Thermal vs Inkjet

[Colin]

Colin, It sounds to me like an Edge would be your best bet. If you mostly do boat lettering the gold foil alone would make it a solid choice.

Thanks for that. I've really looked at the Edge, Summa DC4sx, and Inkjets, and feel that an Inkjet will work best for me. I do a lot of boat lettering, but it's not the vast majority of my work, and is best accomplished by good ol' cast vinyl anyways.

The don't appear to take up much room either.

I have decided to make the required adjustments to my shop to accomodate a smaller printer like the VersaCamm/DC4sx. Print quality from an inkjet was a big factor in my choise too.

I don't need a lot of printing done so I use a local shop to do it for me. I pay $4 a square foot for most stuff.

Yes, I've been doing that up to now, but I feel that the time has come to have a printer of my own. Not having control over when I can get a print done has been frustrating, and the high cost of farming out very small jobs. And I will also promote more printed stuff too. And, I will now print stuff that was painstakingly done with vinyl before.


***Anybody know where I can find some info on the "Eco-Sol" fumes/health/ventilation issues?

 

[jeph4e]

Yes, the bias is blatant, but I have to wonder if that is because what they say is basically true, or because it's what they sell.

Both

If you're doing larger stuff or photoshopped textures than the inkjet is "the" way to go. If not, than we think the Edge is better. We used to sell inkjets and get approached constantly to add them to our floor. Don't like inkjet hassle as it gets in the way of getting things done.

Ideally both are required more most business. If you only have a hammer than everything looks like a nail.

BTW: We rent Edges too...

 

[Colin]

Anybody have an answer to my earlier question?:

After speaking with a local guy who had a constant negative experience with the Summa DC4, I've been persuaded to the injket camp. So, what are the ones (brands) to choose from for a "Print & Cut" machine in the 30" - 42" range? (or is the VersaCamm the no-brainer winner?)


Thanks.

 

[Malkin]

I would say that the versacamm is the best all purpose print&cut inkjet choice.

This covers some very basics:
http://www.digitaloutput.net/content/ContentCT.asp?P=542
MSDS found here:
http://www.nusignsupply.com/documents/MSDS/Roland_ECO-SOL_MAX_MSDS.pdf

Apparently it's not recommended to drink it, you may get an upset stomach.


It would seem that most people, including the manufacturer, feel that it is sufficient to have a minimal amount of ventilation (window or doorway occasionally open) rather than a full blown (GET IT? HA!) ventilation system, but that does not constitute proof. Keep researching.

 

[Colin]

Thanks for that.

I have my shop's floor plan all drawn up in my sign program, and I've been noodling with moving things around, and it looks like I could fit a 54" machine in.........just.

Those VS machines are pretty tempting, but boy, pricey! The 42 is also an option in between the 30 and the 54. Oy, it's like a candy store.

It appears that what you get with those over the SP is: Metallic, White, better print quality, and speed. Is that it, or am I missing any other features?

 

[Malkin]

Have you considered if it would be worth adding on some space to your shop? Putting the printer in a separate, clean, room would be advantageous.

42" would be a nice median size. Allows for 3' banners, etc.

 

[tomence]

Have you considered if it would be worth adding on some space to your shop? Putting the printer in a separate, clean, room would be advantageous.

42" would be a nice median size. Allows for 3' banners, etc.

Yeah it is nice but it's got a nice price tag too.

 

[GAC05]

Go for the 54!
One of the benefits that no one has brought up and you would never get from those puny 15" & 30" thermal machines is the workout you get handling 54" media.
Loading and unloading the printer solo with full rolls of 13 oz banner or intermediate vinyl will pack muscle on quick.
Think log drills in basic training.
In short order you will be able to kick sand in the face of any of those small format thermal guys.

wayne k
guam usa

 

[tomence]

Like you gonna load banner material everyday. If this guy was that busy he would've had a printer by now.

 

[Colin]

Have you considered if it would be worth adding on some space to your shop? Putting the printer in a separate, clean, room would be advantageous.

Unfortunately I am presently maxed-out on allowable square footage.

42" would be a nice median size. Allows for 3' banners, etc.

Yup.

 

[Colin]

Go for the 54!
One of the benefits that no one has brought up and you would never get from those puny 15" & 30" thermal machines is the workout you get handling 54" media.
Loading and unloading the printer solo with full rolls of 13 oz banner or intermediate vinyl will pack muscle on quick.
Think log drills in basic training.
In short order you will be able to kick sand in the face of any of those small format thermal guys.

Whoahahahahahahahahaha!

 

[Colin]

Actually, this brings up a good question: Are printing vinyls, banner mat'l, and laminates available by the yard, or does one have to by a full roll?

 

[tomence]

I think you have to buy a full roll. But still there is two lenghts you can get 75 feet or 150 feet rolls of vinyl. For banner material if you go Ultraflex you can get it in 115 or 164 feet rolls. It depends what brand are you buying and also depends on what your supplier carries.

 

[Malkin]

Generally full rolls only, although banner and intermediate vinyls are pretty reasonable, just heavy.

I do get 54" cast vinyl in 25 yard rolls, but not much else is available like that.

 

[Colin]

^^^ Thanks. I'm reminded too that a 54" print is likely to be difficult to physically handle/install for one person - no?

 

[GAC05]

"Actually, this brings up a good question: Are printing vinyls, banner mat'l, and laminates available by the yard, or does one have to by a full roll? "


Like everything else find a good supplier who is willing to work with you.
With us being out in the middle of the ocean our local supplier is willing to
cut down full rolls and also sell by the yard for some items, but not all.
I get some of my digital media from Gregory and they sell short rolls on selected media too - like window perf.

wayne k
guam usa

 

[tomence]

It's not difficult but you need some room to move around with that big roll in your hands.

 

[signmeup]

Actually, this brings up a good question: Are printing vinyls, banner mat'l, and laminates available by the yard, or does one have to by a full roll?

I hinted at this earlier. If you want to print 2 or 3 retractable banners will it be cost effective to buy a 100 yard roll? If not you'll have to sub them out. That would piss me off if I owned a printer. My point is a good sub is worth a lot and maybe you don't really need a printer of your own. Let your sub stock all those different 100 yard rolls. (just throwing out random thoughts here)

 

[Colin]

I hinted at this earlier. If you want to print 2 or 3 retractable banners will it be cost effective to buy a 100 yard roll? If not you'll have to sub them out. That would piss me off if I owned a printer. My point is a good sub is worth a lot and maybe you don't really need a printer of your own. Let your sub stock all those different 100 yard rolls. (just throwing out random thoughts here)

Yes, there's something to be said for that, and that scenerio is what I have been doing for many years, however, there are a few things that have caused me to make the jump.

1) When I sub prints out, I have absolutely no control over the delivery time. This is such a nagging issue that I therefore often direct many jobs to be simplified and done with vinyl instead (those where appropriate), or spend lots of time with layering, weeding tiny text, etc. when it could (should) just be printed.

2) I have never promoted print stuff. With my own printer, I will, and I'm looking forward to sending contour-cut samples to my existing and potential customers.

3) I design for vinyl, and this leaves out all the cool effects that can be achieved with a printer.

4) If subbing out all print work was always the best option, then no sign shop would have a printer. They would all be subbing out to one source.

5) As time goes by, more & more artwork that is provided to us sign makers is of a nature that it must be printed (can't be done with vinyl), so how long do I continue without a printer and slowly being left behind?


So yes, I could continue doing the same old same old, but I think it's time for me to buy a printer.

I appreciate any & all comments though. This makes for good reading for lots of other people in a similar boat.

 

[Colin]

Now that I've narrowed down my decision on what printer to get, can someone please fill me in on the history of the models of the VersaCamm in case I consider a used one?

I'd like to know what years correlate to what model number.

I know the SP300i is the new one.

SP300 - ?

SP300V - ?

etc.

*and what do the letters (like "V") signify? Are there models that are to be avoided, and models that proved to be more reliable & problem-free?


Thanks