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"Vector Art" brand clipart Versus "Bee-Line"

Discussion in 'Clipart, Vehicle Templates and Digital Files' started by ColorFast, Nov 4, 2006.

  1. ColorFast

    ColorFast New Member

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    More specifically, I'm trying to do a cost/benefit analysis b/w the Vector Art Mega Collection (Disc 1 And 2---available together for $200) and Bee-Line 4.0 (a collection of over 30,000 images b/w images for around $550). I'm looking for a package that will be used primarily for print only and perhaps in the future for cut jobs. Does anyone have experience with either of these collections? Are the catalogs they come with well organized and do they correspond logically w/ the Cd's? This was a major issue w/ my old "Master Clips" collection. The graphics on the Bee-Line demo are very well done and I'm leaning toward that one? Any suggestions or additional collections I should look into? Thanks in advance.:help:
     
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  2. iSign

    iSign Major Contributor

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    I love vector art & have owned some of it since before the mega collection came out.

    As soon as Mega collection came out, I bought that & have felt that it paid for itself quickly & many times over at this point.

    I also bought the Mega Collection 2 from Fred's site & the VectorArt Mega digital print/cut collection ( which you should be aware of, if you're not already)

    There is a mega collection 3 on the near horizon & I have little doubt I will want that as well.

    With that said, I will confess to knowing far less about what beeline has to offer. I can say that one huge advantage of vector art, over other clip art collections is that there are no surprises when you want to cut vinyl. The folks who put together the collection understand our industry & the work is all "ready to cut"

    Other collections often have hidden lines that are concealed by white fills that result in the appearance of line art... but require some, or even lots of work before it can be used for cutting.

    If you are only printing, then this feature which adds a lot of value to VectorArt products for many of us, may not add as much value for you right now.
     
  3. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    There is no simple answer to your question ... particularly since you evidently consider the artwork in Master Clips to be something worthy of consideration. But to be fair, I would also point out that I am a clipart developer and publisher as well as a reseller of the Vector Art line.

    So here's the more complicated answer:

    You should consider how you want to use the work and what the needs of your clients are. Vector Art is largely art created by sign artists. It includes massive amounts of what I term "design elements". There are also generous helpings of vehicle graphics, illustrations and so forth. My understanding of Beeline is that it is primarily intended for print advertising ... and on looking through its contents I can easily conclude that it does not serve the needs of a commercial sign shop as well as Vector Art Mega 1 and 2 Collections. Another shortcoming, IMHO, of Beeline is that it is developed in Denmark and some of the work reflects that flavor ... which may make it less useful in a US setting. Master Clips, Art Explosion and the bulk of the packages sold in retail environments is best described as art mill output. At one time a company known as Graphic Products Corp. in Los Angeles was cranking out more than 20,000 new images a month. That output and others like them have been mostly gathered up and absorbed by companies like IMSI and Hemera. Another player you are not including is Clipart Design whose work is pretty reasonably priced and is all vinyl ready. Its shortcoming is that it is all produced in Eastern Europe by non-sign people who reflect the images of the world around them and not the North American experience.

    On the issue of vinyl-readiness, Vector Art is 100% vinyl ready. Beeline is partially vinyl-ready. Art mill output is rarely vinyl-ready and also has poor technical quality due to having been made into WMF format before being resaved in EPS format. This means you have a gazillion nodes on every vector as a result.

    Ease of use and documentation on both Vector Art and Beeline are okay but both suffer from the need of the publishers to protect themselves from illegal duplication. The files are named in such a way as to be heavily tied to the book. You are one of many who is coming to realize that too much time and business gets lost searching for images in many books all in the name of "saving money" by owning your own art libraries. Your needs will be far better served by learning who has what at online sites specializing in well developed search engines and immediate downloads of what you are in need of at the moment. Some of these sites sell subscriptions and some just sell by the image. All will save you a great deal of time and expose you to a far greater selection of art than buying CD and DVD collections. Here's a few links to sites offering individual images:

    ExpressClipart.com


    Clipart.com

    Artzooks.com

    Fotosearch.com

    Shutterstock.com

    istockphoto.com

    ExtremeClipart.com

    ActionIllustrated

    MR Clipart

    Finally, I have to wince at the price you were quoted for the Vector Art Mega Collections. These collections each carry a suggested retail price of $299.00. They may be legal copies with a 67% discount being offered as an inducement to buy something else at the same time. Or they may be illegal copies where the artists and publisher are being cheated out of their fair return. If they are legal, then that's a great price for almost 12,000 vinyl ready images.

    From my perspective as both a publisher and a sign business owner, I think most buyers focus too much on the price of the collection or the indivdual image instead of how quickly they will recover the investment and how much return on investment they will ultimately receive. It really isn't about the price ... it's about the quality, suitability and ease of locating and using the image(s).
     
  4. Pro Signs & Graphix

    Pro Signs & Graphix Very Active Member

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    The Vector Art wins hands down. The VA collection is compliled with the consideration of sign makers BY sign makers (or artists with knowledge of the industry). The other collections are basically bastardized.

    Are the other collections junk, not really, but as Fred points out - they were not intended for this industry. Selling these collections to the sign industry is just another method used to keep revenues flowing. That makes a difference when it comes to using them. When you have to go through too much unsatisfactory stuff, to find that "one" - you will tend to shy away from even looking. Time is money.

    With that said, and the the presence of www.expressclipart.com, why would you want to buy any collection anyway? Buy what you need, when you need. Double, triple, even quadruple your outlay. It is far more profitable for you that way. Most of us that have collections have them because that was the ONLY way you could get anything. As a matter of fact, Roland did at one time sell individual images - until their distributors got pissed off, and rightfully so. Collections are a thing of the past.

    Fred - I too have seen the VA collection for $200, many times. It varies as to who and where. Maybe a loss leader, or maybe to keep volume up (if there are such requirements - don't know) - but they are there. NO seller offers what you offer, ie: individual images, and the publication of truly individual artists. Your new service is far more advantageous to a buyer, avoiding the huge outlay of cash - for that "one" image.
     
  5. mladams7259

    mladams7259 Very Active Member

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    Doug why are you not interested in buying the VA mega 3 collection if the first two were so profitable to you? I myself own both VA mega collections and they are wonderful! Everything is perfect for vinyl. I have not came across any images that need "tweaking" to cut correctly. I do not own any bee-line but I have used some of their clipart and have had to modify them slightly (take out a few nodes) to make them work right. But either would be alright. I recommend VA.
     
  6. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    For the information of all interested:
    • ExpressClipart.com is now fully licensed to sell individual images from any of the Vector Art collections. It is a slow process getting all the images online but they are now beginning to appear.
    • I have no argument with those who prefer to have CD collections in house. We continue to sell dozens of Vector Art collections every month.
    • Mega 3 is currently scheduled for a January release. We will begin taking advance orders once we have a reasonably assured ship date on the new work.
    • A street price of $200 is actually a bit high for either collection. The street price seems to have settled into the $149 to $159 range. A price of $200 for both collections is at or near dealer cost (discounts vary with volume).
    • We stock and sell the new Vector Art Mega Digital Collection but it does not yet appear on my allcompu.com website. The content can be seen at the vectorart.com website.
     
  7. iSign

    iSign Major Contributor

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    ..ahhh caught by the old double-negative trick eh?

    my choice of words does not always flow into the ears & minds of others as easily as the sequence of words arrange themselves in my mind or on my keyboard (how's that for a self-substantiating sentence?) ...but when I wrote "There is a mega collection 3 on the near horizon & I have little doubt I will want that as well." ... I meant I WILL WANT IT AS WELL!
     
  8. ColorFast

    ColorFast New Member

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    For the record, Masterclips sucks and I would have never used it if it was not the only program available at my previous employer. And Fred, not to lose you any business but I found the Vector Art Collections at Beacon Graphics website for $199 +shipping for the set. Seems too good to be true (http://www.beacongraphics.com/vector-art.html). But now that I'm thinking a/b it, it does make a lot sense to use a site like yours and just pass the cost of the art on to the customer. However, I can definitely see the value of having the art on hand (i.e. for doing multiple layouts etc.). Thanks for the input.

    P.S. How many messages to I have to post on this thing b4 I'm known as something other than a preschooler? Uggh. i suppose it suits me though
     
  9. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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  10. Hollywood

    Hollywood Member

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    I agree with you'll to a certain point. All of the art is great and ready to go, but there is alot of things I go to that book for that sre not there, sinple clips. One, a up to date newer model rollback(wrecker). 2, there are way to many flower, borders, scrolls. 3, alot of cartoon drawing that most people don't want. There may be some good one's in there and I do use it don't get me wrong, but I think it could be better. just my opinion.
     
  11. Vallentin

    Vallentin New Member

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    Thank you for commenting on our brand Fred, I would like however to correct some of the incorrect information you provide.

    First of all it is not true that we are not sign makers. I myself as the founder and the Art Director of Clipart deSIGN owned a sign shop and did a lot of sign work. Here you can see some pictures of what I have done with my own hands:

    http://www.signforums.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=17532&hl=

    http://www.signforums.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=17612&hl=

    http://www.signforums.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=17613&hl=


    The guys in our US office are sign makers as well. And what we do and design has nothing to do with Eastern Europe. In fact we do not sell our Products in Eastern Europe, because there is nothing in our collections that reflects East European environment and thinking. We develop our products together with our US team and we make sure we offer what the US market demands.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Mar 6, 2007
  12. iSign

    iSign Major Contributor

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    unlike many other forums, Fred set this forum up to maintain integrity in the posting of images in a thread by uploading them right to the signs101 server. It appears that your links may not work for those of us not participating, or logged in at that forum. They are all dead links for me.

    Please click on the "Go Advanced" button & then find the "manage attachments" button to upload your images where we can all see them.
     
  13. Vallentin

    Vallentin New Member

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    Thanks for pointing this out. I have attached some images. Here are some more. These are some branded clocks, electric signs and some 3 Dimensional letters.
     

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  14. Techman

    Techman Major Contributor

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    Can't see the images at signforum. And since I am not considered worthy because of this..
    I probably will not be able to ever enjoy your work. Yes that is your rules and so be it. Hot mail is my email system and has been for almost a decade. It is stable while the other PAY systems have come and gone. If that makes me less desirable then so be it.
     
  15. ChicagoGraphics

    ChicagoGraphics Major Contributor

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    I have a dumb question....What does IMHO stand for, I see it alot in these post.
    Thanks
     
  16. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    Perhaps that is changing but the items my sales manager and I looked at from Clipart Design when we were considering carrying your line had, in our opinion, a distinct Eastern European flavor.

    I'm not sure if you noticed, but I did recently post a link to your free sample downloads.
     
  17. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    FWIW ... In my humble opinion

    TTYL :Cool 2:
     
  18. Vallentin

    Vallentin New Member

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    Thanks for your reply Fred. Perhaps what you are referring to is the Sports collection. And on this one I will agree with you about the Eastern flavor on SOME of the images. It is because this collection was not initially designed to be used by us, but was created for a third party and was made in a hurry. It definitely needs a good clean up and is the only one we are not proud of.

    However would be sad to judge over 50 000 images and over 80 thematic collections on the basis of perhaps 500 images all contained in the Sports collection.

    Thank you also for linking to our free clip art database. I would like to hear your opinion on our new Ultimate Icons, Symbols and Logos MEGA PACK :thankyou:
     
  19. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    Wearing the hat of clipart developer, publisher and reseller, I would say, on surface, that it seems like a great value.

    Wearing the hat of a sign business owner and clipart user, I do not see any great appeal for the kinds of needs I have.

    My biggest concern is the amount of time it will take me to find a selection of images for a job. I have $1,000's tied up in published CD and DVD collections that sit unused or barely used. I recognize, from a marketing point of view, that huge collections are easier to sell ... but that does not necessarily make them better.

    It really is about the usefulness and commercial appeal of the content and the ease of locating it. At my Express Clipart site, we are beginning to see a pattern emerging. There, my 906 Plotter Art Originals images and 417 from Stevo Design are outselling 6500 images from Vector Art Mega Collection by a factor of 2 to 1.

    Something to think about.
     
  20. Vallentin

    Vallentin New Member

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    Thanks Fred. I appreciate your comments. What you say would be true if the quantity is at the expense of quality. What we decided to do is to proof wrong the saying that quantity, quality and low cost can not abide together. They can if someone is willing to pay the price to make it happen. And we are paying this price with very hard work, top notch know-how and being generous when we decide our pricing.

    The package we are talking about comes with 330 page full color offset printed hard copy catalog (boxed version) and the electronic version comes with the same catalog as PDF. With this catalog takes 2-3 minutes to locate the visual style, the thematic collection and the design you like to use.

    You tend to say that quantity is bad because takes more time to select. This means that one better go to a small local store where there is very little choice to buy an item instead of going to a big shopping center or a Walmart where you have plenty of choice and a better price.

    Another thing is that we have a completely different approach to the market. We do not follow the pattern set by the general use clip art companies (Nova, Hemera, etc.) and Vector Art - making collections with little bit of everything. Instead we build thematic oriented collections with a lot of the same theme. For an example - let us take flames, or ornaments. If one would need a flame design or an ornamental design, what would be better for his business? To search for his item among very few images or among thousands of images and dozens of visual styles?

    Something to think about.
     
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