Which is the best option for a backlit white acrylic sign?

[petepaz]

bolder text with more kerning. they are going to bleed together at a distance (i think this was already mentioned)

 

[TimToad]

In the original, the words seem uncomfortably crowded. More margin would help them, as has been mentioned. Stacking could help as well.
Honestly, though, if the original design was done by a plastic surgeon, he or she didn't do too bad.
Light-face letters seem to be popular among many people these days. Light-face strokes on sign work, however, can be weak.

Bobby mentioned "overglow." This is also called "halation." Light tends to spill beyond the edges of letters on a lighted face, encroaching on the inter-letter spacing. This often calls for wider letter spacing to preserve legibility.
Also, a light colored letter looks thicker on a dark background anyway, so wider spacing can be beneficial for this reason, too.
This optical illusion, that a light letter appears bigger, is also why the dark background has an advantage over the light background on this sign—it helps the skinny letters a little.

In my examples below, all the lettering is beefed up. And I've added more margin.

Having spent years back-spraying lighted signs like this, the third one would easily require twice the hours in the spray booth due to the need for multiple masking. Of course, a digital print eliminates that problem. It just doesn't last as long as paint.

Also, when I draw renderings like this, I usually show the retainer on the drawing, though I didn't in my sketches here. I am assuming the original design above is depicting the "visual opening" only. A typical retainer will cover an inch and a half of the face's edge and, of course, must be accounted for in the design.

Brad

My only quibble with your concepts are that in an effort to beef up the weights, the grace and intended modernity of using a lighter, extended version of Helvetica is lost and the layouts seem really dated.

 

[signbrad]

My only quibble with your concepts are that in an effort to beef up the weights, the grace and intended modernity of using a lighter, extended version of Helvetica is lost and the layouts seem really dated.

This is a good point. And in keeping with that idea, the probable best solution may be to scrap the round format and replace the sign altogether with a new one in a shape that fits the composition better—a rectangle.
This is an example of the proverbial square peg/round hole conflict. It is what, as I recall, Mike Stevens referred to as conflicting rhythm.

Of course, replacing a "perfectly good" sign cabinet with a new one is not the cheapest option. So this may be more of a sales challenge rather than a design challenge?
But remember that plastic surgery is not cheap, either. Surely a simple facelift could easily pay for a new sign.
I would expect a surgeon to not be a cheapskate, trying to cut corners (I know that sounds like a bad pun). And the clientele that plastic surgeons attract are people that enjoy, I'm guessing, higher incomes as well. So the money is probably available. The trick would be getting them to turn loose of it.

 

[TimToad]

This is a good point. And in keeping with that idea, the probable best solution may be to scrap the round format and replace the sign altogether with a new one in a shape that fits the composition better—a rectangle.
This is an example of the proverbial square peg/round hole conflict. It is what, as I recall, Mike Stevens referred to as conflicting rhythm.

Of course, replacing a "perfectly good" sign cabinet with a new one is not the cheapest option. So this may be more of a sales challenge rather than a design challenge?
But remember that plastic surgery is not cheap, either. Surely a simple facelift could easily pay for a new sign.
I would expect a surgeon to not be a cheapskate, trying to cut corners (I know that sounds like a bad pun). And the clientele that plastic surgeons attract are people that enjoy, I'm guessing, higher incomes as well. So the money is probably available. The trick would be getting them to turn loose of it.

Another consideration is to get a better idea of the sight line distances and determine just how far away the average viewer may be seeing the sign from. It seems like the photo originally shown is the worst case scenario from as far back in the mall as one could get.

 

[visual800]

Thank you all for your inputs.
Client doesn't want us messing with there logo "too much". I do like the idea of extending the white block out though.
We'll be doing a "double strike" on clear vinyl with lamination. May or may not cut out the white areas. It would reduce the risk of bubbles showing thru.

Sometimes when we do signage for clients we have to "mess" with their logo in order for the finished product to work for that particular signage. Once you get this sign up and that "box" lights up and they cant read Plastic Surgery you will be redoing it UNLESS you make note of the suggestions you made and they did not follow

 

[kcollinsdesign]

The location of a sign in those circles is just plain stupid. Why not allocate space for channel letters in a sign band above the windows (which is probably the original intent of the architect). Then you could layout the business name in a readable size. You could add the "B" if you wanted to.

 

[Gino]

The location of a sign in those circles is just plain stupid. Why not allocate space for channel letters in a sign band above the windows (which is probably the original intent of the architect). Then you could layout the business name in a readable size. You could add the "B" if you wanted to.

B I N G O !!!​

 

[myront]

Customer comes back today and says try these options
"Lose the box and make text white and bolder"
Another option "Plastic Surgery on two lines"
If you had just trusted the professional we would had this all hashed out a lot sooner!

p.s. I'm not even convinced this is a backlit sign. I was in the same plaza one dark night picking up a pizza and none of those areas were backlit.

 

[Gino]

So, you didn't go up in the crawl space to see what's back there, huh ?? Quite possible, you won't even be able to run electric to it. In this case, was anything presented to the actual Mall Owner(s) ?? They might not allow a sign in that spot, then everything's for naught.

 

[myront]

We're updating/replacing graphics we put on the same panel not more than 6mos ago. Had no complaints with that one.

 

[firehouseneon]

I have a similar question along this line.. We are making an outdoor backlit sign with translucent vinyl applied. For the acrylic which white should we use 7328, 2447 or 2406? The vinyl will be illuminated from behind with neon. I have read people use 7328...but was also told that 2406 is ideal

 

[signbrad]

The industry standard has always been 7328 in Plexiglas. I don't remember the Acrylite equivalent.
You want to avoid seeing the tubing through the plastic, which can sometimes happen with the more translucent whites.
On the other hand, a dark translucent vinyl on the first surface may change things. It may be worth experimenting.

One of our less experienced guys once ordered 2447 for faces with LED backlighting. It looked ridiculous. Like there were Christmas tree lights in the cabinet. You could plainly see every lamp. The lettering was practically illegible. The goal is even light distribution and no shadows.

Brad in Kansas City

 

[MikePro]

+1 to comments regarding illuminated white cabinets with copy overlaid are horrendous.
The white will always glow brighter than any vinyl applied to the face, and content becomes blurry at a glance.

the blue background option would be ideal because their logo POPS when illuminated, but if they're set on a white background then i sometimes suggest adding a blockout layer of black or trans. grey vinyl to the backside so that the white is dimmed and the trans. vinyl logo glows BRIGHT.

 

[firehouseneon]

Thanks SignBrad

 

[China signage Maker]

backlit. do a lighting letter or lighting box ?