Pippin Decals
New Member
I have the desktop version as well..zero cost.
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About Subscription Software...
- Thread starter GTracer
- Start date
If I had received the OP's lengthy response email, they would lose my business. It tells me they don't see past their software, and possibly do not understand all the business interactions. A lecture on license, versus software totally misses the point. If savings in production pays for the subscription, why would that also not pay for a non-subscription license?
If a software package has a non-expiring license, I have control over it. I can restrict its updates/patches for the most part, and it would not upgrade versions on its own. Subscriptions seem to remove all of that control. That can be a big issue if you have macros running on a version, or you have scripts written that interact with the software. An untested upgrade can completely wreck the production flow and force immediate action or cause problems at a later date when some out of cycle event occurs. Upgrades tend to add and remove features, move buttons, etc. This adds delay in the production beat rate if I have to hunt for where a button went, or discover the function making what I did easy is now removed. This affects the total cost of ownership that was not acknowledged. Imagine meeting with a customer and now have to fumble through the "latest and greatest" since that version dropped and installed over a weekend. What a way to impress your customers.
Equating subscriptions to payroll for an employee is ridiculous. The employee has skin in the game, and generally I would be either their only source, or second source of income. SW vendor would have hundreds or thousands of income streams, counting each customer separately. If they lose my business, the CEO would not worry about their next paycheck. They are not going to do anything out of plan to help me. If I need an employee to improve, or do something different, I have a chance of giving them incentive's to change. Not so in SW, unless they have less than 100 customers. Ha, I'd would say SW upgrades are like employees that are using: one day they are great, then overnight become less reliable, defiant, or won't work without some intervention.
To me, staying in business is all about having controls in place to maintain revenue. I'd rather pay more for control over SW, for there are plenty of other things I have no control over.
If a software package has a non-expiring license, I have control over it. I can restrict its updates/patches for the most part, and it would not upgrade versions on its own. Subscriptions seem to remove all of that control. That can be a big issue if you have macros running on a version, or you have scripts written that interact with the software. An untested upgrade can completely wreck the production flow and force immediate action or cause problems at a later date when some out of cycle event occurs. Upgrades tend to add and remove features, move buttons, etc. This adds delay in the production beat rate if I have to hunt for where a button went, or discover the function making what I did easy is now removed. This affects the total cost of ownership that was not acknowledged. Imagine meeting with a customer and now have to fumble through the "latest and greatest" since that version dropped and installed over a weekend. What a way to impress your customers.
Equating subscriptions to payroll for an employee is ridiculous. The employee has skin in the game, and generally I would be either their only source, or second source of income. SW vendor would have hundreds or thousands of income streams, counting each customer separately. If they lose my business, the CEO would not worry about their next paycheck. They are not going to do anything out of plan to help me. If I need an employee to improve, or do something different, I have a chance of giving them incentive's to change. Not so in SW, unless they have less than 100 customers. Ha, I'd would say SW upgrades are like employees that are using: one day they are great, then overnight become less reliable, defiant, or won't work without some intervention.
To me, staying in business is all about having controls in place to maintain revenue. I'd rather pay more for control over SW, for there are plenty of other things I have no control over.
No subscription for me no matter how much someone talks about it.
I am sick of the monthly payment gerbil wheel. It keeps getting bigger and heavier, and I have to run harder and faster to keep it spinning. Bills bills bill. Now software vampires think they are going to sink their teeth into me? No way. I want to reduce my monthly expenses.
I am sick of the monthly payment gerbil wheel. It keeps getting bigger and heavier, and I have to run harder and faster to keep it spinning. Bills bills bill. Now software vampires think they are going to sink their teeth into me? No way. I want to reduce my monthly expenses.
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I also do not like programs that update or upgrade all by themselves. That is why Graphic Tracer notifies you that a free update or an upgrade is available. You get to decide if an when you would like to run it.
Software, like any other tool is intended to make things easier and replace tedious work done by an employee. For example, one man with a chainsaw could possibly replace the work of ten men using axes. I understand from reading this thread that there are people that will not to rent a chainsaw to cut wood for a variety of stated reasons such as... They don't like to pay rent and are upset they can't outright "own" the tool, or they are afraid that sometime down the road they might not be able to get gas to run it, or they feel that they might become too dependent upon the "new technology" if they have to go back to using an axe again.
The value of a tool, like an employee is not found in what it cost you, but in what it brings in increased production. At the end of the day, was the bottom line greater with the tool than without it? Any tool has to enable you to bring in more revenue than it cost, otherwise it is just taking up space in the toolbox.
Staying in business is also about being able to compete in the marketplace... being able to provide your customers with the best product at the best price.
The Graphic Powers team is committed to providing you with tools that will help your business be more profitable in a competitive marketplace.
If the salesman told me I could replace 10 men with 1 guy using a chainsaw, but he'll only rent me the chainsaw... I would say no. If I didn't need them 10 men, they'd be let go since I had the chainsaw. Then in 5 years, when Mr Chainsaw renter tells me his chainsaw is worth more now than it was 5 years ago, and the price is now 5x what it used to be, I can either pay his fee, or give the chainsaw back and have to re-train 10 guys on how to do the job which no one can do anymore because I Automated the task... I kind of have no choice if I took him up on his initial offer.
It's the same reason why people don't buy hardware that's not supported well. This $20,000 printer may be better than this 50,000 in every way... But it's made by some guy from who knows where. So in a year when my 20,0000 printer busts down... There's 20,000 in the drain.
You can raise your prices, you can disappear and close up shop... And everyone who relies on and is used to GT would be stranded.
If you make a good product, and you put in upgrades people actually want or need... they'll pay for upgrades. I'd never buy a subscription software unless I had no choice. With Adobe products theres no alternatives... With Gtracer there is, with Flexi they give an option of monthly or one time fee.
You keep saying its better for the customer to have it this way... But if you really believed you were doing it for them, you'd give them the choice of going sub or paying a one time fee. Subscription based software is a way to make more money, to keep a user on the hook to constantly pay... It's for software that coders know wont have any meaningful updates worth paying for.
Going to a monthly fee is a smart move for you, for what Gtracer is. I'm not going to say you'd make more money selling it as a single license... I'm sure in the long run you won't. Just don't keep trying to tell people this is for them, and saying because we dont want to spend more in the long run / risk stuff, we don't value our time.
Pippin Decals
New Member
Have you ever checked out Vector magic..?
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
I rarely auto trace. Some of the joy of this line of work is in doing a better job than the next guy and acquiring clients that can see the difference.
***YOUR OPINIONS MATTER***
We have decided to offer an opportunity to purchase a VIP Exclusive license for Graphic Tracer Professional. This is not a subscription! One price with free upgrades forever.
Check out www.graphicpowers.com
We are consistently improving... our new Graphic Tracer upgrade can now identify fonts in a variety of distortions.
In addition to that we are offering for a limited time a VIP exclusive lifetime plan. One price with free upgrades for life!
This plan is to satisfy those who do not wish to have a "monthly charge". You can check it out at www.graphicpowers.com
***Attention***
We have heard your opinion... our new Graphic Tracer upgrade can now identify fonts in a variety of distortions.
In addition to that we are offering for a limited time a VIP exclusive lifetime plan. One price with free upgrades for life!
This is NOT a subscription plan. This plan is to satisfy those who do not wish to have a "monthly charge".
You can check it out at www.graphicpowers.com
brycesteiner
New Member
One big issue with the subscription model is when it comes to hardware such as a cutter or a printer. You may be stuck with the RIP but will the license transfer? No it won't. If you had a permanent license it's no problem. You just sell the computer with the machine you're selling. The buyer won't be able to use it and it won't be setup anymore for jobs. It will be like starting over with out the setup/presets, etc.
Price is $495 usd.
In comparison vector.magic is $295. GT was more advanced when I tried.it... so it Could be worth the extra $200 .
Not too bad of a price if you vectorize a lot... I may redownload.it and test it again.
A little pricey for what it does(imo) but still much better than a monthly price. Having vector.magic already, and finding in doing most of our conversions by hand just for the practice experience, might be a bit too late for me to bite and purchase it!
Depends on how the font identifier is... the only thing I have issues with tracing is font. I can never get it to look as good as it should, I'd much prefer it identifying and using the font instead of.vectorizing it, so it may be worth it just for that.
Thanks for listening and offering an option of one time payment!
In comparison vector.magic is $295. GT was more advanced when I tried.it... so it Could be worth the extra $200 .
Not too bad of a price if you vectorize a lot... I may redownload.it and test it again.
A little pricey for what it does(imo) but still much better than a monthly price. Having vector.magic already, and finding in doing most of our conversions by hand just for the practice experience, might be a bit too late for me to bite and purchase it!
Depends on how the font identifier is... the only thing I have issues with tracing is font. I can never get it to look as good as it should, I'd much prefer it identifying and using the font instead of.vectorizing it, so it may be worth it just for that.
Thanks for listening and offering an option of one time payment!
Solventinkjet
DIY Printer Fixing Guide
I have heard through the grape vine that at least 1 Flexi sales guy has moved on from the company because they tied his compensation to the subscription plans and they didn't sell nearly as many as they thought they would. I'm not surprised based on people's opinions on signs101. Subscriptions are a good model for the software company because it produces residual income but it tends to piss off the customers. Honestly I don't know how you could run a software company selling one product and then having to support it for years after without any residual income coming in. I think they should make a free file opener that anyone can use for free and then the design and RIP features should be subscription. That way when your business stops, the payment stops but you can still open your old files.
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
Technically we all lease software. Even with a perpetual licensed commercial software, it's just different terms of said lease, but a lease none the less. If one does things on the up and up and observes and follows the EULA etc.
I can't speak for everyone, but for me, it's lack of control (and some of it is control people would expect me to be upset about, some of it may not be). That's the biggest thing that I don't like.
Pay for support, especially if it's a legacy version. Even with the perpetual licensed copy, the upgrade policy was a type of residual. It was an enticement to keep people to upgrade to the latest version without paying full price.
Also, just due to changes in tech, unless your a firm believer in VMs (I prefer VMs over keeping older hardware alive), you'll have to upgrade to the latest version eventually. Especially if you are a business. For a myriad of reasons not just tied to the vendor of the software in question. And this is coming from someone that loves using legacy software as I still run Office 4.2c (and a few DOS programs from '86, those being my oldest still running programs).
With regard to in bold, that happens with perpetual licenses as well. For the version of Adobe that I needed (needed, not want, difference), I could upgrade every generation and after 7 generations, I would be saving money versus spending more and that's with still getting every iteration afterward. They would have more money coming in (and I was the type that did by new every generation and not always do the upgrade price, but the full price), my business stopped, I would stop buying new version, but I would still be able to do all that I needed to do with my files.
I also do not like subscription, because I firmly believe that production computers should not have a WAN connection. Period. With the rolling release nature of Windows 10 (my dad is constantly having programs break on his computer and he is running the Enterprise version and we aren't talking even remotely niche software), which is essentially in a perpetual state of beta, even more of a reason not to be online for production rigs.
Although, I will say, at least with the local install, subscription software, the need for being online isn't as great, but for those programs that are web-based or need consistent internet connection for needed functionality, that's too much online activity.
Sadly, I don't see much way around it in the commercial licensed world, especially with closed source software. Too many people are embracing it with open arms. Eventually, even ones that are offering both types of licenses (perpetual or subscription), I don't see how much longer they will be doing that.
What about if the company closes the drm is removed? Like a dead man's switch. That way the software isn't bricked and the investment isn't lost. Would solve a small portion of the concerns. Or maybe a model where the previous version is released as lump sum unsupported license with a cost that can be pro-rated based on how long someone paid into a sub during the releases lifespan? I dunno just spit ballin'. I know I would like to be able to buy the second most recent release of a lot of software but will never pay the sub.
I understand paying subscriptions for things that require server and maintenance costs, but not so much interested in a perpetual dev kickstarter. I feel like it's on the shoulders of the software dev to come up with ideas that excite the customer into a purchase. The payment for software is for development that is already done, not future development. We aren't venture investors.
When I pay the subscription am I paying for the ongoing development of the next version, or am I essentially on an involuntary payment plan to pay for the version that's done that I am currently using? If the former, no thanks. If the latter, just let me pay it all at once and be done. I'm pretty sure it's the former.
I understand paying subscriptions for things that require server and maintenance costs, but not so much interested in a perpetual dev kickstarter. I feel like it's on the shoulders of the software dev to come up with ideas that excite the customer into a purchase. The payment for software is for development that is already done, not future development. We aren't venture investors.
When I pay the subscription am I paying for the ongoing development of the next version, or am I essentially on an involuntary payment plan to pay for the version that's done that I am currently using? If the former, no thanks. If the latter, just let me pay it all at once and be done. I'm pretty sure it's the former.