Hp latex 360 printer

[FrankW]

The loading procedure is different to other printers. But, If you check how it works it's easy.

On a Latex 280 (104"), I was able to load a 100"-Canvas roll easily without any help.

 

[Stephenedwardgraphic]

I could train a monkey to run my HP310...

In fact I think I might steal a monkey from my local zoo to help save on labor costs...

 

[FrankW]

In Europe, HP is market leader in the category 44 - 104" Low Volume Production Printer, with a market share of - depending on the country - 40 - 50%. I work for a dealer and make ALL of the latex installations, but even if some of the users sometimes have complains about details, nearly no one wants to give the printer back because of its advantages (speed, quality, scratch resistance and so on).

If someone have problems with color consistency specially when tiling, have a look on that video:

[video=youtube;nGJL66Kvy6s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGJL66Kvy6s[/video]

 

[dypinc]

HP has brought their Latex forum back.

http://h20435.www2.hp.com/t5/HP-Latex-300-Series-Discussions/bd-p/HPLatex300Board

 

[BigfishDM]

Here is another latex user forum that I run http://hpl25500users.ning.com/

 

[adrock]

A lot of the times our wrap vinyl rolls off the backer when pushing it thru to load. We've had to revert to manual loading as per HP rep recommendation.

Trim the first couple inches of vinyl off the backer before you load it... Haven't had a jam while loading since the first day I had the thing.

 

[TheSnowman]

I bought the HP 310 about two months ago. I had a Mimaki JV33 before that, and a JV3 before that. Compared to the Mimaki, loading the material, and using the takeup is a giant pain in the butt. The pre-print and curing time after you print does seem to take forever compared to the JV33, but, it's all ready to roll and dry, so I can deal with that. The biggest gripe I have...no cut off tool. You have to open the door, reach in with a knife and cut the material off. Stupidest thing I've ever seen, but I didn't know that was a situation till the installer was already there.

A couple months in...I think I still like it more than the JV33. I ALWAYS had banding...ALWAYS on the JV33, and no one could ever do anything to fix it. So far, with the HP, it's full vibrant amazing color. It's instantly dry which helps for all the stuff I used to rush and get a wrinkle in it because I pushed it too fast.

I would like to have someone come in and profile some stuff for me so I can get a faster print mode than 8 pass for my temporary stuff that doesn't matter, but for now...it still works for me, and prints amazing. All printers have some things about them better and worse than others.

 

[ProWraps]

good printers.

much better than the 2xxxx generation.

we run 3 of them. we have had a total of 11 hp printers from the 2 series to the 3 series.

color.

always a constant battle. you will never print the same color twice. i dont care if its 1 minute later, or 1 year later. they are very very inconsistant machines.

that is my biggest complaint. we print and install or ship 700-1000 wraps a year so any ugly heads rear themselves quickly and often in our shop. we have pushed our machines way past their duty cycle since the first latex we purchased.

hp printers cost us a great deal in reprints. but, it is what it is. you either learn to manage it and accept its flaws and hope they dont outweigh the positives like being able to lam instantly etc. etc. or you go somewhere else.

the 3 series eliminated a heat bar all together and uses optimizer to bring the temps down significantly in the hopes of increasing color consistency.

trust me HP knows its an issue. they wont tell you that, nor will they tell you how to fix it because you cant, but im hoping the next generation and i mean full generation, not a 3.x will come close to or completely eliminate the issue. its a very young technology and eventually the kinks will be worked out.

 

[Behrmon]

good printers.

we print and install or ship 700-1000 wraps a year so any ugly heads rear themselves quickly and often in our shop.

Being a shop looking into adding Latex I am curious, do you run Latex in conjunction with Solvent or solely Latex?

 

[TomK]

The biggest gripe I have...no cut off tool. You have to open the door, reach in with a knife and cut the material off. Stupidest thing I've ever seen, but I didn't know that was a situation till the installer was already there.

Seriously? I've been doing it wrong, I move the substrate down, cut it, and then move it back. Last thing I'd want to do is put cutting tools inside near everything...

 

[TheSnowman]

You can do it however you want. There's a little steel trough in there right where my Mimaki used to cut the media. The head is parked, and it can't possibly hurt a thing. It gets me a straight cut every time. Seems like a lot of jacking around to do it any other way.

 

[ProWraps]

we strictly run latex. we never mix printers, even latex generations. when we do a new purchase, we purchase all new printers, and pickle the last generation for sale.

as far as the 310, its a strippy version of the 360 hence the no auto cut or take up system etc. thats the entire point of it though, get the price point down through removing features. the whole you get what you pay for saying applies.

i do want to say, that on a good year, these printers probably cost us about 25-30K in wasted materials due to color shift, and lost time. on a bad year i would say more in the $50-60k range.

some days like today, i despise these things.

its is more common than not, that they can not get through an entire wrap without shifting. its also incredibly common that they cant go from one panel to the other without shifting. we are having to completely reprint and rewrap a truck right now, because of this.

 

[dypinc]

we strictly run latex. we never mix printers, even latex generations. when we do a new purchase, we purchase all new printers, and pickle the last generation for sale.

as far as the 310, its a strippy version of the 360 hence the no auto cut or take up system etc. thats the entire point of it though, get the price point down through removing features. the whole you get what you pay for saying applies.

i do want to say, that on a good year, these printers probably cost us about 25-30K in wasted materials due to color shift, and lost time. on a bad year i would say more in the $50-60k range.

some days like today, i despise these things.

its is more common than not, that they can not get through an entire wrap without shifting. its also incredibly common that they cant go from one panel to the other without shifting. we are having to completely reprint and rewrap a truck right now, because of this.

Can you determined if it is certain colors, light colors, light grays, etc.

How many passes are you using when you notice the shifting?

If less than 12 passes are you adding some inter-pass delay?

Do you notice shifting if you don't use the lc/lm inks?

 

[Bly]

We get consistent colour panel to panel on jobs printed at the same time on our 360s.
But trying to match anything at a later date is a problem. The colour and length will never match.
We have to tell clients replacing one panel will probably not be doable unless they are willing to accept this.
Even colour matching anything is weird. The same colour will print slightly differently 10 minutes later.
Apart from that we don't have any real issues with them.
I love the way you can load a roll and print the whole thing without having to worry about banding or dropouts.
Greyscale images turn out nicely neutral if you recalibrate before each job.

 

[FrankW]

Trust me HP knows its an issue. they wont tell you that, nor will they tell you how to fix it because you cant ...

Of course HP knows that issue, because it is due to design, any thermal inkjet printers have that problem since the beginning.

But there are workarounds, and HP explains them:

[video=youtube;u2vmmeZ9DjY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2vmmeZ9DjY&list=PLsEgsF8P0nXF0QzWs2UX5Vyj F7p1I516I[/video]

[video=youtube;nGJL66Kvy6s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGJL66Kvy6s[/video]

but im hoping the next generation and i mean full generation, not a 3.x will come close to or completely eliminate the issue. its a very young technology and eventually the kinks will be worked out.

As mentioned before, that problem exists since the first color designjets, and is due to design. With the new heads, they have reduced the overall heat of the heads, so the prints should be more color consistent than with the older models. Bot not perfect too.

Most of our customers live with that, because of the advantages a Latex 300 have to offer (quality, speed, scratch resistance and so on).

 

[dypinc]

Of course HP knows that issue, because it is due to design, any thermal inkjet printers have that problem since the beginning.

I have used the Canon iPF series and have never noticed color inconsistencies with them. They are the most stable printers I have ever ran. Epson head style printers were always prone to some color inconsistencies because of nozzle clogs.

 

[FrankW]

I know that problems from HP, Encad and SummaPaints since 18 years.

 

[dypinc]

I know that problems from HP, Encad and SummaPaints since 18 years.

Never ran any SummaPaints but Encads yes which seemed be do to lack of nozzle redundancy, which ironicly seems to be the L3xx series biggest problem with only having one lc/lm printhead. Don't recall having that much of an issue with the L2xx series which has two lc/lm printheads.

 

[FrankW]

We had that with first and second generation latex.

 

[myront]

...I had a Mimaki JV33 before that, and a JV3 before that. Compared to the Mimaki, loading the material, and using the takeup is a giant pain in the butt.

That's what we had before. Never profiled anything, loaded all kinds of material and used the same profile on everything. No problems at all with banding, no problems getting good reds or blues. I still haven't been able to achieve good reds or blues with the HP.

loading the HP...they actually have a youtube video that walks you through it. I never meant that it was difficult. What I meant was that you have a lot of steps to go through. Not just with the media loading but with the control panel settings and then the RIP settings. With the Mimaki all you did was load the media clamp it in and it reads the width and that's it. Didn't have to baby it on loading either. Go to your RIP and hit print. Don't have to go through any profiles. Colors printed exactly the same on banner stock, wrap vinyl, paper, clear, static cling, etc.

The take up on the Mimaki didn't require any special bar to stick through and didn't have to snake araoun any other roller. You could start your print 2" from the leading edge. Didn't have to drop in any special "skirts" when using certain types of medias. When it got down to the takeup you could just tape it on. The take up is always on so you don't have to flip any other switches either.

 

[Vital Designs]

Check the humidity in your print room. My guess it is high. Get a dehumidifier and manage the humidity and it will cure a few of your problems (buckling, jamming, moisture on windows etc.).

Enough of the technical stuff. I'm stupid when it comes to making profiles and adjusting things. But I do know about
the everyday running of the machine.

First, I had a Roland Versacamm. We bought the Hp 360 about 8 mos. ago

We decided to buy the 360 over the 310 because they said it was faster and I liked the idea of the touchscreen. I don't think the 310 has a touchscreen. As far as speed, the 360 is faster printing ( when it's printing ) but the startup time and the cool down time added to the print time doesn't seem to make it much faster than my Versacamm.
But a big plus is the ability to take it off the machine and laminate it immediately. When we used the Versacamm, we tried to let prints dry overnight and we had them hanging all over the shop. Another plus is the take up reel. We can literally run hundreds of prints onto the take up. We can move the entire spool from the take up right to the laminator.

Now for the cons... Heat... Heat... Heat... It gets hot in the room. And lately, it's been fogging up the windows. So much that we turn the heat off. May be a good thing. You need to install 2-220 electric outlets. It seems that it must use a lot of power. I can't tell because just before we bought the machine, we were trying to reduce our ridiculously high electric bill
We changed the lighting and air conditioning compressor on the roof. So our bill is much lower. I can't tell how the new machine has affected the bill.
It seems that some materials curl from the heat and cause jams as it goes through the heater.
If I leave material in the machine overnight, it may jam when starting up in the morning, but I leave it in and take my chances because... Loading material is a pain. The versacamm loads from the back. It was easy to load.
This machine loads from the front. You have to actually bend over and look up into the machine to load it. Not something someone my age wants to do everyday. However, I found a stool the nail girls use when their manicuring nails. You sit on it and it's the perfect height. My other option is the 25 yr old that works for me. He makes short work out of it.

What about rip software. I used the Versaworks software for 10 years. Simple and to the point. But only works with Roland.
I think the HP 310 comes with a version of Flexi sign. If you buy the 360, you need to supply a rip. BTW, Flexi does a very good job with HP.


So, if I going to buy again, what would I buy ? Even after all the cons with the HP, I would buy it again. I like the fact of laminating right away and the take up. However, I would consider the 310. It costs less and maybe I don't need all the bells and whistles. It seem I don't know how to use most of them