Installing frosted vinyl orafol

[msenjur]

hello guys.

im have installed few square meters of this frosted vinyl (we call it sanded vinyl). but everytime im having problems with istalling it, if it has some complex design, like some thin lines or something like.

i usually overlay it with paper transfer, because im doing wet installation. what do you use for transfer? paper or ovc?

do you always install it wet? i do, because if i do it dry, a usually get this very small bubbles, which defently disappere in time, but right after job it doesnt look nice, i can tell from customer face.

if you do wet intallation. how long do you wait before removing transfer? or do you leave it, and came back next day? or do you finish it in one day, and dry it with heat blower?


just today i did this complex design, and i almost lost my nerves. i was warming glass door with standing fan heater, so it would dry faster. but instead of drying i got wrinkles all over surface. so i have to straighten these wrinkles and then i proceed with removing transfer. ofcourse everyting was streching... i was i a lot of troubles...

it makes me so nervous that i leave it till tommorow. i will probably remove instaled decals in reinstall it dry. but im affraid that i will get this small bubbles, that i was speaking earlyer...

im using orafol, gold frosted. for installing i use water and soap.

 

[bannertime]

We use Rapid Tac II and paper app tape for this stuff. Anyways, what ever you use, you'll also need to let it set for about 10 minutes after squeegeeing it down. Then spray another wet coat of your soapy water over the tape, rub it in, and then you should be able to pull it cleanly.

 

[TimToad]

We've gotten away from homemade application solutions. There are just too many unknown additives in dishwashing soap and depending on the quality of your local water, it can produce cloudiness on clear decals and other undesirable effects.

The folks who manufacture RapidTac have a formula specifically for window graphics. It sets up faster than their standard product and also allows you to use far less. Technique is nearly everything with vinyl application. Patience is also critical.

With long vertical graining like you've shown, make sure you're going WITH the vertical graining and less side to side motion. You should be able to look at the back side of the glass and see bubbles if you have any. Some bubbles are in between the vinyl and the transfer tape, so give everything a good amount of elbow grease a couple of times, go take a long break and then decide if you think its ready to peel off the transfer tape.

 

[msenjur]

yeah... orafol doesnt offer rapid air frosted vinyl... that would be the best solution.

i know that if i spray paper transfer it would come off easly as dry... but whenever i did it like this the decals were still peeling off... im talking about wet installation...

tim: how to do such long vertical moves? on the whole height? thats are some long moves... but will give it a try...

 

[Johnny Best]

RapidTac II, no soap mixture. I do it exactly as bannertime does it and it comes out great. Toad tips like going with vertical graining also is good to follow.

 

[msenjur]

ok, but just for disccusion, how do you do wet installation, how do you dry it?

 

[Johnny Best]

Spray glass, spray back of transfer paper, place on glass. I would never put a heat gun or hair dyer on glass to speed up drying. I do not trust glass that much to make a mistake and overheat it. I let it dry on its own. With that pattern you have I would not flood the glass because you can pretty much hard squeegee that down without bubbles to speed up taking off the transfer tape. I use the Geek wrap squeegees but am gong to try those cheap wrap ones next time I need to purchase new ones.

 

[unclebun]

ok, but just for disccusion, how do you do wet installation, how do you dry it?

Go to Rapid Tac's website and read the instructions. http://www.rapidtac.com/
Or watch this video:

 

[MikePro]

I wet apply, finish with heat and a lot of elbow grease
....and then spray the transfer mask with water before trying to remove it. it loosens the grip of the transfer mask & vinyl, lifts much easier.
At that point, everything stays in place but I still have to go back-over a lot of elements with a hard squeegee and backingpaper (keeps from scuffing the vinyl) to get some random microbubbles out before everything is completely-dry.

 

[msenjur]

ok, thanks... im not doin it much different as i look, but something must be...

i will get some aplication flouid, soap may be out of time... it is too greasy to dry fast i think...

 

[TimToad]

yeah... orafol doesnt offer rapid air frosted vinyl... that would be the best solution.

i know that if i spray paper transfer it would come off easly as dry... but whenever i did it like this the decals were still peeling off... im talking about wet installation...

tim: how to do such long vertical moves? on the whole height? thats are some long moves... but will give it a try...

How do we do it? Practice my friend. Practice.

If I was doing this door all by myself, I would place a tape hinge across the width of the masked off graphic about a quarter of the way down from the top. I'd then peel back just that much of the decal, slice off the backing, VERY lightly spritz the back of the decal while trying to stay at least 4-6 from the remaining liner so it doesn't get too wet. Using a Teflon squeegee, I'd start squeegeeing upward several inches above the remaining liner in the same vertical direction starting in the center of the graphic working my way upward and outward without too much side to side.

Working quickly to set that section and move on before the really HARD squeegeeing gets done.

When that section is in place, I'd pull outward on my decal and peel off the tape hinge and more of the liner, then lightly spray my RapidTac II or window formula and start working my way down the panel.

Once the entire graphic is in place, I'd start pulling long vertical strokes with the Teflon squeegee stopping every so often and checking the back side of the glass for bubbles until I comfortable with it.

After a long break or even a hour or more, I'd squirt the transfer tape with plain water, let it soak in and then gently peel it off at a 180 angle if that makes sense. If you peel the tape off at an outward angle away from the glass and anything hasn't set yet, you'll lift the graphic.

 

[Johnny Best]

Also when you wet the transfer tape take your hand and rub the water into the transfer tape to make it come off easy and quicker. I have installed some materials from Decorative Flms with complex patterns dry and not have bubbles or problems.
When you start doing massive amounts on glass offices you start to get real good at what the material will do and not do.

 

[jman]

You want rapid tac II, the green stuff.

Never use anything but on glass.

 

[bannertime]

You want rapid tac II, the green stuff.

Never use anything but on glass.

And wear a respirator or use in a very well ventilated area. Also, be cautious when the window trims are painted. It'll take that stuff off.

 

[LarryB]

We use Mactac B-Free frosted vinyl. You are not supposed with install with application fluid but we spray a small amount and works great. So much easier to install than Oracal.

 

[Pixels Are Bad Mmmkay?]

I recommend using Orafol HT55 transfer tape with Orafol etched and frosted films, if you aren't already.

 

[White Haus]

And wear a respirator or use in a very well ventilated area. Also, be cautious when the window trims are painted. It'll take that stuff off.

For Rapid Tac II ? Is there ammonia in that stuff? Sure smells like it.

Better than Rapid Remover at least..........

 

[bannertime]

For Rapid Tac II ? Is there ammonia in that stuff? Sure smells like it.

Better than Rapid Remover at least..........

It's got an ether in it. Specifically "Propylene glycol methyl ether" Rapid Tac II MSDS(pdf)

 

[Chuck B]

After doing this for years, I (for some time now) apply this dry always. Application fluid brings it's own set of risks/challenges to the game, beyond having to wait a long time before removing the transfer tape. As was stated earlier---experience pays dividends. When I used to use fluid, I found that unless I drenched both surfaces, I'd get more bubbles than if I had used no fluid at all---so the light spritz never worked well for me. Eventually, after you've done way more vinyl application than you cared to, you'll rarely if ever use app fluid.

 

[Tattoosleeve]

ok, but just for disccusion, how do you do wet installation, how do you dry it?

Naturally over night. You can get away with same day peeling with the tips the guys above have already mentioned but with complex designs with any really skinny sections I always leave it overnight just to be sure, work the 2nd trip into my pricing. Peeling the mask will take 5 minutes.