what do you hate about your software?

[signmeup]

It doesn't really work that way. For example, I typed the word "Helvetica," set it in Helvetica bold. I changed Corel's type units to inches and sized the lettering to 12". I converted the text to curves and broke it apart. Select the "H". It's only 8.616" tall. Not 12" exactly like it would be if I had done the same thing in Flexi.

Corel is doing the very same thing Illustrator does: applying the size to the letter's "em square" rather than the letter itself. In Flexi if you select some lettering and size it to 12" the letter "H" in that "Helvetica" example will be 12" tall.

Not only would I like to see CorelDRAW and Illustrator allow users to spec letter sizes in inches, I'd also like to see options for positioning the letters from the baseline and cap heights rather than the outer limits of the em square. Sizing things based on em units is fine in page layout when you're dealing with points, picas, etc. But it doesn't work so well in sign design.

I don't change the type units to inches. I just click on the text and type how big I want it in the object size box. The same one you use to size a rectangle. It makes the text exactly the size you type in. (I'm a sign maker too, so this is useful to me)

 

[Bobby H]

That's not a perfect solution either. If I select "Helvetica" and size it at 12" in the Transformation dialog box the letter "H" is really only 11.656" tall. The way the lower case letters dip below the base line alters the overall size.

Dedicated sign making programs I've used (Flexi, CASmate, NeonWizard, etc.) all allowed the user to spec letter sizes according to the actual cap height of the letters. No re-sizing needed.

I can type a letter "H" by itself in CorelDRAW and size it up to 12" in the transformation dialog box and it will be pretty close when converted to curves, 11.997" actually. I have to scale it up 100.02500625156289% to get it exactly at 12".

I used to have an Adobe Illustrator script that would allow me to resize type according to cap height (and do so in inches), but I can't relocate it.

 

[TyrantDesigner]

What about those 3 shapes in the stroke dialog box? It says align stroke, 1 click. Those do what you are speaking of, unless you mean something else?

that is part of it. there are also times when you say have custom strokes or transparency fills or even masked items when you need to have the stroke centered or inside but behind the item. screenshot is the area to tweak that ... unfortunately ... if you have multiple fills you need to change the order of fill and stroke seperately. corel can do that with a selected group of objects like the second screenshot. illustrator wins with the ability to do multiple strokes on an object and as i said earlier ... to be able to do custom strokes that make corel seem like a joke ... but just WAY more steps than are needed in illustrator.

 

[signmeup]

That's not a perfect solution either. If I select "Helvetica" and size it at 12" in the Transformation dialog box the letter "H" is really only 11.656" tall.

Well... it's a hell of lot closer than 8.616"!


Figured out how to do it for you. Type the H. Make it 12" with the "object size box". Finish typing the text. It will all be the same point size. Easy, peazy. You don't need no steenkin' script.

 

[Custom_Grafx]

I don't like how there is no measurement tool in Illy as there is in PS.

In PS, I don't like how you cannot label measurements in the measurement tool menu!

 

[The Vector Doctor]

I don't like how there is no measurement tool in Illy as there is in PS.

In PS, I don't like how you cannot label measurements in the measurement tool menu!

try the info box

 

[Bobby H]

I use an Illustrator plug-in from Telegraphics called "Path Area" to accurately measure lengths and areas of vector paths. It's pretty handy for computing things like tube lengths in neon designs or tool path lengths of nested objects for routing.

Figured out how to do it for you. Type the H. Make it 12" with the "object size box". Finish typing the text. It will all be the same point size. Easy, peazy. You don't need no steenkin' script.

The approach works okay for typefaces that have squared off baselines and cap heights, such as Helvetica or Times. Plenty of other typefaces have many parts of characters dipping below baselines and rising above cap heights. Most script faces do that. Type setting functions like those in Flexi, or at least a custom sizing script like the one I mentioned in Illustrator is necessary to accurately set the cap height in terms of inches.

People who just eye-ball everything into place may not care about setting letter sizes to exact specifications. I like to do this (as well as place things specifically) both in terms of making layouts better looking, more consistent and organized. It's also important if you have to revisit the artwork years later and modify certain things. If you know the type was set to some specific unit you'll be able to replace elements of text more easily even if they've been converted to curves/outlines.

 

[Mainframe]

The problem with that method is that of the function needed -- try this example:

- select a word or phrase in a paragraph with the text tool (let's say it is Times, Bold, 14 pt)
- choose the eyedropper from the tool bar, and then click on some other, differently styled text (let's say it is Helvetica, Heavy Condensed, 24 pt).
- the highlighted text will change from Times... to Helvetica...

if you were to hit the Escape key the text after selecting the Times text as above the text would not remain highlighted.

-g-

just hit (on a mac) command, option, shift, m & the text stays highlighted is that what you want?

 

[Mainframe]

Personally I don't like buttons. I am much faster with short cut keys rather than moving my cursor all over the screen clicking buttons. It requires more hand/mouse/pen movement on larger screens.

+1

 

[Joe Diaz]

just hit (on a mac) command, option, shit, m & the text stays highlighted is that what you want?

Can you tell me where that key is located on my keyboard? If I could find it, I have a feeling that would get a lot of use here. :Big Laugh

 

[signmeup]

The approach works okay for typefaces that have squared off baselines and cap heights, such as Helvetica or Times. Plenty of other typefaces have many parts of characters dipping below baselines and rising above cap heights.

No... it doesn't work "OK"... it works perfectly on any typeface.

You said you wanted to size text, accurately, in inches based on the height of the capital and have the rest of the letters be the correct size. I showed how it can be done easily without any trial and error or changing anything to curves.

It doesn't matter one wit if the other letters in the typeface are taller or shorter than the various caps. In fact, the font designer made them that way on purpose. My method retains the original typographers intent. Now you seem to want all letters to be the same height whether they are supposed to be or not. Do you plan on simply squashing the tall ones or reducing their size proportionately?

 

[Mainframe]

Can you tell me where that key is located on my keyboard? If I could find it, I have a feeling that would get a lot of use here. :Big Laugh

just like any typo we catch on a sign that hasn't left yet--never happened

 

[heyskull]

I hate my sign/design programme will not read my customers (empty!!!!) mind and create it into something they thought they wanted!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SC

 

[Bobby H]

It doesn't matter one wit if the other letters in the typeface are taller or shorter than the various caps. In fact, the font designer made them that way on purpose. My method retains the original typographers intent. Now you seem to want all letters to be the same height whether they are supposed to be or not. Do you plan on simply squashing the tall ones or reducing their size proportionately?

You still don't understand what I'm talking about.

Do you have access to a dedicated sign making application like Flexi or Gerber Omega? If you did you would see the very obvious differences in how these programs size lettering versus that of CorelDRAW or Adobe Illustrator -applications really only designed for setting type in points based on the overall size of an em square. Sign design programs do not work like that.

A digital typeface's built in cap height is often different than the size you will see in a transformations dialog box when merely selecting a letter. The sizes will be pretty similar if you're working with a gothic, sans-serif typeface. If you're working with display faces, scripts or other odd ball fonts the lettering may fall well below the baseline and rise above the cap line. CorelDRAW and Illustrator don't give the user much to work with in this regard, just the baseline and overall em space.

In short, you can run into a problem if a client says, "I want Vivaldi Script set 2 inches tall with 1 1/2 inches of space between the lines," and they want it set how a dedicated sign design program would size and space the lettering. There's no way to do that properly in CorelDRAW. You might get in the ballpark with how Flexi would size Vivaldi at 2" but you would still be noticeably off with the proper sizing.

 

[The Vector Doctor]

Here is a visual to what Bobby is saying. The green boxes are all 2 inch. The letter height of every one of these letters is 144pt = 2 inches. None are 2 inch tall cap letters and they even vary from one to the other. So even if you figured out what a 2 inch letter should be in points, the letters will change from one font to the other

 

[signmeup]

You still don't understand what I'm talking about.

Do you have access to a dedicated sign making application like Flexi or Gerber Omega? If you did you would see the very obvious differences in how these programs size lettering versus that of CorelDRAW or Adobe Illustrator -applications really only designed for setting type in points based on the overall size of an em square. Sign design programs do not work like that.

A digital typeface's built in cap height is often different than the size you will see in a transformations dialog box when merely selecting a letter. The sizes will be pretty similar if you're working with a gothic, sans-serif typeface. If you're working with display faces, scripts or other odd ball fonts the lettering may fall well below the baseline and rise above the cap line. CorelDRAW and Illustrator don't give the user much to work with in this regard, just the baseline and overall em space.

In short, you can run into a problem if a client says, "I want Vivaldi Script set 2 inches tall with 1 1/2 inches of space between the lines," and they want it set how a dedicated sign design program would size and space the lettering. There's no way to do that properly in CorelDRAW. You might get in the ballpark with how Flexi would size Vivaldi at 2" but you would still be noticeably off with the proper sizing.

Yeah... I have Flexi and it's pretty easy to size text to 2". Just click 2".

 

[andy]

You still don't understand what I'm talking about.

Do you have access to a dedicated sign making application like Flexi or Gerber Omega? If you did you would see the very obvious differences in how these programs size lettering versus that of CorelDRAW or Adobe Illustrator -applications really only designed for setting type in points based on the overall size of an em square. Sign design programs do not work like that.

A digital typeface's built in cap height is often different than the size you will see in a transformations dialog box when merely selecting a letter. The sizes will be pretty similar if you're working with a gothic, sans-serif typeface. If you're working with display faces, scripts or other odd ball fonts the lettering may fall well below the baseline and rise above the cap line. CorelDRAW and Illustrator don't give the user much to work with in this regard, just the baseline and overall em space.

In short, you can run into a problem if a client says, "I want Vivaldi Script set 2 inches tall with 1 1/2 inches of space between the lines," and they want it set how a dedicated sign design program would size and space the lettering. There's no way to do that properly in CorelDRAW. You might get in the ballpark with how Flexi would size Vivaldi at 2" but you would still be noticeably off with the proper sizing.

If I want the word "Helvetica" to have a cap H height of EXACTLY 25mm all I've got to do is type in the capital H... lock X & Y scaling and punch in 25mm. Then it's merely a case of reselecting the text tool and typing in "elvetica".

If I want two "Helvetica" words spaced exactly 15mm apart on two lines simply duplicate with 0.0mm offset and then jog the duplicate down 40mm (letter 25 + space 15).

Corel will do just about anything.. it's how you ask that makes the difference.

 

[signmeup]

Here is a visual to what Bobby is saying. The green boxes are all 2 inch. The letter height of every one of these letters is 144pt = 2 inches. None are 2 inch tall cap letters and they even vary from one to the other. So even if you figured out what a 2 inch letter should be in points, the letters will change from one font to the other

For Corel, I still say, "Type the first letter, make it 2" then finish typing the text" Not as easy as Flexi but still.... pretty easy.

 

[The Vector Doctor]

For Corel, I still say, "Type the first letter, make it 2" then finish typing the text" Not as easy as Flexi but still.... pretty easy.

So you are saying in Corel every font ignores what I posted? Not sure how that is possible but I have not used corel since v10

You say that if you punch in 2 inch tall letters, then it is the same height as a 2 inch square in every font?

It never works that way in Illustrator

 

[The Vector Doctor]

nope

not in corel 10