Dibond to Stucco with liquid nails?

[Techman]

All i can say is...

Gag me with a spoon. I'm getting too old for this stuff.

If its holes he is worried about,, then whats worse.. Holes or gorilla puke?

Liquid adhesive yuk.
It's still la jack leg install. Stucco will peel off. The glue will peel off. Studs drilled into a proper fixture will never fall off.

 

[inthesignbiz]

Fasten it to the wall with magic.
Put it up and tell it to stay.

Using a glue is going to leave a terrible mess when the sign comes down - either by itself or if a new tenant moves in.

Do you have sign ordinances where you are?

Here, you have to tell the city exactly how the sign is to be fastened to the wall before they will give you a permit.

If I even mentioned liquid nails, they would laugh me out of the office after revoking my contractor's license.

Be safe, use metal fasteners.

 

[Steve C.]

I've been a signMAKER for nearly 50 yrs. My experience as a sign INSTALLER
amounts to digging post holes and pounding in a few lead shields in cinder
block walls. Please don't confuse the two. Just because you may know
sign installation, doesn't make you a signmaker. Just needed to point that
out.

 

[1leonchen]

Not sure what his problem with drilling holes could be, but if he is conserned
with the holes being there if the sign is removed. I would rather deal with
filling the holes than cleaning off any adhesive that might be used.[/QUOTE]

agreed

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

yeah i'm with a few of the above posters and feel like i am beating my head against a wall with posts like this.

if the problem was that the building owner didnt want visable fasteners that is a whole different issue than the question that you asked

I have a client that says absolutely no to drilling or screwing into their exterior parking garage wall. We have a 12"Hx60"W direct print dibond sign that needs to be adhered above a 15' entrance. Is there anything besides liquid nails???

so which is it the customer doesn't want holes in the building or he doesn't want visable fasteners?

what frustrates me is that LONG after you have dealt with this challenge that you were facind and we all chime in with the proper answer someone else will dig this question up utilizing the search tool in the future to answer a question that they are facing..and you didnt ask the right question apparently and no one is clear on what you were asking by the answer you have posted. . . your solution in my opinion STILL is not the proper way to have mounted this sign.

sadly there are many places in this great country of ours where you do not need a contractors license to hang a sign, there are places in this coutnry where you don't even need a permit. when ppl see me harping on uniform codes for our industry it is situations such as this that make me feel the way i do.

 

[Gino]

Hear..... Hear!!

 

[uneedasign]

I do this all the time. Modern parking garages are made with post tension cables inbeded in the concrete. If you happen to hit one, you are out of business. I use clear silicone, and double sided tape. The tape holds the sign in place while the silicone drys.

 

[T-Square_WPB]

The client does not want to see any screws/fasteners at all, and at first would not allow us to drill into the wall for placing the base. We got approved to drill/screw into the wall to mount the bases, but will still have to adhere the dibond signs with a liquid adhesive.

 

[T-Square_WPB]

I do this all the time. Modern parking garages are made with post tension cables inbeded in the concrete. If you happen to hit one, you are out of business. I use clear silicone, and double sided tape. The tape holds the sign in place while the silicone drys.

I just got back from talking with a sign installer and he told me the same thing!

 

[T-Square_WPB]

yeah i'm with a few of the above posters and feel like i am beating my head against a wall with posts like this.

if the problem was that the building owner didnt want visable fasteners that is a whole different issue than the question that you asked

I have a client that says absolutely no to drilling or screwing into their exterior parking garage wall. We have a 12"Hx60"W direct print dibond sign that needs to be adhered above a 15' entrance. Is there anything besides liquid nails???

so which is it the customer doesn't want holes in the building or he doesn't want visable fasteners?

what frustrates me is that LONG after you have dealt with this challenge that you were facind and we all chime in with the proper answer someone else will dig this question up utilizing the search tool in the future to answer a question that they are facing..and you didnt ask the right question apparently and no one is clear on what you were asking by the answer you have posted. . . your solution in my opinion STILL is not the proper way to have mounted this sign.

sadly there are many places in this great country of ours where you do not need a contractors license to hang a sign, there are places in this coutnry where you don't even need a permit. when ppl see me harping on uniform codes for our industry it is situations such as this that make me feel the way i do.

I apologize if the question was not specific enough for you to formulate an answer correctly. The main issue in the beginning of this was the client absolutely did not want us drilling/screwing into the structure. He also did not want to see metal fasteners of any kind. This lead me to post the question here. While my sign making abilities far out weigh my install abilities, I'm willing to learn by asking questions. Even if they are ignorant questions to some. We have decided to install several of the signs (which are 11x17 on 1/4" dibond) with double stick tape and liquid nails. The two signs above the garage entrance are 12"x65". These we will install a base using tapcons and adhere the sign to the base with liquid nails. The client agreed to this because I brought up the safety and liability issues with using adhesive on an uneven surface. Which is a point someone here brought up.

For all that asked, yes, all permits have been pulled and city codes will be followed. The question I posed was only for two signs out of 32 we will install. While I agree codes should be followed for reasons of safety, I don't agree with rants towards someone trying to learn.

Couple of points, one being the thought that this thread would not educate someone on a question they have is absurd. Any and all information can educate you somehow. If nothing more they could learn to give every piece of information they have when asking questions. I've had several people "chime in" with advice that was very useful to me. Secondly, if answering this type of post makes you feel like your beating your head against that wall, then don't. Move on to another thread. The beauty of this is you don't have to answer every post. Do you sit and watch TV programs you don't like? Of course you don't, you change the channel because you have a choice to do so.

Thanks for the replys!

PS - I just checked...this site does offer spell check.

 

[Just Another Sign Guy]

no you are the one coming here for help. take the time to formulate a proper question and say thank you.

this is a basic installation and it firghtens me to the core that an installer is having to ask this question, it tells me that you are not qualified to do the job. why does this bother me? because our industry has been overrun by people who do not know what they are doing.

and even with all of the advice you have been given you are still installing these signs in an inproper way.

myself i sleep much better at night with mechanical fasteners knowing that my signs will not fall off and at the very least i will not have an unhappy customer because some teenager yanked a sign off the wall, or worse that it fell and hurt someone or that it failed because someone before you did not paint the building correctly (as the only bond you have is between the paint (stucco uneven surface at that and the back of your sign) and you are using the worst adhesive that you could for this project. i can accept not using mechanical fasteners on an 11X17 sign if it was not overhead, and the customer insisted that it was installed without fasteners and i would have him sign away all of his rights to complain about anything but it would definitely not be my first choice in a parking structure on stucco with over 20 yrs of experience and yet to experience an installation failure i will stick to my technique.

my biggest pet peeve has got to be when posters come back and tell you the rest of the story. take the time to post the details of your project if you want an answer instead of making people pry information out of you or worse when you dont get the answers you want add more info hoping that people tell you what you want to hear...wild. the only thing you should have said was 'thank you'

 

[Gino]

Ya know Dan.....

You can only beat your head against a wall so many times, before you realize you should be banging someone else's head against the wall LOL

An easy google and search about liquid nails will tell anyone of it's capabilities.​

Anyone coming here and asking for hints, advice and other issues is only kidding themselves when 2 or 3 out of 20 agree with you and the rest have sound reasonable advice and because it's not what the OP wants to hear... just dismisses it.

I knew this for years, but just reconfirmed it by googling Liquid Nails. They do not have an exterior product that works on any metal products. That's been a well known fact in this industry for decades, but someone says they do this, that or whatever and it's viewed as gospel and wallah... another hack is born.

Sleeping good is something that doesn't come easy as you get older... trust me, but if you don't have the weight of doing half-baked jobs.... at least that won't keep ya up at night.

Dan, let's talk some more about that other topic.... you know...... ​

 

[T-Square_WPB]

no you are the one coming here for help. take the time to formulate a proper question and say thank you.

this is a basic installation and it firghtens me to the core that an installer is having to ask this question, it tells me that you are not qualified to do the job. why does this bother me? because our industry has been overrun by people who do not know what they are doing.

and even with all of the advice you have been given you are still installing these signs in an inproper way.

myself i sleep much better at night with mechanical fasteners knowing that my signs will not fall off and at the very least i will not have an unhappy customer because some teenager yanked a sign off the wall, or worse that it fell and hurt someone or that it failed because someone before you did not paint the building correctly (as the only bond you have is between the paint (stucco uneven surface at that and the back of your sign) and you are using the worst adhesive that you could for this project. i can accept not using mechanical fasteners on an 11X17 sign if it was not overhead, and the customer insisted that it was installed without fasteners and i would have him sign away all of his rights to complain about anything but it would definitely not be my first choice in a parking structure on stucco with over 20 yrs of experience and yet to experience an installation failure i will stick to my technique.

my biggest pet peeve has got to be when posters come back and tell you the rest of the story. take the time to post the details of your project if you want an answer instead of making people pry information out of you or worse when you dont get the answers you want add more info hoping that people tell you what you want to hear...wild. the only thing you should have said was 'thank you'

Sorry for the delay. Been extremely busy with new projects!

We installed 9 11x17 signs using double stick tape and liquid nails LN-203. (Gino, perhaps you need to learn to use google a little better. There's a whole section on lquid nails adhereing to masonry and metal). The larger 65" sign we installed the base then adhered the dibond sign to base using the LN-203. I've been back twice and trust me, these signs aren't going anywhere.

If you go back you will see I did say thank you in advance for responses. As for the formulation to the question, I'll be sure to include all info I have for our older crowd.

Our industry is evolving with many new and exciting "toys". Accept that there are now new techniques and products at our disposal. we don't have to stick with the same ole way of doing things. This thinking will get you left behind! And I believe there are more "know it alls" in this industry than there are people who don't know what they are doing.

Sorry you that pesky pet peeve of yours. But honestly, that's your problem. As I mentioned before, if you don't like the post, don't answer it, move on. You live in America, you have that right

And Gino, one thought for you. Before you decide to mention beating someones head against that wall, get to know that person a little better. There's always someone bigger and badder on the block than you...

Puppies and Sunshine!

 

[surf city]

Gino........there's someone on da block bigger and badder than you????? C'Mon really?

 

[CanuckSigns]

Sorry for the delay. Been extremely busy with new projects!

We installed 9 11x17 signs using double stick tape and liquid nails LN-203. (Gino, perhaps you need to learn to use google a little better. There's a whole section on lquid nails adhereing to masonry and metal). The larger 65" sign we installed the base then adhered the dibond sign to base using the LN-203. I've been back twice and trust me, these signs aren't going anywhere.

If you go back you will see I did say thank you in advance for responses. As for the formulation to the question, I'll be sure to include all info I have for our older crowd.

Our industry is evolving with many new and exciting "toys". Accept that there are now new techniques and products at our disposal. we don't have to stick with the same ole way of doing things. This thinking will get you left behind! And I believe there are more "know it alls" in this industry than there are people who don't know what they are doing.

Sorry you that pesky pet peeve of yours. But honestly, that's your problem. As I mentioned before, if you don't like the post, don't answer it, move on. You live in America, you have that right

And Gino, one thought for you. Before you decide to mention beating someones head against that wall, get to know that person a little better. There's always someone bigger and badder on the block than you...

Puppies and Sunshine!

Now i'm not a member of the "older crowd" I'm 26 year old and Have been in this industry for about 5 years. I would think twice before dismissing any info given to me from someone who has been making signs for longer than i have been alive.

The truth of the matter is that an installation is only as strong as it's weakest link. So even if you used screws to fasten the bracing to the wall, you still used liquid nails to fasten the sign to the bracing!

LN-203 is a 2 part epoxy according to the website, my experience with 2 part epoxys is that the DO NOT EXPAND, CONTRACT, OR MOVE at all, which won't be good when your DiBond sheet expands at a different rate than your bracing.

A screw is pretty old technology, but I would still trust it more than any chemical bond on the market for this application.

 

[SignManiac]

I find that using both adhesive along with fasteners, is cheaper insurance than my premiums would be after being sued by someone unfortunate enough to be standing under a sign I installed that had fallen off killing or maiming some poor nun who just happened to be in the wrong place at the right time. Thirty six years and no accidents yet.

 

[KetchikanSignpro]

i believe you could find a way to hide all your screw/bolt heads and have no reason to use an adhesive... if i do use a adhesive i use mirror-mastic

 

[signgal]

this made me laugh... just left a job site where the other guy used only liquid nails to attach .040 aluminum signs to outdoor walls, including stucco finish. I just shook my head as we passed the signs that fell off and informed the potential client we would be using screws with painted heads to match. Period.

 

[T-Square_WPB]

Gino........there's someone on da block bigger and badder than you????? C'Mon really?

Yes, REALLY! You're from the shore, you should know. :U Rock:

 

[T-Square_WPB]

Fact is we gave the client what they wanted, signs up with no metal fastener's. The signs are holding, client happy and we received payment. I'll monitor the jobsite checking the status of these signs and I WILL continue to offer this method to clients with similar projects. Large signs, yes, will absolutely go with metal fastener's.