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MultiCam 300 Support Sucks

Janey

New Member
Anyone else have a MultiCam? I got mine out of the Chicago office few weeks ago and I am ready to put it out in the street...I am so tired of those people in that office. Does any of the MultiCam offices provide support or do they all suck? You know I went to Las Vegas and looked at them all. I was promised by Joe Stangarone in Chicago all the wonderful support they would give me because I am less then two hours away.

For Enroute software their training meant making a copy of the training CD Enroute sells and giving me one. Is that even legal?

For onsite training I got a total of six hours. Until I told the finance company that I wasn't going to make payments until they came back and trained me. Oy! That sure put a match under their butt...

Sorry...my first post...lousy impression I know..but I gotta tell I am so frustrated with those people that I could scream.

Thanks for hearing me out...anyone out there wanna talk about it?:frustrated:
 

k.a.s.

New Member
I bought mine before they had regonal Multicam offices selling them, and our training was not very good. We bought Artcam with ours and our dealer was still learning it as well, it was not until I paid for a 2 day extra Artcam class from someone else that I really understood how to use it.

Kevin
 

cmpginc

New Member
We deal with the Orlando office here for our Multicam 3000 which we've had for about 6 months and we've gotten crappy support as well. We have problems with the knife bit making notches on corners and not rounding them correctly. They blamed it on our art department not setting up the files correctly so we used a pre-programmed shape from the software and it still did it! Proved them wrong but they still have not come up with how to fix it. Then it was we had to use felt. Well we bought felt and that did not fix it.. it actually broke the knife! Latest is they say the software is wrong but just re-loaded new software and left without testing! We also have problems with the mill bits breaking very easily with our aluminum.

For now the only time we get good, I'm sorry, half decent support is when we say come pick it up and refund our money because it's not doing what it was sold to us to do.. they come out first thing the next morning! Gotta be rough with them in my opinion.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
The following message was sent to you via the Signs101.com Contact Us form by Roberta Spencer
--------------------------------

Dear Administrator

Please see a post titled "MultiCam 300 Support Sucks" by user name "Janey" dated 6/26/09 on your CNC Routing forum. I am Operations Manager of the company this individual is libeling with those statements. We assert unequivocally that the inflammatory statements made in that post are without merit. At this time we are consulting with our attorney regarding restraining this customer from further slander.

We respectfully request that you remove this post from your forums. The author of it is obviously not interested in opening any sort of reasonable dialog about CNC Routing and should probably be regarded as a troll.

Thank you.

To which this reply was sent:

Dear Ms. Spencer:

Signs 101 is an online community of professional sign makers. Members of that community are free to post their opinions on a variety of topics including complaints about suppliers. In most circumstances, other members will reply with their own reports of good or bad experiences with the supplier. Often times, the supplier will also register and reply with whatever information they may wish to share.

You are invited to do so.

We do not view posts at Signs 101 as anything more than the expression of opinions under the free speech rights guaranteed to all U.S. citizens by our Constitution. Should you be able to prove, unequivocally, that the posters comments represent libel or slander, we will be happy to comply with your request. Until such time, we will not be removing the post.

Fred Weiss

Signs 101 Admin
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
Although I already welcomed Janey... I can see this one is going to get very interesting.

Opinions, accusations and threats..... what constitutes the difference ??

Although one isn't truly a post, simply because they aren't members, they still possess the feeling that verbally one doesn't have that right, while the other does. Now just how does that figure ?? :help
 

iSign

New Member
it's an extremely busy day for me, as will be most of this week, but i can tell you I love my Multicam & Enroute, but it has also been a tough learning curve. Multicam absolutely should provide more training than you got. For me, I got 3 full days, as that was written into my contract before i signed the bottom line. i was also able to pay $1000 per day for additional days. I paid for 1 extra day.

I do get some technical support from the Dallas office, which I believe is where they are made. In most cases, I feel that I am asking a favor, (I choose to feel that way, they don't make me feel that way) and in every case they have tried to help me. I knew going in that this was going to be a very long process to learn & did not expect to do much in the first 6 month except the most basic paying jobs, and as many long drawn out, inefficient & un profitable experiments on sample showroom pieces, while I invested in my own future by studying the maching and the software.

I can't imagine only having the machine for 2 weeks and joining a new forum just to vent your frustrations. It sounds to me like you thought you bought a magic bullet to flip a switch & be like a chauffer driven limo taking you and your business anywhere you want to go with the flip of a switch. I'm sure that is an exaggeration, but like you said yourself, it ain't the best first impression.

I'll tell you the guy who tries to put me in touch with good people & you can call him, give my name (Doug from Island Sign) ..and POLITELY ask him if he has any other resources you might consider for telephone support. One more suggestion... offer to pay for support. I don't know right now what my contract says, and of course i don't know what yours says... but I do know we both spent a lot on our 3000 series tables & I also know Mulitcam wants you to succeed. Sounds like the Chicago outfit may not be as customer service friendly, but at this point, if I was in your shoes... even if there were a fee required to set yourself up with better support options.... well, we both know there certainly are some costs involved in not getting adequate support.

Ken Rock is the sales department guy who has helped me. He is NOT technical support, and he is not your sales guy... but he IS an extremely knowledgable, friendly & professional individual. and the face of the company to me, which has made me a huge fan of the company!

I will also suggest you keep your eyes open in the trade mags for Dan Sawatzky's router magic workshop, which has been put on by Enroute. I went twice already & highlu reccommend it to anyone running any router, although Dan is also using Enroute and the MC 3000.
 

olsen1969

New Member
I am new to this site but I will contest to the quaility of the machine. I have owned 3. The last one is 3 years old and it runs 8+ hours a day. I will speak only of the tech support I receive from my office located in Irvine CA. They answer my specific questions to the letter. But they can't answer vague questions or problems I can not explain.

CNC machines have a long, tough and expensive learning curve. If no one told you that then there it is. These machines are not printers. They are not plug and play!

What problems are you having? Are the problems your having software or hardware? Could they be electrical? You will soon realize that the tech are good or in my case great at responding to true machine problems, not I can't make it work problems. the I can't make it work problems are best delt with by trial and error. You can not think you will get it overnight.

Multicam has a lot of machines running in this country, I mean alot. The are simple to learn in the beginning but are robust enough to work long hours.

If I can help you then ask for help but try to keep it specific, and also try not to confuse your lack of understanding of the machine and or the sofware to blame Multicam.

You will soon realize that 1 on 1 training is worth every penny. If you need 1 or 2 days of 1 on 1 training to settle you nerves on how to run your machine then pay the tech for the extra training on the machine. If you need support on your software than pay for that.

One last thing you will not find an easier pathing software then enroute.

Eric
 

Biker Scout

New Member
I think CNC Routers are pretty darn simple. CNC Plasma, even easier. X,Y & Z What can be complicated is the software, especially if it's not designed by people who don't already have a CAD/CAM background.

Thinking spatially isn't something that everyone can do. Some have the knack for it, others take years to develop tricks and work-arounds, based on their machine, software, and/or understanding of those components.

I'm sure a lot of sign people buy CNC Routers because they saw them at a show or a trade magazine. Think they can fill that niche market in their neighborhood and be Mr. Awesome with their new machine. But their knowledge of Computer Aided Machining is limited to nil, and they just pass off the lack as, "well it's something I can learn" or "they'll send a tech out to teach me."

I know Multi-Cam sells a lot of their product, and they are robust machines and all of that... (overpriced) But they are still XYZ machines that require the end use some basic understanding of the process in order to know where to start with the software. I've used an earler version of EnRoute, and I wasn't too impressed with it. Seemed too CAD like. Their newer version looks pretty cool though. However, it's still brought to you by they same people who make Flexi. I do not like my Flexi at all, but it's what I got.

Anyway, I use VCarvePro (Now called Aspire) and there was practically no learning curve. I only had to fiddle around with it enough recognize the tools and palettes. The rest was easy. 5 minutes from setting up the machine to producing a part! Very basic and visual, but powerful and intuitive for even a beginer to pick up. But I say that, already having a production and manufacturing background. I like making things... parts, inventions, tools whatever.

I guess my point is to all of this is that MultiCam, being as widely known and popular among sign shops and production facilities, should make these things Plug & Play by now. Lord nows how many millions this company makes, that they could develop better R&D on the end user side of things. I know they claim they are easy, but easy for the guy who is also running the CNC Mill and Plasma Machine at a small to meduim production shop. They have a dedicated machine guy already. I'm suspecting that MultiCam sells mostly to that particular demographic, and doesn't really care to cater to the small guy who has a few start-up questions. I've heard this about MultiCam before. When their machine breaks, they'll fix it... but if you don't know what to ask or what you are doing, they'll ignore you until you pay for additional training. I don't think that's right from an industry leader.

The company I bought my machine from was more than willing to walk me through the begining phases of how to use my Router Table. I didn't need the hand holding, as I'm more willing to figure things out for myself, but it was nice to know that he was only a phone call away. He gave me some pointers, tips and general workarounds for my machine. Oh, and he did it all though my PC... he was able to capture my mouse and show me what to do. Like I said earlier, it was only about 5 minutes before we were cutting.

Has MultiCam lost their personal touch? Have they grown too big to help us peons?
 

iSign

New Member
your oversimplification reminds me of a comment in a drummers magazine years ago.. 2 schools of thought for drumming: play something easy & make it look hard, or play something hard & make it look easy... but both of them are BS in the end, and that is what I think you are pretty much saying here...

...make them "plug & play"?? that can't be done with a pencil, so I don't see how it's ever supposed to be done with other tools of unlimited potential.
 

andy

New Member
How can "plug and play" ever compensate for ignorance and incompetence?

Doug has the SAME machine AND software and LOVES the setup he's got.... the only difference is Doug has been patient AND realistic in his entry into CNC... guess which person will make more money out of their investment?!

The OP has had a Multicam for a "few weeks" so they are not in a position to actually know whether the machine is cr@p or not. Enroute is good software but it's a LOT more complicated than vinyl cutting or printing software- if you know what you are doing all that complexity is essential.

Problems cutting aluminium on any CNC router stem from the fact that routers aren't really designed or good at cutting metal. If you want top notch metal cutting you need Laser, Water Jet or Plasma machines AS WELL as your router.
 

Biker Scout

New Member
InkJet Printers used to be hard to install. So did VCRs. If you are using a Personal Computer to type this, on the World Wide Web instead of IRC Channels or BBS, then you are benefiting from once high end technology that's been made "Plug & Play"

In fact, Wide Format printers, up until real reacently used to take about a week to set-up just to print a test pattern. Now, thanks to companies like Roland, Mutoh and Mimaki, you can be up and printing in a matter of minutes from uncrating. Again... once a high end professional use product turned into a "Plug & Play" machine.

CNC Routers can be that simple... there is evidence of that in the newer softwares that are out now. Make the set-up and cutting processes logical and visual. WYSIWYG... so that means there are certain software companies on board with "Plug & Play" machining centers, it's the machine manufacturers who are tugging the old school line, and hanging on to old world business models.

I don't know if you read Popular Science or not, but a few years back when 3D Modeling Machines hit the market, some speculated that it won't be long before there's one on everyone's kitchen counter. You log on to a product store, download the item, and in a few minutes you've got yourself a real product from a virtual model. Well, fast forward to today, that's now a reality... "Plug & Play" at it's finest. And those are XYZ CNC Machines.

We are getting there...
 

Biker Scout

New Member
I agree, that the OP shouldn't be crapping all over his machine until he either pays someone to train him or reads some books on the subject.

This is where I'm coming from when I say they can be easy to learn... you just got to apply yourself. Heck, there's a link on this forum that leads to Techno Routers... they have a FREE CNC Router Book you can get from them.
 

Janey

New Member
Wow...have not had been back to read all this until now. The best has to be the one from Roberta calling me a troll...does she not have a wonderful personality? Have your attorney call mine...bring it on girlfriend.

I never said the machine was bad in fact I don't think it is that complicated at all. I have a few gliches on the machine that need to be fixed but Roberta and Joe in Chicago won't return my calls or emails. They send the most junior tech guy to install the machine. I asked for them to send me someone that has been with the company for awhile and to quote Roberta "We will send whatever tech we have available that day" Excellent response Roberta do you have a degree in Customer Service? So who do they send up that day? The most inexperienced tech again. Nice.

That isn't slander that is fact. There is more in that line of their crappy customer service but I ache reliving the experience. My only suggestion is buyer beware. Do your homework, get it in writing in a contract, spend a couple hundred bucks with an attorney and make sure everyone knows what is expected. If you look at my profile call me if you are going to spend money on a machine and I will tell you what I have learned in the process and what to consider.

I kinda asked around before I bought the machine and there are always positive and negative reviews on everything. I felt confident talking with Chicago Multicam that they would take care of me. Ignorance on my part I know...but I go to all ends with my customers whether it is a $50 sign or a $10,000 sign. And I thought I would get the same from them. Doh!

I was under the impression that they knew the Enroute software and would teach that to me at least the basics...again ignorance on my part. I should have known when they burned me a copy of the training DVD from Enroute that that was all I would get. When I ask them a question on using the software I get the response "We don't design we just install machines." like I said I just wish they would have told me that before. All I ask for is the truth. If you can't do something tell me don't play games, ignore my calls, my emails, wonder why I am upset. RETURN MY CALLS!

Reference Enroute it is really easy actually. You just need to spend time with it. or spend some money to have someone show you how to use it. Which I did...just had Dan Sawasky up for the weekend he is amazing. And I highly recommend him to anyone wanting to go a step above. Excellent.

Okay...this is getting long...I think I will post this and add more later. Peace, Janey
 

Biker Scout

New Member
These larger companies have lost touch with what it means to be customer service driven. They seem to only care about moving "units" and collecting from whatever Bank that's holding a customer's note.

I'm glad I went the route I went... smaller company with the president's cell phone number made available to me. Made in U.S.A., and they stand behind their machines. And will help me with even stupid questions, or even willing to make a .tap file for me, no charge.
 

Janey

New Member
For now the only time we get good, I'm sorry, half decent support is when we say come pick it up and refund our money because it's not doing what it was sold to us to do.. they come out first thing the next morning! Gotta be rough with them in my opinion.

Your funny two weeks after I ordered the machine I still had not got the pre install docs...that was also two weeks after they got their money. Come to think of it once they got their money they stopped being nice. But anyways...I called the bank that did the financing and said that I wasn't going to make any payments until they sent me the pre install docs and sent someone up as promised to talk about the layout. That sure made everyone nervous. I would rather be out $3000 then $74000 keep your machine.

I think they think I am going to go away if they ignore me. Sorry that isn't going to happen. Do you think the $74000 I paid was a donation?
 
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