it ?? They sure do. Do they get caught ?? Yes, sometimes if you get a p!ssy cop or inspection station.
Comparing it to a van without rear or side windows, well, that was always my question. Again, their response was, no window, you can't see out to begin with so you are free to do as you like.
If you are backing up and a kid on a tricycle is passing by your rear end, your vinyl just might put him in a blind spot and then it's too late after the thud. Without windows.... well, our van has no side or rear windows, but we have a television backup system in place which is actually better than any mirror setup you could possibly have. It also aids in parallel parking. For those people without camera systems, they just have to have a routine of checking and being real sure of themselves before backing up.
I don't know if this is the law in all states, but I was led to believe it is pretty much the same across the board countrywide.
Do people do it ?? They sure do. Do they get caught ?? Yes, sometimes if you get a p!ssy cop or inspection station.
Comparing it to a van without rear or side windows, well, that was always my question. Again, their response was, no window, you can't see out to begin with so you are free to do as you like.
If you are backing up and a kid on a tricycle is passing by your rear end, your vinyl just might put him in a blind spot and then it's too late after the thud. Without windows.... well, our van has no side or rear windows, but we have a television backup system in place which is actually better than any mirror setup you could possibly have. It also aids in parallel parking. For those people without camera systems, they just have to have a routine of checking and being real sure of themselves before backing up.
I don't know if this is the law in all states, but I was led to believe it is pretty much the same across the board countrywide.
I guess we will find out if NJ DMV has a problem with it when he goes for his next inspection.
Gino
Premium Subscriber
Ahhhhh........ that is not the correct response, not at all.
If you put it on, you are the one responsible for knowing the laws or not. Not him. He can ask for copyrighted logos all day long. You are the one with the responsibility of saying, NO.
It always falls back on the person producing, installing or duplicating this stuff. Just because we have machines, the internet and know-how, does not equate to the right to do something wrong.
There are many here who will tell you to just do it, get paid and take your chances. If that's how ya wanna run a business, then why is it everyone wants to sue a doctor when they do something wrong ?? Higher stakes ?? That shouldn't matter. You're supposed to know your livelihood, plain & simple.
Last question. Are you a professional ?? Careful how you answer that. The real answer is someone who gets paid for what they do is considered a professional by most standards. Having full knowledge is part of that protocol. 
Imo
$185 installed. A little more than most of my local competition, but you want to weed out the cheap customers that will be coming back for you to letter a happy birthday balloon with PSL. (Actually happened to me)
We got to a point in our shop where we would make our minimum order $75. (Unless a good repeat cust. or special circumstance). And that was while working at one of the national chains which shall remain nameless. (former job)
80/20 rule. 80% of your work will get you 20% of your profit. While 20% of your work gets 80% of your profit. Before you know it, this guy will have you re-designing the logo and picking out a specific color that you don't have in-stock, 3 proofs back and forth, etc. etc.
I have learned over time, it is best to get your price out there ($185) and stop worrying about it. You'll waste more time trying to use calandered vinyl to save $20 on the quote, or making it a little smaller to save on material, etc.
Quote your price, back it up with good products and service, and get competitive on the real money makers where someone is giving you all the signage for their new business, or 20 vehicles, etc.
That's my 2¢.
Go Team!
$185 installed. A little more than most of my local competition, but you want to weed out the cheap customers that will be coming back for you to letter a happy birthday balloon with PSL. (Actually happened to me)
We got to a point in our shop where we would make our minimum order $75. (Unless a good repeat cust. or special circumstance). And that was while working at one of the national chains which shall remain nameless. (former job)
80/20 rule. 80% of your work will get you 20% of your profit. While 20% of your work gets 80% of your profit. Before you know it, this guy will have you re-designing the logo and picking out a specific color that you don't have in-stock, 3 proofs back and forth, etc. etc.
I have learned over time, it is best to get your price out there ($185) and stop worrying about it. You'll waste more time trying to use calandered vinyl to save $20 on the quote, or making it a little smaller to save on material, etc.
Quote your price, back it up with good products and service, and get competitive on the real money makers where someone is giving you all the signage for their new business, or 20 vehicles, etc.
That's my 2¢.
Go Team!
Gino
Premium Subscriber
So, you have a van with windows in the two rear doors and two side mirrors. You even have a rear-view mirror in the middle of your windshield. You are parked in a customer's driveway beside their house. You have completed your task, gotten into the van, turned the ignition over and look in your left mirror, then the right mirror and you don't bother with the mirror in the windshield, because you can't see out the back with all the vinyl and carpet you have there, you know it's senseless to do so. You back up and hear a moan and then you feel a thud. Whether you stop or keep on going, whose fault is it if there was a 6 year old kid playing directly in back of your truck ??
Locals Find!
New Member
Charge as much as your client is willing to pay that will make you a decent profit to keep your shop open and your market will bear.
The opinions on here are based on others experiences, expenses, and markets. Their is no one price fits all model.
The opinions on here are based on others experiences, expenses, and markets. Their is no one price fits all model.
Locals Find!
New Member
I hope people would have enough sense to actually check what is behind their vehicle before getting into it with or without a rearview mirror. Even with a mirror you might not see that kid. A mirror shouldn't replace your eyeballs and some basic common sense.
Gino
Premium Subscriber
tell that to the guy who just covered up his rear window with decals and crap. Now, you have no chance.
Of course [or at least let's hope], people look behind their vehicles when backing up/out, but how easy is it for a little kid or a dog or whatever to just meander there after you did your visual check after you got into the car ?? It's an accident. No sense trying to make it even harder with decals and whatnot.
Techman
New Member
It does???
Not where I've been. An illegal tint or graphics is removed on the spot by the operator of the vehicle if the vehicle was stopped for some reason. Never once in many years that I am aware of was a supplier held for applying anything to a vehicle window.
Furthermore..
In Michigan as pointed out above it is not illegal to cover a back window or the rear side windows.
In reading a summary of state requirements. As mentioned above in most states SUV's and vans are allowed to have the back and side windows covered.
Many states say..
Does not prohibit labels, stickers, decalcomania, or informational signs on motor vehicles or the application of tinted or solar screening material.. Blah blah..
Many states say,,, Any high-mounted rear stoplight shall not be obstructed in any manner.
In PENN,,, No person may drive any motor vehicle with any sunscreening device or other material which does not permit a person to see or view the inside of the vehicle through the windshield, side wing, or side window of the vehicle... Nothing about the rear window???
In Summary, It would be wise to consult the local state laws governing rear windows and side panels rather than accept some rantings on a website. And the operator is held responsible for anything illegal on a window. This stuff is so easy to look up .
As for charging? In 1998 I got about $90 bux a window for 3 sides of anything of reasonable coverage. So getting 100 bux today would be way too low. It is irrelevant as to how much the materials cost or how long it took.
DropZoneSpec
New Member
I personally charge .10/sq in for calendared vinyl, Oracal 651. I charge $60 an hour and $25 setup fee. Between my sq in charge and setup, that covers my time on something that basic, and my waste. I charge a 1 hour minimum, so based on rough guesstimates from your pic, I'd be at the $150 area..10/sq in hasn't failed me yet, and I charge accordingly based on difficulty of the decal; those large letters would be cut, weeded and masked in minutes, so sometimes I'll go to .07...my 2cents.
boxerbay
New Member
it all depends on who you are as a printer and the kind of work you have. we do a lot of larger orders B2B. if this guy walks in I would bid it higher because if they agree to the job its going to pull my crew off larger more profitable jobs for this one off job.
also, what kind of watch or shoes is he wearing? that affects price. hahaha.
also, what kind of watch or shoes is he wearing? that affects price. hahaha.
