Thinking about it.....

[Farmboy]

After reading all these post the only reason I can pick up for you wanting to do this is because some guy that does advertising is making money and for some reason the sign business is going to fill your pockets with cash. Did you notice that the one's here that are successful stated one thing that you didn't. They LOVE this work. That's what working for yourself is about. Is there money to be made here...Yes. Look at some of these guys skills. Check their sites and their work, some of it is fantastic! Can you produce that kind of work to get top dollar or are you just looking at material cost and seeing what some folks are getting and thinking it's easy money?

 

[JK driver]

I have a degree in drafting and illustration. My uncle was an old time sign guy/commersial artist. I learned alot from my uncle working in the sign business. I was a sponge reading everything I could about the sign business. You need some kind of art back ground or just have a real sincere "Love" of this type of work to make it in this business.

In past jobs I have dealt with one of the big franchise shops. The owner was some middle management guy with Wallyworld. He had the money and decided he wanted to be a sign guy. Alot of his stuff is horrible. He can't even put vinyl on a sign straight. And blaims it on the inexperienced help that he hires. Even though he is the owner, and it's all his fault. We had to redo stuff we sub'd to him. Like what was said before this is an industry that you have to be a jack of all trades in. Wood worker, painter, metal worker, artist, hole digger, sales man, and the list goes on and on.

One of the best books you can start with for layout is Mastering Layout, by Mike Stevens.

And when anybody criticizes how easy my job is I quote the most recent Lost in Space movie.

"And the monkey pushes the button".......

 

[GARY CULY]

heres one thing i tell everyone of the HUNDREDS of new people that get a cutter and email me to give them race car templetes ..andllogos and graphics .and anything else they think ijust give to the world for free
where are you going to get customers? i mean after all the "friends" and reletives and neighbors get you some little mailboxes and "cool" stickers for there 4x4's ..wheres all the real money going to come from? your new to the work .so your portfolio isnt going to have much to show..you dont have a complete price list made.."well bout 50bucks i guess"
and almost ALL places of business needing sign work ,have allready a shop that does there work..youll need experience applying decals to a LOT of different vehicles ,glass windows ,boards ,anythiing...you havent knowledge of using and even applying anything yet! so you cant just say sure i can put a 30 ft 6 inch stripe around your boat..just for example ...so please stop a minute and think a year down the road..where is the work going to come from ?
and oh yea .in the next 2 months of YOU getting going ,there will be 50 more newbies comming on here asking the same thing.....im amazed by all the people starting out in a trade that is overpopulated ,filled with hacks ,lowballers ,pirates ...why do they feel they will make money? i dont get it..
i started young 30 years ago when it was still a trade/craft..and im struggling getting work here so i just cant imagine starting out right now ...i know i wouldnt,not with all the competition now
come back in months and report in,i would like to see how your doing sir.
good luck!

 

[MichaelAlmand]

Good call Gary just another one of those deals happening that think they can put up 30,000 for a printer and call themselves a sign or wrap guy with no experience what so ever the type that sell wraps for so cheap. I know e got to start up somewhere but at least most of us had a start working for somebody that has been in the industry for years that we can learn off of. It's a tough competive industry that it seems like ever joe blow is picking up a sign shop in a box.

 

[Fuzzbuster]

Techman.
You are an a******, you wasted your time telling me that.
You have no tact, you have no people skills you have no idea what an ass you just made of yourself.......

You tell me I have no idea what I'm doing and that I need to learn......what exactly were you accomplishing with that statement? All I got out of your useless babble is that I don't need your comments and I don't want your advice. No need to be a a****** to people who are considering trying to better themselves.

carefull !!

many have been banned for less!



theres no need for that

 

[MichaelAlmand]

Geez I didn't even read that! Well Techman does have a point you need hands on experience! Especially in these economic times, you can't learn as you go cause it will strike ya and you'll find yourself wasting a bunch of time and money. If you are seriously interested apply for a job at a DECENT local sign shop and go from there you may even hate doing signs or whatever but this way you won't sink in 30,000 plus in equipment and material to find that out.

 

[cmaxdesigns]

Ponto -

To answer your question: Being happy with what I do and make a decent living doing it is being successful (IMO).

 

[PSG]

Adicreed,

For the record, Techman is one of the most knowledgeable and helpful people on this site. You haven't been "lurking" very long or you would have known that. You were way out-of-bounds with your outburst and comments.

He is telling you something you don't want to hear. HOWEVER, based upon how you came into this thread and site, you just walked in professional group of seasoned signmakers, asked their opinions and then proceeded to question their advice many times. Someone that has a good head for business doesn't do that. So, in some sense Techman was sorta right. He just laid things out there without sugar-coating them.

So if you really want some advice pay attention;

"According to Dun & Bradstreet reports, The failure rate for new businesses seems to be around 70% to 80% in the first year and only about half of those who survive the first year will remain in business the next five years.

The old adage, “People don’t plan to fail, they fail to plan” certainly holds true when it comes to small business success."
Quoted from: Small Business Development Center, Bradley University, Peoria, IL.

Those statistics are not specific to the sign industry, however, almost every sign business that is started by someone with no industry experience or training fails. I would say based upon what I have seen, it is more like 1 out of every 20 people that jump blindly into this industry make it more than 2 to 3 years. (That's a 5% chance, many others here wont even give you that.)

If you want a chance to outlive the statistics and make it in this business, take one of these routes and you will have a fair chance to tread water and maybe you wont be one of the failure statistics.

1)... Go work for someone else in the industry for a minimum of 1 year.
If you want to own or emulate a franchise, then go work for the busiest franchise near you. I would recommend FastSigns because they have proven system that is successful. If you want to do another type of signs or graphics find the best, most successful shop in that type of work near you and go beg for a job. Seriously! My father always told me; "If you want to know how to fix a car, go ask a mechanic. If you want to know how to fix a sink, go ask a plumber." Bottom line, if you want the best education money can't buy, go work for the best in the industry and become a sponge. Then make the leap to go out on your own.

or

2)... Do some research on the Franchises out there.
They are not all created equal. If you really want to jump in feet-first and hit the ground running with no experience, buy a really GOOD franchise. With most of the franchises you get what you pay for. Most of the major players out there cost about the same to buy within about a $40,000 plus or minus. The real difference is in what you pay for royalties, support and annual fees. This amount is usually a minimal difference, because the most expensive, usually FastSigns, has the greatest earnings potential.

or

3)... if you are dead set on doing it on your own, and won't consider options 1 or 2, then do this.
Go do research on FastSigns, Sign-A-Rama and SignsNow. Then call each of them and express and interest in knowing more about each. Meet with the rep from each, go do an "exploritory day" with each of them with your eyes and ears wide open. You will get a pretty good idea of what it is going to take to get something off the ground with a chance to be successful. I can't remember but you may have to put out some money to get involved with "looking" a little deeper with the franchises, but it would be worth it.

Then if you are still going at it on your own, it is because you probably because you object to the money involved with most franchises. So do this; Contact SignManiac. He has responded to you in this thread. He has a franchise concept that might be up your alley that is not as expensive as the others and has some major differences from the others. You may want to do this anyways when you talk to the others for perspective.

Also read Tim's stuff (The Sign Expert) in the Link above; call Jon Ashton to get a marketing plan, then buy and read every magazine and book you can find on signmaking. Then after you have read them, read them again, and again, and again.


That's about some of the best advise any newbie has ever gotten on this site so hopefully you take it to heart and look before you leap, otherwise I'll be looking to buy your equipment and supplies on Ebay in 9-36 months!

Best of luck!

My opinions of franchises are based upon my 18 years of experience in this industry having worked for both a FastSigns and a Sign-A-Rama in that time and Recently pursuing the options of buying a franchise from many different franchiseors. I am not employed by any of the a fore mentioned companies or do I receive any compensation from them. These opinions are based upon my metro market and may vary from market to market.

 

[Pat Whatley]

Isn't it about time Fred starts deleting posts like this one? We get at least one a week and they ALL degrade into the newbie getting his feelings hurt and calling people a*******. Maybe we could just compile all the questions, answers, smart-assed comments and links into one permanent post and direct them there and avoid the trouble.

Adicreed, there is NOTHING you've mentioned, asked, or done that you couldn't have learned with a 15 minute trek through the newbie forum with the exception of Dan Striker's posts. Your biggest problem is your lack of design ability. Your in the Atlanta area, there's a sign shop about every 100 feet. Without design ability and without knowledgeable solutions to sign needs you're stuck with only being able to compete based on price. Do you really want to compete on price with people selling full color banners for $2 per square foot or $999 van wraps? You'll work yourself to death going broke.

Trust me, everyone that's responded knows what they're talking about...we see this all the time. You need the skill set to do the job before you ever think about opening your own shop.

and a "franchise" opportunity that gives you two weeks of training and then puts you out on your own is ridiculous. That's not a "franchise", that's somebody selling equipment.

 

[signage]

Most likely the guy that has this franchise is making his money off of selling the franchise and commissions from the equipment, not the earning from the franchise agreement! Like said earlier most franchises resell several times before someone finally get it right and running profitable, and the franchisees make money on each sale!

 

[Gino]

Isn't it about time Fred starts deleting posts like this one? We get at least one a week and they ALL degrade into the newbie getting his feelings hurt and calling people assholes. Maybe we could just compile all the questions, answers, smart-assed comments and links into one permanent post and direct them there and avoid the trouble.

No, I don't think so. I believe we need these essays for proof that this stuff happens so routinely. No one in their right mind would believe this crap if you told them. I would rather see someone compile all of these types of threads into a category and make it mandatory for each and every new member read these and take a written test on this information before they are allowed to post. Besides all that, there is quite a bit of good information in many of these threads. Just the OP usually doesn't listen to anything except the tooting of their own horn. Heck, it can't be all that hard... I can learn it in two weeks...... :ROFLMAO:

If people consider lurking a way of gaining knowledge before joining and this place... and this is the results of their findings.... it only proves many of these people can't read and evidently can't communicate........ and what is half of this job all about ?? COMMUNICATION.

Nah, let it alone and allow things to take their natural course and let Fred do more important things. He shouldn't need to be bothered with this crap.

 

[SignManiac]

+1

 

[ddarlak]

i think you should go for it.

you'll stimulate the economy with your equipment purchases, and in a year when your sick of it, somebody will get a good deal on used equpiment.

 

[Pat Whatley]

Just the OP usually doesn't listen to anything except the tooting of their own horn.

You mean "original poster" or "old paint"?

Actually, it doesn't matter, it fits either way.

 

[Bigdawg]

adicreed... if you are still out there....

If you want to cuss out the member? Go find NHB and have at it. But not in an open forum... and if I see another comment like the goat one I just deleted out here... we gonna have issues. Bigtime. If you can't read the forum rules.... then how are you going to read the manual for the equipment you don't know how to use?


Now to your post...

You know nothing about signs... you got a cousin that can screen print... and "knows a thing or two about signs and banners." Well whoopdedo for you.

You got some most excellent advice (Go Dan!!) and instead you focus on one of our members that was less than helpful... but pretty well-respected within our community. If you only want flowers and hugs when you post... you might not be in the right place. Ain't gonna happen.

But if you want people that will tell you how they REALLY feel about your post, then you have to take the good with the bad. Why on earth would you expect a group of sign professionals to not ask about the training or knowledge you might have that would give them a glimmer of hope that you really do know what you are about to jump into? You think if the equipment is there, damn... the rest must be easy as pie. I got a news flash for you... it's not.

I've been in graphic design for thirty years... learned from good people that made me feel like the most ignorant person there was while I was learning... but I would bow down and kiss their feet today for providing me the good basics and standards that make me do what I do at a higher level than some hack who can type their name in a program, pick a font (say... comic sans for example) and call themselves a designer.

When I started doing signs... even with all my background... I sucked pretty bad on the first few. It's a different world... a different type of design. And you seem to think you can walk in with NO knowledge of what it takes before you hit the print button and you'll be just fine. I beg to differ. That's arrogance at it's finest and an insult to those of us that took the time to learn how to do it right.

So I would advise you to take the good advice that's been offered and think about what you're doing and how little you know about it. We can give you all kinds of equipment advice, but we can't make you a signmaker.

 

[Gino]

Yeah Pat.... on occasion they are interchangeable, but here I meant the 'Original Poster'.

 

[iceracer]

If I my ask, what does NHB stand for?
Thanks.

 

[Bigdawg]

No Holds Barred... or "Where the Wild Things Are"

A place that religion, politics and profanity wander through hand-in-hand. It gets ugly. It gets nasty... and it's the only place on this board that profanity is allowed.

 

[Gino]

It's a place of angelic serenity where all hearts are mended and then melted into one... as in the universe.

A circle is perfect, but the world isn't round. ​

 

[iceracer]

OK, got it, thanks.....T.