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Rant Ugh New 570, New Problems!

Sign.ed

Sign.ed

New Member
Maybe it may just be a loose QC process. We have run 2.5K square meters through our machine in less than three months and haven't had any issues beyond the known 16.4x.10 error. HP tech installed a different firmware on our machine that doesn't shut down the machine when the 16.4x error is thrown. There is a rumored firmware patch that should be around any day now to fix that though.
 
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ColoPrinthead

Guest
repair an HP?! I thought your were just supposed to toss them in the dumpster when they act up, they are disposable printers.
 
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Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
Sign.ed said:
Maybe it may just be a loose QC process. We have run 2.5K square meters through our machine in less than three months and haven't had any issues beyond the known 16.4x.10 error. HP tech installed a different firmware on our machine that doesn't shut down the machine when the 16.4x error is thrown. There is a rumored firmware patch that should be around any day now to fix that though.
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We are at 10,000sqm on the first machine that is down in 8 weeks and we are at 2,400sqm since June 29th on the machine getting the pump errors.
 
PrintTrader

PrintTrader

Merchant Member
First of all, I want to thank you for keeping this post updated as the project continued and you kept having new issues with the printer(s). I enjoyed following your posts and I'm sure many others here did also. But the question I have in mind is......at the end of the day, are you satisfied with how it all went? The reason I ask - and I'm not suggesting anything or selling anything - is because I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't have been easier to just use a big wholesaler to have done all this printing. In hindsight, would you use a wholesaler if you had to do it again, or are you happy with the process and the project and wouldn't change a thing?

Again, I want to make it clear that I have no agenda with this question - I'm just curious to know what the answer is. Thanks!
 
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CanuckSigns

Active Member
PrintTrader said:
First of all, I want to thank you for keeping this post updated as the project continued and you kept having new issues with the printer(s). I enjoyed following your posts and I'm sure many others here did also. But the question I have in mind is......at the end of the day, are you satisfied with how it all went? The reason I ask - and I'm not suggesting anything or selling anything - is because I can't help but wonder if it wouldn't have been easier to just use a big wholesaler to have done all this printing. In hindsight, would you use a wholesaler if you had to do it again, or are you happy with the process and the project and wouldn't change a thing?

Again, I want to make it clear that I have no agenda with this question - I'm just curious to know what the answer is. Thanks!
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I'm not the OP, but he mentioned that there were some large upcoming projects as well, I would imagine if the jobs are lined up it would make more sense to do the work in house, if it was a one off project it may make sense to farm it out and not have to deal with the hassle, but for ongoing jobs it makes total sense to keep it in house and not have to be at the mercy of a wholesale company.
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
The long and the short of it is we looked at outsourcing it and it wasn't worth the cost vs risk. We had great margins doing it in house and was able to pay for lots of new equipment and still pocket a healthy profit.

We have another order that is starting to process now for 4 times as many rolls. Again the prices we are getting for full and partial outsourcing is over 2.5x what our in houses costs are.

To answer your question we are satisfied with the project and machines in general, we push their limits and they punch through to the end before giving up the ghost.
 
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CanuckSigns

Active Member
2CT Media said:
The long and the short of it is we looked at outsourcing it and it wasn't worth the cost vs risk. We had great margins doing it in house and was able to pay for lots of new equipment and still pocket a healthy profit.

We have another order that is starting to process now for 4 times as many rolls. Again the prices we are getting for full and partial outsourcing is over 2.5x what our in houses costs are.

To answer your question we are satisfied with the project and machines in general, we push their limits and they punch through to the end before giving up the ghost.
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Do you have any concerns with the longevity of the latex machines you have processing jobs that large? it seems like orders of that size should be done on heavy duty grand format machines that are setup for running millions of sq/ft through them.

Unless you're deadlines on the job aren't super tight and you can afford to have the machines down while they are repaired?
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
CanuckSigns said:
Do you have any concerns with the longevity of the latex machines you have processing jobs that large? it seems like orders of that size should be done on heavy duty grand format machines that are setup for running millions of sq/ft through them.

Unless you're deadlines on the job aren't super tight and you can afford to have the machines down while they are repaired?
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For this job it was a tight deadline but we worked 16hr days 7 days a week and up until the break down it was 2 weeks ahead of schedule. Since the break down we are now only 4 days ahead of schedule.

For us we looked at the 1500 but it's roughly the same speed, only $.03 per ml cheaper on ink and it wastes more material and takes 3x longer to load. For a price of $200,000 with dual roll we can buy 8 of these 570s. We sub our over-sized banners out due to finishing requirements so the 10' was no benefit to us. If push came to shove we could have another printer in 3 days which would limit down time.
 
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Sign.ed

Sign.ed

New Member
2CT Media said:
For this job it was a tight deadline but we worked 16hr days 7 days a week and up until the break point is was 2 weeks ahead of schedule. Since the break down we are now only 4 days ahead of schedule.

For us we looked at the 1500 but it's roughly the same speed, only $.03 per month cheaper on ink and it wastes more material and takes 3x longer to load. For a price of $200,000 with dual roll we can buy 8 of these 570s. We sub our oversized banenrs out due to finishing requirements so the 10' was no benefit to us. If push came to shove we could have another printer in 3 days which would limit down time.
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For that kind of cash I'd be looking into a direct printer rather than only being able to only print soft substrates on a 200K machine. I agree, a fleet of 570s was the way to go.
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
Sign.ed said:
For that kind of cash I'd be looking into a direct printer rather than only being able to only print soft substrates on a 200K machine. I agree, a fleet of 570s was the way to go.
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That's pretty much the conclusion we came too also. Hopefully soon the mythical hybrid will be released.
 
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nate

New Member
2CT Media said:
For us we looked at the 1500 but it's roughly the same speed, only $.03 per ml cheaper on ink and it wastes more material and takes 3x longer to load. For a price of $200,000 with dual roll we can buy 8 of these 570s. We sub our over-sized banners out due to finishing requirements so the 10' was no benefit to us. If push came to shove we could have another printer in 3 days which would limit down time.
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I'm not sure what HP was doing with the 1500. It seems out of place. If you're going large you might as well get the 3200.....
 
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nate

New Member
2CT Media said:
That's pretty much the conclusion we came too also. Hopefully soon the mythical hybrid will be released.
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A few years ago we had a contract with a cell phone screen protector company. It was the same logic. These were rolls of 24" wide material. HP wanted us to get a LX800. Can you imagine two 24" rolls on a 126" machine? And losing 10' per load? And taking 15-20 minutes to load each one? Instead we purchased 14-15 L25500 units, ran them 18 hours a day, had a personal service rep from HP (well not really, but he was there almost daily to keep our fleet in good shape), and made a killing. We were able to re-up the contract several times until the client moved to Ohio.

Anyway, I'd say your logic is great (but we did end up getting the LX800, and the 3000, and a couple of smaller latex machines over time to keep up with other things). Sometimes it pays to have a fleet!
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
nate said:
A few years ago we had a contract with a cell phone screen protector company. It was the same logic. These were rolls of 24" wide material. HP wanted us to get a LX800. Can you imagine two 24" rolls on a 126" machine? And losing 10' per load? And taking 15-20 minutes to load each one? Instead we purchased 14-15 L25500 units, ran them 18 hours a day, had a personal service rep from HP (well not really, but he was there almost daily to keep our fleet in good shape), and made a killing. We were able to re-up the contract several times until the client moved to Ohio.

Anyway, I'd say your logic is great (but we did end up getting the LX800, and the 3000, and a couple of smaller latex machines over time to keep up with other things). Sometimes it pays to have a fleet!
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Yes certainly, having those bigger machines is our ultimate goal... But we need space first and there are other more pressing equipment purchases before them. It comes down to labor for me, labor is more expensive than machine time and if it takes the same time to print but more labor and the machine costs more there is just no benefit. This is why the OCE is so intriguing if they can get it right.
 
GAC05

GAC05

Quit buggin' me
On the plus side of owning an HP fleet your social media contacts list should have the entire HP midwest support division on quick dial.

Good to hear with the scope of issues you are dealing with that you are still making money.

wayne k
guam usa
 
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chafro

New Member
You really should be thinking about the big printers. One 3000 is way easier to manage and maintain and needs way less labor than 15 570's. Also the 3000 will need less space . And having 15 HP printers, What a tech nightmare!! That's 90 HP print heads that need to be working good!!!


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