Welcome To Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals

Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals is the LARGEST online community & discussion forum for professional sign-makers and graphic designers.

 


  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Installing frosted vinyl orafol

Discussion in 'Installation Equipment & Techniques' started by msenjur, Mar 13, 2019.

  1. msenjur

    msenjur Member

    292
    4
    18
    May 21, 2008
    Slovenia
    hello guys.

    im have installed few square meters of this frosted vinyl (we call it sanded vinyl). but everytime im having problems with istalling it, if it has some complex design, like some thin lines or something like.

    i usually overlay it with paper transfer, because im doing wet installation. what do you use for transfer? paper or ovc?

    do you always install it wet? i do, because if i do it dry, a usually get this very small bubbles, which defently disappere in time, but right after job it doesnt look nice, i can tell from customer face. :)

    if you do wet intallation. how long do you wait before removing transfer? or do you leave it, and came back next day? or do you finish it in one day, and dry it with heat blower?


    just today i did this complex design, and i almost lost my nerves. i was warming glass door with standing fan heater, so it would dry faster. but instead of drying i got wrinkles all over surface. so i have to straighten these wrinkles and then i proceed with removing transfer. ofcourse everyting was streching... i was i a lot of troubles...

    it makes me so nervous that i leave it till tommorow. i will probably remove instaled decals in reinstall it dry. but im affraid that i will get this small bubbles, that i was speaking earlyer...

    im using orafol, gold frosted. for installing i use water and soap.

    20190313_153455.jpg 20190313_154116.jpg 20190313_154132.jpg
     
    Tags:
  2. bannertime

    bannertime "You guys do banners, right?"

    1,354
    320
    83
    Sep 8, 2016
    Arlington, TX
    We use Rapid Tac II and paper app tape for this stuff. Anyways, what ever you use, you'll also need to let it set for about 10 minutes after squeegeeing it down. Then spray another wet coat of your soapy water over the tape, rub it in, and then you should be able to pull it cleanly.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. TimToad

    TimToad Very Active Member

    We've gotten away from homemade application solutions. There are just too many unknown additives in dishwashing soap and depending on the quality of your local water, it can produce cloudiness on clear decals and other undesirable effects.

    The folks who manufacture RapidTac have a formula specifically for window graphics. It sets up faster than their standard product and also allows you to use far less. Technique is nearly everything with vinyl application. Patience is also critical.

    With long vertical graining like you've shown, make sure you're going WITH the vertical graining and less side to side motion. You should be able to look at the back side of the glass and see bubbles if you have any. Some bubbles are in between the vinyl and the transfer tape, so give everything a good amount of elbow grease a couple of times, go take a long break and then decide if you think its ready to peel off the transfer tape.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. msenjur

    msenjur Member

    292
    4
    18
    May 21, 2008
    Slovenia
    yeah... orafol doesnt offer rapid air frosted vinyl... that would be the best solution.

    i know that if i spray paper transfer it would come off easly as dry... but whenever i did it like this the decals were still peeling off... im talking about wet installation...

    tim: how to do such long vertical moves? on the whole height? thats are some long moves... but will give it a try...
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  5. Johnny Best

    Johnny Best Very Active Member

    2,523
    1,406
    113
    Dec 9, 2015
    buffalo ny
    RapidTac II, no soap mixture. I do it exactly as bannertime does it and it comes out great. Toad tips like going with vertical graining also is good to follow.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. msenjur

    msenjur Member

    292
    4
    18
    May 21, 2008
    Slovenia
    ok, but just for disccusion, how do you do wet installation, how do you dry it?
     
  7. Johnny Best

    Johnny Best Very Active Member

    2,523
    1,406
    113
    Dec 9, 2015
    buffalo ny
    Spray glass, spray back of transfer paper, place on glass. I would never put a heat gun or hair dyer on glass to speed up drying. I do not trust glass that much to make a mistake and overheat it. I let it dry on its own. With that pattern you have I would not flood the glass because you can pretty much hard squeegee that down without bubbles to speed up taking off the transfer tape. I use the Geek wrap squeegees but am gong to try those cheap wrap ones next time I need to purchase new ones.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. unclebun

    unclebun Active Member

    831
    243
    43
    Dec 7, 2011
    Osage Beach, MO
    Go to Rapid Tac's website and read the instructions. http://www.rapidtac.com/
    Or watch this video:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. MikePro

    MikePro Major Contributor

    4,547
    135
    63
    Feb 3, 2010
    Racine, WI
    I wet apply, finish with heat and a lot of elbow grease
    ....and then spray the transfer mask with water before trying to remove it. it loosens the grip of the transfer mask & vinyl, lifts much easier.
    At that point, everything stays in place but I still have to go back-over a lot of elements with a hard squeegee and backingpaper (keeps from scuffing the vinyl) to get some random microbubbles out before everything is completely-dry.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. msenjur

    msenjur Member

    292
    4
    18
    May 21, 2008
    Slovenia
    ok, thanks... im not doin it much different as i look, but something must be... :)

    i will get some aplication flouid, soap may be out of time... it is too greasy to dry fast i think...
     
  11. TimToad

    TimToad Very Active Member

    How do we do it? Practice my friend. Practice.

    If I was doing this door all by myself, I would place a tape hinge across the width of the masked off graphic about a quarter of the way down from the top. I'd then peel back just that much of the decal, slice off the backing, VERY lightly spritz the back of the decal while trying to stay at least 4-6 from the remaining liner so it doesn't get too wet. Using a Teflon squeegee, I'd start squeegeeing upward several inches above the remaining liner in the same vertical direction starting in the center of the graphic working my way upward and outward without too much side to side.

    Working quickly to set that section and move on before the really HARD squeegeeing gets done.

    When that section is in place, I'd pull outward on my decal and peel off the tape hinge and more of the liner, then lightly spray my RapidTac II or window formula and start working my way down the panel.

    Once the entire graphic is in place, I'd start pulling long vertical strokes with the Teflon squeegee stopping every so often and checking the back side of the glass for bubbles until I comfortable with it.

    After a long break or even a hour or more, I'd squirt the transfer tape with plain water, let it soak in and then gently peel it off at a 180 angle if that makes sense. If you peel the tape off at an outward angle away from the glass and anything hasn't set yet, you'll lift the graphic.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. Johnny Best

    Johnny Best Very Active Member

    2,523
    1,406
    113
    Dec 9, 2015
    buffalo ny
    Also when you wet the transfer tape take your hand and rub the water into the transfer tape to make it come off easy and quicker. I have installed some materials from Decorative Flms with complex patterns dry and not have bubbles or problems.
    When you start doing massive amounts on glass offices you start to get real good at what the material will do and not do.
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. jman

    jman Member

    131
    14
    18
    Mar 26, 2015
    North East
    You want rapid tac II, the green stuff.

    Never use anything but on glass.
     
  14. bannertime

    bannertime "You guys do banners, right?"

    1,354
    320
    83
    Sep 8, 2016
    Arlington, TX
    And wear a respirator or use in a very well ventilated area. Also, be cautious when the window trims are painted. It'll take that stuff off.
     
  15. LarryB

    LarryB Member

    234
    12
    18
    Dec 3, 2006
    Webster, Texas
    We use Mactac B-Free frosted vinyl. You are not supposed with install with application fluid but we spray a small amount and works great. So much easier to install than Oracal.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. jsmoritz2000

    jsmoritz2000 Very Active Member

    I recommend using Orafol HT55 transfer tape with Orafol etched and frosted films, if you aren't already.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. White Haus

    White Haus Formally known as RJPW..........

    186
    67
    28
    Apr 6, 2018
    Winnipeg
    For Rapid Tac II ? Is there ammonia in that stuff? Sure smells like it.

    Better than Rapid Remover at least..........
     
  18. bannertime

    bannertime "You guys do banners, right?"

    1,354
    320
    83
    Sep 8, 2016
    Arlington, TX
    It's got an ether in it. Specifically "Propylene glycol methyl ether" Rapid Tac II MSDS(pdf)
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
  19. Chuck B

    Chuck B New Member

    18
    9
    3
    Jan 14, 2018
    Richmond, VA
    After doing this for years, I (for some time now) apply this dry always. Application fluid brings it's own set of risks/challenges to the game, beyond having to wait a long time before removing the transfer tape. As was stated earlier---experience pays dividends. When I used to use fluid, I found that unless I drenched both surfaces, I'd get more bubbles than if I had used no fluid at all---so the light spritz never worked well for me. Eventually, after you've done way more vinyl application than you cared to, you'll rarely if ever use app fluid.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. Tattoosleeve

    Tattoosleeve Member

    92
    9
    8
    Nov 5, 2012
    Prince George
    Naturally over night. You can get away with same day peeling with the tips the guys above have already mentioned but with complex designs with any really skinny sections I always leave it overnight just to be sure, work the 2nd trip into my pricing. Peeling the mask will take 5 minutes.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

 


Loading...