So Im bidding a job....

[leemajors]

Well, I'm sure I can't be the first to ask this question but if you guys would indulge me for a second, I would appreciate any input.

I'm bidding a job and don't have a lot of time to build thorough estimates. I am interested in seeing what other people would bid on a job like this while still remaining competitive.

The measurements are in one of the images below (if I've attached them properly) Still haven't heard if we have to paint the base coat or if the wall will already be painted. One assistant, have scaffolding...may rent scissor lift.

Thoughts?

 

[Gino]

Are you hand painting the copy onto the existing wall ??

 

[letterman7]

No information - what are you bidding? Painting on the wall, ACM with vinyl? What? And if you don't have time to do a "thorough" bid... maybe you shouldn't be bidding in the first place.

 

[leemajors]

Fair point, thank you for the honesty. Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit. This would be the biggest project I've tackled but it seemed simple enough. They were just pushing me to turn in a bid as quickly as possible.

Sorry for the lame excuse, I just knew this was a good community to touch base with. Still its no reason to be lazy about this. Back to the grindstone.

 

[Gino]

Fair point, thank you for the honesty. Maybe I jumped the gun a little bit. This would be the biggest project I've tackled but it seemed simple enough. They were just pushing me to turn in a bid as quickly as possible.

Sorry for the lame excuse, I just knew this was a good community to touch base with. Still its no reason to be lazy about this. Back to the grindstone.

Sooooo........ can you provide us with any more details ?? Perhaps we can still help you, but you hafta give, too.

edit: at least you got it into the correct heading.​

 

[J Hill Designs]

sounds like a job for the Fall Guy

 

[leemajors]

Lettering
In the past I have used casting vinyl as a stencil on similar jobs, especially is there was a lot of small detail. With this I was thinking it might be just as easy, and cheaper, to print out a black and white hand-cut stencil on a 42" printer that I have. Use 3M adhesive to hold the stencil to the wall, cut the stencil, roll or spray the letter cutouts, then come back and brush in the touch ups and over spray.

The letters are 3ft tall, and run for a total of 69.25 ft...totaling 207.75 sq ft. The bottoms of the letters start at 10ft off the ground. If I used casting vinyl, costing me $5-6 per sq ft (estimating $6) that would be $1250 just for the stencil. With labor, this job feels like $2,500-3k easily. I know Im prolly going to get flamed for such a low bid.

Now if you you take the casting vinyl out of the equation, and printing the stencil not costing me anything out of pocket (having already paid for the paper) I would consider $1500-2k.

The wall looks smooth from the pic, I will drive by the building in a couple hours to see it close up. Im hoping its not some sort of stucco.


The other part of this variable is the base coat, as to whether or not we are going to have to paint it.
If so, I would be submitting the base coating as a separate line item...the wall is 80ft x 16ft tall...totalling 1280 sq ft. Im waiting to hear if we are able to spray the wall of if they want us to roll it. If you say a gallon covers 300 sq ft, I should only need 4.2 gallons. I hesitate to think one 5 gallon bucket will work so Ill add an extra gallon to the bid. Add that to one days pay for 2 workers and Im looking at about $650 with no cushion and just a day rate for myself, nothing on top. 2 coats and I see it going to $800-900 in expenses. In those figures I havent added time to power wash the wall, either...so $1250-$1500(?)




So....should I be approaching this a totally different way, or is this a reasonable approach?

 

[Bretbyron]

Overhead projector w/ transparencies. Trace the line work and go to town painting. All man Hrs. + paint & supplies + Transparencies + design fees & setup.

 

[J Hill Designs]

+1 pounce pattern, project straight to wall, or even grid system

I would NOT spray glue a pattern to the wall

 

[leemajors]

+1 pounce pattern, project straight to wall, or even grid system

I would NOT spray glue a pattern to the wall

I have both a pounce kit and an overhead projector...I do like the pounce method. With spray glue, it does leave a lot to clean up. This job is getting passed to me by a stencil artist, so I was prolly just following his lead in that line of thinking. I think I will pounce this pattern.

As for the pricing...am I in the ballpark? I know there's a fine balance between being competitive and and not underbidding your work.

 

[Gino]

Pouncing the pattern and taping up in sections will work the best.
If you have access to a bucket truck or a lift system, you'll need to add that cost in.
You'll need a second person to help put the pattern up, so count that in.
Placing and pouncing the entire wall will take about 4 hours over such a span.
Cutting and filling in will take a good 8 or so hours. Off a bucket or lift, you can do a letter about every 10 or 15 minutes on average.
Materials, if you buy good paint and fitches will cost you around $ 200.00

Add up your hours, overhead, profit and incidentals and you have the cost of lettering the wall.

Prepping it is another story. Not knowing what it is from block, to brick to metal, I can't help you.
Most likely you'll have to wire brush it, power wash it, let dry for a day or so, prime and then one top coat. A second would be ideal, but most people don't wanna spend the money for proper prep work.

By the sound of things you've said, thus far, I think this project is outta your area of comfort. You realize, when someone gets a wall painted like that, they're gonna want it to last for 7 to 10 years. That means proper prep work, good grade bulletin and lettering enamels and nice straight lines with pointed corners. If it starts peeling because of your lack of know how or cut corners, you'll hafta be good for it.

 

[leemajors]

Pouncing the pattern and taping up in sections will work the best.
If you have access to a bucket truck or a lift system, you'll need to add that cost in.
You'll need a second person to help put the pattern up, so count that in.
Placing and pouncing the entire wall will take about 4 hours over such a span.
Cutting and filling in will take a good 8 or so hours. Off a bucket or lift, you can do a letter about every 10 or 15 minutes on average.
Materials, if you buy good paint and fitches will cost you around $ 200.00

Add up your hours, overhead, profit and incidentals and you have the cost of lettering the wall.

Prepping it is another story. Not knowing what it is from block, to brick to metal, I can't help you.
Most likely you'll have to wire brush it, power wash it, let dry for a day or so, prime and then one top coat. A second would be ideal, but most people don't wanna spend the money for proper prep work.

By the sound of things you've said, thus far, I think this project is outta your area of comfort. You realize, when someone gets a wall painted like that, they're gonna want it to last for 7 to 10 years. That means proper prep work, good grade bulletin and lettering enamels and nice straight lines with pointed corners. If it starts peeling because of your lack of know how or cut corners, you'll hafta be good for it.

...can't really argue with you there. Might be smart to start looking for a local sign painter to take the lead on projects like this while I learn by assisting.

 

[visual800]

I would do a paper pattern, scafolding with no help. I could handletter in 2 days. Prolly charge about $ 2500 2 coats latex semigloss. And after all that still wouldnt get the job lol

when someone is "pushing you for a quote" just walk away because they are not serious. There is no sense in something like this being rushed.

 

[GB2]

Does the bid require that you paint the letters? Why wouldn't you just use cast (not casting) vinyl letters on the wall and be done with it?

 

[Techman]

vinyl letters on the wall and be done with it?

Vinyl is NOT final..

 

[Sidney]

If it's hand painted price should be around....

Scaffolding, total labor, materials and travel....my price is $4500.00. minimum

 

[earplug]

Now if you you take the casting vinyl out of the equation, and printing the stencil not costing me anything out of pocket (having already paid for the paper) I would consider $1500-2k.

Nothing to add on how to do the project but your statement above shows a serious flaw in your pricing logic. Just because you have already paid for materials does not mean it is not a cost to the project. If you expect to survive and make money you need to learn to include all of your cost items when bidding projects.

 

[Jr Douglas Imaging]

why not

why not use calendered vinyl, stencil the wall, paint, remove vinyl and be done. or for that matter use top level cast vinyl and spray non-yellowing clear over the entire area. either way $2500-3K with 5-7 year warranty.

All of which would have to be discussed upon surface inspection. No real warranty can be in writing without inspection

 

[leemajors]

I couldnt remember and had to look up the difference between cast vinyl vs. calendered vinyl, and I'm still not sure other then cast vinyl is generally a little thinner making it easier to mold and calendered vinyl is maybe less expensive but primarily for indoor use. Which I guess is what would make it ideal for stencil use, over cast vinyl. How close am I?

I've used cast vinyl in the past on 2 other projects. After a base coat, and laying out the vinyl, I used a heat gun to sink the vinyl into any rough spots to keep a clean line. Would installing calendered vinyl be that much different?

I'm sure there's gotta be a couple threads on surface prep in these forums. Prolly good to revisit those studies. Thanks guys

 

[Gino]

To make a pounce will cost you next to nothing and be quite easy to apply, while the cost of that much vinyl, weeding it, taping it, putting it on, executing your method of applying paint, taking it all off, patching up all the mistakes sounds ludicrous to me.

 

[player]

When you put it like that it does sound ludicrous.