Printed banner pricing..and another ?..

[copythat]

HSG_IN HSG_IN is offline
Preppie

Quoted. I don't charge design unless I think it's going to take me over 30min[/B]


This was always a black hole (profit loss) in the printing industry. Never not charge. Do you not place value on yourself? Even if you have a min charge. Least we charge for anything is $22.00. You have to provide a value, if you don't they will always ask why you didn't charge me before.


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[john1]

I'm at $6 PSF for printed basic and $6.50 PSF for full coverage since it uses more ink.

IMO, printed should be more because yes it's easier on YOU but you have a much more expensive machine doing the job then a plotter as well as much MORE capability when it comes to color and design.

Cut vinyl banners i don't really do anymore, Printed is where it's at.

 

[ChiknNutz]

Yes...it is the same price, whether we do the design or not...

Bad idea...

 

[GoodPeopleFlags]

$5.50 per ft^2 eh? I'd like to order a one square foot banner.

Which should be sufficient to highlight the lunacy of having a flat rate per unit of area pricing model.

Here in this shop, we charge anywhere from $6.00 to $24.00 per ft^2 depending on the size of the work, + 200% of media unrolled. The precise formula is...

(max-min)+min*area

where min is the absolute minimum for which we'd work and max is that pesky one square foot price. In our case the min is $6.00 and the max is $24. Soon to go up a bit.

Hey Bob - a long time ago you explained your formula in a little more detail. Would it be a big pain for you to repost that? I've looked a few times and can't find it. It was awesome.

 

[bob]

Hey Bob - a long time ago you explained your formula in a little more detail. Would it be a big pain for you to repost that? I've looked a few times and can't find it. It was awesome.

OK. It's intent is to produce a curve that decreases with size of the work. That way you charge more per unit of area for small jobs and the price per unit of area decreases as the job grows larger. It keeps you from either getting hosed on small jobs or raping someone on larger jobs. It has the added charm of automatically providing a realistic multiple job discount assuming you price multiple jobs as one big job.

You start by selecting a minimum and a maximum rate per unit of area. The minimum represents the absolute minimum for which you'll work. The maximum represents the one square foot [or whatever unit of area you're using] or less job. The formula is as previously stated...

(maximum-minimum)+minimum*total_area.

I also add 200% of materials. Most notably media unrolled for the job as well as anything else needed for the job.

This produces your maximum per unit price for small jobs and becomes asymptotic about your minimum per unit charge. In other words, the larger the job the closer to the minimum it will be but it will never actually get to the minimum.

I figure a 1 square foot minimum regardless of how small it actually is and go in increments of 6" on length and width. Your mileage may vary.

 

[marcsitkin]

"I also add 200% of materials. Most notably media unrolled for the job as well as anything else needed for the job."

Do you mean you add 200% of the cost of the substrate, ink, laminate, fasteners, etc to the job?

 

[bob]

"I also add 200% of materials. Most notably media unrolled for the job as well as anything else needed for the job."

Do you mean you add 200% of the cost of the substrate, ink, laminate, fasteners, etc to the job?

Exactly. Except for the ink, grommets, tape, etc. These are all expensed overhead. I have an aversion to nickel and diming people. Media, laminate, substrates, and anything special I have to provide is marked up at 200%.

Note that rolled goods, like media and laminate, are charged by what comes off the roll, not how much I end up using. Substrates are sold, for the most part, by half and sometimes quarter sheets. At 200%. Regardless of how much is actually used. As much as I dislike nickel and diming, I dislike having lots of odd size scraps of anything hanging around.

 

[petesign]

I'm at $5 per square foot on printed banners. 13oz. - I offer a discount for non-profits I believe in... like groups to help disabled veterans, and stuff like that.

Sucks when they can go down the street to Kinko's and Office Depot these days..

 

[TheSnowman]

Man I wish I could get AT LEAST $5 sq ft. We've got a guy doing them for $4.00 starting out, and every 8 sq ft, it drops another $.50/sq ft. down to $2.50. He's a moron.

 

[john1]

My banners include powertape and grommets in the corners too in my pricing. Powertape works great, faster and easier to finish. I haven't had any issues in a year. So far so good.

 

[JR's]

Not blaming anyone for my "shortcomings" My business THRIVED though the economic disaster the last few years were for many. I'm just pointing out that too many people buy equipment just so they can lower their prices, it's like they're scared of making money.

Nobody tried to flame you with a quote, I was simply highlighting what I was responding to, just like I did here. Put on your big girl panties and stop playing the victim.

 

[JR's]

HSG_IN HSG_IN is offline
Preppie

Quoted. I don't charge design unless I think it's going to take me over 30min[/B]


This was always a black hole (profit loss) in the printing industry. Never not charge. Do you not place value on yourself? Even if you have a min charge. Least we charge for anything is $22.00. You have to provide a value, if you don't they will always ask why you didn't charge me before.


Sign Up!

 

[gnatt66]

roughly $8.00/sq, min $39.00

text layout included, messing with files that are "ready to print", design, blah blah is extra $$.

10% off for organizations/etc...they feel they are getting a deal and its worth it to get the business..im getting 75% or so of the banner jobs im quoting around town and thats ok with me.

 

[cdiesel]

The biggest issue (there are many, but this is the MAIN problem) is that people in this thread are viewing their product as a commodity. Why sell printed banners for more than cut? Because they have more value (given you design them correctly).

I understand the mentality you are using Mike, although I strongly disagree. Yes, you invest in equipment that makes your life easier, prints faster, bigger, better... You need to make say, $500 a day to be happy. So, you buy a faster printer so you can print twice as much in the same day. Does that mean you should lower your price by half so you can "stay competitive"? To me that makes absolutely no sense. You'll stay in business, but I don't want to create a job for myself where I just make a wage. If that's the case, why not invest your extra money in the stock market or real estate or whatever else you'd like instead of a printer? We invest to make *more* money. Not to do more work for the same money.


On another note, we do NOT design anything until we have a deposit. This of course is except for existing, established clients. Case in point, my sales guy went on a call on Friday. They wanted to see some examples of what the design would look like before they gave a deposit. Jim politely told the client no, that we require a deposit before starting any artwork. We have an extensive portfolio that speaks for itself and our ability. She said that that would not work for them, as they would need to be sure they liked the design before paying for it. Jim left with an agreement to disagree, figuring we would not hear back from them. Today they asked for a written estimate. He submitted, and we had a deposit about five minutes later. So, don't do design work without a deposit, and if the client goes over the allotted time, bill them for it. The design is the valuable portion of your work <see above!> the rest anyone can print!

 

[anotherdog]

This is an interesting thread
We run around $8 per square with a $99 minimum, usually free design for anything less than a 20 minute design, grommet and power tape included in the cost. Hem extra.

I have been toying with the deposit thing, we don't lose too many designs by not asking for a new customers for a deposit. We are careful to pre-qualify time wasters and tire kickers out the door. Plus I do not generate any cost beyond design work without a credit card number in my hot little hand.

I tell everyone that if you buy Banner for 5 bucks you are buying shower curtain. I ask the cheapskates if they buy suits at WalMart and choose wine by price only.

If you price it cheap people aren't going to value what you do.

 

[MikePro]

i get where you all are coming from and my bad for lashing back out so quickly, but I still will always prefer to offer our customers with low prices and fast turnaround....
as long as they're happy, they keep coming back, and as long as i'm profiting i see no harm in inciting return business.

its not like i'm offering 4'x8' banners for <$100 here either... so why get all uppity?
$150-200 depending on setup time is hardly an undercut... so if you're telling me I should do it for twice as much, just BECAUSE? I'll have plenty to tell you when I've got all the freetime in the world when my customers go to china.

my business also doesn't run on prints and decals alone... so maybe I also have the ability to look at it as if the more my printer is producing for me, the less money its wasting for me and the more time it frees me up to do other, more important, things around the shop than weeding/masking letters. Which is added value to me on its own... and volume only adds to that value.