Screw you 3M.

[Signsforwhile]

Might be a little OT....or maybe bring it back on....recently lost work to a Nissan Dealership / 3M partnership...

Customer has owned Chevy's since they're been a customer with us and decided to give the new Nissan vans a look see. He had told me about this and a couple of weeks later I noticed 4 of them in the customers parking lot that had full color panels in the recesses on the sides and the rear. The artwork was all brand new and pretty terrible.

He told me that 3M had a table with a salesman AT THE DEALERSHIP and took delivery on the vehicles with the graphics on them!! WTH!

Not really upset with my customer because they payed less than the material cost for that job!

 

[OlsonSigns601]

3M needs to give Sally Cook at their corporate office a raise, because she literally sat there and took a verbal beating from me for something she knows nothing about and tried her best to help me.
Waiting to hear back from someone who has knowledge on the matter.

Do you have high blood pressure?

Seriously I envy your shop and think your designs are awesome but man you sound (in text) to be wound really tight in a lot of your posts.

Breath in, Breath out... relax its going to be okay.

 

[HulkSmash]

Might be a little OT....or maybe bring it back on....recently lost work to a Nissan Dealership / 3M partnership...

Customer has owned Chevy's since they're been a customer with us and decided to give the new Nissan vans a look see. He had told me about this and a couple of weeks later I noticed 4 of them in the customers parking lot that had full color panels in the recesses on the sides and the rear. The artwork was all brand new and pretty terrible.

He told me that 3M had a table with a salesman AT THE DEALERSHIP and took delivery on the vehicles with the graphics on them!! WTH!

Not really upset with my customer because they payed less than the material cost for that job!

same thing here. Except my customer was willing to pay more with me, but they wouldn't allow him to get the lease with it.

Bunch of greedy people.. i tell you.

 

[HulkSmash]

Do you have high blood pressure?

Seriously I envy your shop and think your designs are awesome but man you sound (in text) to be wound really tight in a lot of your posts.

Breath in, Breath out... relax its going to be okay.

Honestly.. I'm a pretty collective guy... really.. it takes a lot to get me riled up... I'm typically pretty chill... i guess text doesn't translate well..

What would you do if you lost a job that was 10's of thousands of dollars...and others to this company?

Yes right now, i can feel the blood running through my vains.. i'm wired.

 

[OlsonSigns601]

Honestly.. I'm a pretty collective guy... really.. it takes a lot to get me riled up.

What would you do if you lost a 30,000 DOLLAR job to your supplier?

I can see f's flying.

LOL, I would have to get a real job because that 30k would break me.

I worry when I loose out on a 1k job but I still sleep at night.

You're obviously smart in the business and I'm sure you'll do what needs to be done and I hope contacting 3M is the right step.

One Door Closing always means another door is opening.

But to be pessimistic, it might be a a really crappy door that opens.

 

[mudmedia]

LOL, I would have to get a real job because that 30k would break me.

I worry when I loose out on a 1k job but I still sleep at night.

You're obviously smart in the business and I'm sure you'll do what needs to be done and I hope contacting 3M is the right step.

One Door Closing always means another door is opening.

But to be pessimistic, it might be a a really crappy door that opens.

You loosing 30k and loosing out on making 30k is different. If you had an opportunity to build a relationship with a client and get their business over a course of time and it was 30k in the end and you come to find out you lost not to another shop but to the manufacture of vinyl you buy I am sure it wouldnt go over well.

200 bucks, 1k, 5k, 20k, 100k no matter what it is still wrong and I see and have seen why it has been a big deal.

 

[ProWraps]

sadly, the joke is on the customer as well.

they end up with a CRAPY product with no one to warranty it or support them.

who is going to take care of it when it certainly fails?

the dealership?

3m?

the leasing company?

the crap shop that installed it?

the **** poor designer that designed it?

see what im getting at?

3m has created a convoluted disgrace to our industry all in the name of pure greed. and in the process has spat on every loyal WHOLESALE customer of theirs that bought into their model in good faith as a vendor/manufacturer.

but hey, at least the gov stopped them from having a monopoly on post it notes so it would appear we got 'em where it hurts!

 

[mudmedia]

sadly, the joke is on the customer as well.

they end up with a CRAPY product with no one to warranty it or support them.

who is going to take care of it when it certainly fails?

the dealership?

3m?

the leasing company?

the crap shop that installed it?

the **** poor designer that designed it?

see what im getting at?

3m has created a convoluted disgrace to our industry all in the name of pure greed. and in the process has spat on every loyal WHOLESALE customer of theirs that bought into their model in good faith as a vendor/manufacturer.

but hey, at least the gov stopped them from having a monopoly on post it notes so it would appear we got 'em where it hurts!

Who actually handles the product through original wraps? Customer comes to the dealership orders it which I am glad that car dealerships now are graphics salespeople.

They get the order and turn it into Original Wraps / 3M? 3M prints the graphics and arranges installation with a "certified" shop and the client doesnt know anything about everything that goes on in the back end? DANG seems like a lot of work that the client doesnt even know about.

 

[HulkSmash]

Who actually handles the product through original wraps? Customer comes to the dealership orders it which I am glad that car dealerships now are graphics salespeople.

They get the order and turn it into Original Wraps / 3M? 3M prints the graphics and arranges installation with a "certified" shop and the client doesnt know anything about everything that goes on in the back end? DANG seems like a lot of work that the client doesnt even know about.

Sales guy from 3M or the dealership itself offers to wrap their vehicle and put it into their lease...
at a STUPID low price.. which they can because they make the damn product.
Dealership has 3m print it, and a installer of 3m's choice to install it.. and if they don't use that installer they won't allow it to be added to the lease..From what I've heard a lot of their stuff is also liquid laminated and they claim it's actual laminate.

 

[mudmedia]

Sales guy from 3M or the dealership itself offers to wrap their vehicle and put it into their lease...
at a STUPID low price.. which they can because they make the damn product.
Dealership has 3m print it, and a installer of 3m's choice to install it.. and if they don't use that installer they won't allow it to be added to the lease..From what I've heard a lot of their stuff is also liquid laminated and they claim it's actual laminate.

Ya its obvious they would be cheap cause like you said THEY MAKE THE PRODUCT which is the problem and why its a big deal to me. Even if I havent lost a job yet or they havent impacted me as a business it upsets me that we buy the product and they still think its reasonable to even compete against us. I am not sure how dumb they have to be to even tell you that they arent competeting against your company.

I have seen some graphics from them and they have a different backing. It has the scotchprint tag not controltac so your statement that it is liquid laminated I wuoldnt doubt that one bit as its not the right good material that we use daily.

I also put some blame on the shops that install these graphics for Original. I guess you get money any way you can in these times BUT if the shops continue to install graphics for 3M which is now their competitor they are going to continue.

 

[sar bossier]

Hey, Adam - I would jump on board with any action ya started ... good idea Gino - and Adam IS one of the nicest people you will find, at least on the phone!

 

[Fatboy]

In South Africa 3m will never be able to pull something like that of. We have something called" The Unfair Competition Board" and what they are doing will be illegal here!

 

[SIGNTIME]

well i hope oracal starts making a air release reflective solvent printable vinyl so we dont have to purchase any of 3m's goods

 

[HulkSmash]

well i hope oracal starts making a air release reflective solvent printable vinyl so we dont have to purchase any of 3m's goods

they do....

 

[SIGNTIME]

with rapid air? its not it the fellers catalog

 

[HulkSmash]

they make several with rapid air..

 

[Pinfinity]

Colorado, I just want to express how bad I feel about your dealings with 3M. You are a top shelf talent and a major contributor on this forum. I can certainly understand your deep seated anger and frustration. I hadn't known about this until checking these posts.

There is a reason why your client wants you to do the work and no one else!...But No! can't work that way, your not authorized...makes sense doesn't it!...what BS

 

[JoshLoring]

Wow. I'm for you Colorado. I knew that Original thing was crap. I've blogged about this years ago using 3M IS LIKE BUYING FROM YOUR COMPETITOR.
DON'T DO IT.

 

[HulkSmash]

Just got off a conference call with 3M.
They Do print, and sell vinyl from Original Wraps.. they then outsource an install to a company of their choice, and choose how much we as installers will have to charge. So yes, they are our direct competition. Then if something fails, them, and only them decide who's at fault for the failure of vinyl. (How convenient.) They offered to put me on their list of certified installers just by filling out a forum. Not sure if this is possible for everyone... in anycase...They're looking to stop printing and outsource that as well (Yeah right) We'll see....

still really upset they're printing and have taken customers of mine right in my back yard.

 

[LenR]

I know this may sound lame but when FedEx jumped into bed with Kinko's I stopped using them both. UPS and USPS have been just fine for me.

Leasing companies are every bit as sleazy as 3M and auto dealerships so if you do a good bit of business wrapping fleets just screw them all and start offering fleet vehicle leases. The commission on a lease probably makes the cost of the wraps look insignificant and I'll bet you could get a leasing company to provide a ton of business support.
Imagine the feeling going to the 3M dealership and asking them to quote a fleet purchase and being able to say "Oh, by the way, I'm getting 10 other quotes" because I use to use 3M products.
I'll bet it wouldn't take more than 1 or 2 lost deals for the dealerships to kick 3m's fat _ss so far out of the ball park it.....

Wow, was that a rant?